Zwift training for beginners

5CHULZY

Just signed up to zwift to see what it's all about and happy enough with what I've seen. I want to use it to help with cycling up hills so will start some of the programs.

This is where I really struggle, I can manage 100km averaging 25kmh but as soon as a hill comes up, that's my downfall.

I'm using a fluid trainer with a ant+ speed and candence sensor fitted and using the heart rate from my garmin watch all connected to my phone.

I've checked all my previous rides and the estimated average power has been around the 120W mark.

I done a ftp ramp rest today and its says I'm at 286W.
I'm 6'4 and weigh 100kg give our take a few kg

Now I know these are only estimated figures but I really want to increase my power output, I want to be stronger at climbing hills

I assume that the best thing will be to do intervals so I done one today struggled to keep at 210W for 5 mins after the 4th set

Do I just keep doing them and doing as much as I can during the session and hopefully improve.

I can test my progress with a 30km trip along clontarf and up around howth and back. My quickest time is 1hr 07 mins

Sorry for the long post and hope it makes sense. Any advice would be much appreciated

Chips Lovell

These numbers don't look right. If your FTP is 286 you should have no problem holding 210 for five minutes even after four reps.

Before we go any further. Do you have a power meter on your bike and does your turbo trainer measure power? The reason I ask is because you post mentions "estimated average power" and Strava only lists that when there is no power meter used. Estimated average power is a very vague guess and no use for training purposes.

I know this is about Zwift, but I found TrainerRoad better for improving power output.

Less interesting than zwift, but if you have a specific goal and aren’t interested in racing your mates around Manhattan then it is really good.

Tony04

Dont bother looking at estimated power with strava it's just nonsense.

8 x 4 minute intervals are probably the best for increasing vo2 max, so yeah you'll see improvement granted your going hard enough.

Just going to guess your new to cycling? If your are anything you do you will see benefit from. My advice would be to rack up miles for the rest of lockdown and do some hill reps around howth as high intensity is the most effective way of training. Then after lockdown join a club and start racing which would be a good goal to work towards.

At 100kg hills are going to be a bit more difficult for you but then you will probably have a much stronger sprint. If you want to improve at hills longer intensive efforts will help you lower your weight although if you naturally more on the bulkier side which you probably are at 6 ft 4 where as if you feel more suited to sprinting shorter 30 second intervals would help you improve at that.

5CHULZY

Chips Lovell wrote: »

These numbers don't look right. If your FTP is 286 you should have no problem holding 210 for five minutes even after four reps.

Before we go any further. Do you have a power meter on your bike and does your turbo trainer measure power? The reason I ask is because you post mentions "estimated average power" and Strava only lists that when there is no power meter used. Estimated average power is a very vague guess and no use for training purposes.

I dont have a power meter. Just a fluid trainer with speed sensor on rear wheel hub and candence sensor on crank arm.

I did the ramp test first then waited around half hour and done the interval session. Legs were a little shakey.

This what Im concerned about that. That I dont have the power in my legs for climbing.

5CHULZY

Tony04 wrote: »

Dont bother looking at estimated power with strava it's just nonsense.

8 x 4 minute intervals are probably the best for increasing vo2 max, so yeah you'll see improvement granted your going hard enough.

Just going to guess your new to cycling? If your are anything you do you will see benefit from. My advice would be to rack up miles for the rest of lockdown and do some hill reps around howth as high intensity is the most effective way of training. Then after lockdown join a club and start racing which would be a good goal to work towards.

At 100kg hills are going to be a bit more difficult for you but then you will probably have a much stronger sprint. If you want to improve at hills longer intensive efforts will help you lower your weight although if you naturally more on the bulkier side which you probably are at 6 ft 4 where as if you feel more suited to sprinting shorter 30 second intervals would help you improve at that.

I'll ignore any power from strava from now on. And I know without a power meter any figures in zwift will not be accurate

I'm happy for my size as I workout in the gym as well. Would like to drop down to 97kg and the most. So I understand that I will not be the fastest up the hills but sometimes my legs just struggle.

Only been cycling a out 9 months now, but was please to be able to reach the 100km mark. Just want to improve my hill speed

Jimbo789

Your power to weight ratio is important for climbing so both increasing your power and losing weight will increase it.

Tony04

5CHULZY wrote: »

I'm happy for my size as I workout in the gym as well. Would like to drop down to 97kg and the most. So I understand that I will not be the fastest up the hills but sometimes my legs just struggle.

Only been cycling a out 9 months now, but was please to be able to reach the 100km mark. Just want to improve my hill speed

If you want to have bulky arms and torso your never going to be the best you can be up hills to be honest as said it's about power to weight.

At the same time quad gym work is one of the best ways to increase on bike power.

Going up hills isnt about producing really high power it's more so about being able to sustain a decent power. So use your low gears, if you have a cadence sensor your cadence should be doing 80-100 rpm. But generally when your pushing up climbs your heart rate should be around your max not legs sore while your not relatively out of breath.

But as I said starting out literally your going to see improvements every ride.

5CHULZY

Will definitely focus more on legs in the gym when I can get back.

Would a couple of sessions on the trainer and a couple of trips up to howth, with 1 50-70km ride a week be enough.

Can I do the 2 trainer sessions in 1 day? Or is that 2 much

Reality_Check1

Im very new to cycling so take everything I say with a pinch of salt. I only started just before COVID lockdown happened so roughly 3 months on the bike. I love hills though and the following is what's working for me;

1. Just ride your bike - my fitness is improving the whole time and making me stronger when I come to hills during my spin. I try to pick routes that have flat and steep sections

2. Lose weight - Ive gone from 109kg to 97kg (im only 5'10 ) and its made a massive difference most noticeable when trying to drag my fat arse up hills

3. Get proper gear - had my bike fitted with clipless pedals and I wear proper cycling gear now which I feel is dragging me back less

4. I got a HR strap - this is probably just mental for myself but when Im really struggling on a climb and I see I haven't maxed out my HR I just grind harder because I know its in there

5. make sure to eat properly so you don't hit the wall half way up a climb

Im not really worried about power or anything (yet) but in the few months Ive been on the bike Ive literally halved by PB for going up the Howth side of Howth hill so if you're a beginner like me maybe you can take something from this

5CHULZY

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

Im very new to cycling so take everything I say with a pinch of salt. I only started just before COVID lockdown happened so roughly 3 months on the bike. I love hills though and the following is what's working for me;

1. Just ride your bike - my fitness is improving the whole time and making me stronger when I come to hills during my spin. I try to pick routes that have flat and steep sections

2. Lose weight - Ive gone from 109kg to 97kg (im only 5'10 ) and its made a massive difference most noticeable when trying to drag my fat arse up hills

3. Get proper gear - had my bike fitted with clipless pedals and I wear proper cycling gear now which I feel is dragging me back less

4. I got a HR strap - this is probably just mental for myself but when Im really struggling on a climb and I see I haven't maxed out my HR I just grind harder because I know its in there

5. make sure to eat properly so you don't hit the wall half way up a climb

Im not really worried about power or anything (yet) but in the few months Ive been on the bike Ive literally halved by PB for going up the Howth side of Howth hill so if you're a beginner like me maybe you can take something from this

You could say I have all the gear but no idea 😂😂

It's great to see a other person enjoying the benefits of cycling.

I definitely feel fitter myself and really enjoy pushing my self to ride further. Think I will concentrate on howth and and set a 30km time trial for myself

Tony04

What's your goal? Start racing or better strava times up howth etc.

Theres no need for a trainer unless the weather's not great which shouldn't really matter at the moment.

If your doing a structured week take at least 1 day off or not doing something strenuous, and take 1 day long and easy whatever is long for you. Or if you want to go hard all week take your 4th week easy.

Reps up howth hill, would be good for building vo2 max. You can do whatever reppage you want 6 x 4s 5x 5s etc, but personally as theres no racing at the moment I just go hard a couple of different ways up and take it easy on the downs.

If you want to do sprint reps get up early and use the cycleway.

Training plans on strava are good rough guides if you have premium but theres plenty of stuff awash online.

Tony04

5CHULZY wrote: »

Think I will concentrate on howth and and set a 30km time trial for myself

If your setting a 30k tt go up on a long spin around north county dublin as you dont have to constantly stop, although I usally find I rider faster in a group.

If you focusing on howth it's just repetition really.

Reality_Check1

Tony04 wrote: »

If you want to do sprint reps get up early and use the cycleway.
.

I went out there at 5:30am 2 weeks ago because I wanted to go hard and do the "out and back" Strava segment on the cycleway :pac: (its a 10 mile TT)

5CHULZY

Tony04 wrote: »

What's your goal? Start racing or better strava times up howth etc.

Theres no need for a trainer unless the weather's not great which shouldn't really matter at the moment.

If your doing a structured week take at least 1 day off or not doing something strenuous, and take 1 day long and easy whatever is long for you. Or if you want to go hard all week take your 4th week easy.

Reps up howth hill, would be good for building vo2 max. You can do whatever reppage you want 6 x 4s 5x 5s etc, but personally as theres no racing at the moment I just go hard a couple of different ways up and take it easy on the downs.

If you want to do sprint reps get up early and use the cycleway.

Training plans on strava are good rough guides if you have premium but theres plenty of stuff awash online.

My plans for this year were to enter a few triathlons will the aim of an ironman next year. Obviously no races this year so training was kinda non existent at the start. Will probably do 4 days of cycling. Working shifts will make it difficult to but will try my best to stick tonit

5CHULZY

Tony04 wrote: »

If your setting a 30k tt go up on a long spin around north county dublin as you dont have to constantly stop, although I usally find I rider faster in a group.

If you focusing on howth it's just repetition really.

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

I went out there at 5:30am 2 weeks ago because I wanted to go hard and do the "out and back" Strava segment on the cycleway :pac: (its a 10 mile TT)

Its bang on 20km from mine to sutton junction and back. Would love to try it with nobody on but dont thinkni would get up that early 😂

Tony04

5CHULZY wrote: »

My plans for this year were to enter a few triathlons will the aim of an ironman next year. Obviously no races this year so training was kinda non existent at the start. Will probably do 4 days of cycling. Working shifts will make it difficult to but will try my best to stick tonit

Yeh if you doing tris then 2/3 days a week of going hard round howth is the most rewarding in terms of time spent to results. Though I'd try and get 1 or 2 base mileage rides in around north dublin on the weekends or Wicklow during the week(dont go up in weekends) to build up endurance

5CHULZY

Tony04 wrote: »

If your setting a 30k tt go up on a long spin around north county dublin as you dont have to constantly stop, although I usally find I rider faster in a group.

If you focusing on howth it's just repetition really.

It's just a 30km loop for me up and around howth. Was thinking nice a steady to start with as warm up to get to the bottom of howth and then go flat out up to top of howth. The best I've done is 12 mins. Not great I know but if i tell myself it's only 12 mins of work I'll be ok. Recover coming back down and round to sutton and then sprint the last 10km back home

Tony04

Reality_Check1 wrote: »

I went out there at 5:30am 2 weeks ago because I wanted to go hard and do the "out and back" Strava segment on the cycleway :pac: (its a 10 mile TT)

Fair play I've been trying to get up early to get up that early to go on a mtb ride around howth cliffs without any walkers but haven't been able to make that happen and probably wont

5CHULZY

Tony04 wrote: »

Yeh if you doing tris then 2/3 days a week of going hard round howth is the most rewarding in terms of time spent to results. Though I'd try and get 1 or 2 base mileage rides in around north dublin on the weekends or Wicklow during the week(dont go up in weekends) to build up endurance

Have a couple of routes around north dublin, including howth at the start and around to malahide. Done a few into Wicklow as well.

This being my most recent into Wicklow, was a nightmare on the climbs but really enjoyed it even if it was slow. Still managed do do howth after 90kms 😁😁😁
I had a friend with me that is much more experienced which helped push me along

Tony04

5CHULZY wrote: »

It's just a 30km loop for me up and around howth. Was thinking nice a steady to start with as warm up to get to the bottom of howth and then go flat out up to top of howth. The best I've done is 12 mins. Not great I know but if i tell myself it's only 12 mins of work I'll be ok. Recover coming back down and round to sutton and then sprint the last 10km back home

To be honest cycling's not running in the sense where you time yourself over a distance and then you can see how good you doing depending on your time, as theres to much other factors like traffic lights headwinds/tailwinds. That's the good thing about segments though as they're more compact and easier to track progress.

If you keep consistent your time will come well down. I remember the first time I went up howth on a heavy old bike it took like 20 minutes in total if I remember, where as now going hard with a tailwind i can do it in a little over 8 minutes or around 9 minutes in a headwind, obviously I've the full roadie kit now.

Macy0161

Does Zwift not do a version of TrainerRoads Virtual power? TrainerRoad has a large number of turbo's for which it has estimated power curves. Once it's reasonably consistent, you can use it and make progress. In terms of training plan - as a newbie, any type of structure should see you make gains imo. I've not followed a Zwift plan, but TrainerRoad has served me well (when I've been consistent). I've referrals if anyone wants one - need your name and email address.

Chips Lovell

5CHULZY wrote: »

I'll ignore any power from strava from now on. And I know without a power meter any figures in zwift will not be accurate

I'm happy for my size as I workout in the gym as well. Would like to drop down to 97kg and the most. So I understand that I will not be the fastest up the hills but sometimes my legs just struggle.

Only been cycling a out 9 months now, but was please to be able to reach the 100km mark. Just want to improve my hill speed

Any estimated power number that isn't generated by a power meter is too inaccurate to be useful, so you're right to ignore.

As others have said, climbing is all about power to weight. If you're a lean 97kg, then there's only one half of that ratio you can focus on. I'd suggest five to seven minute intervals at the max HR you can sustain for that time period. As you'll know from the gym, your legs should feel heavy and slightly sore afterwards. If they don't, you weren't pushing hard enough.

If you're relatively inexperienced, it's probably best doing them on a hill because it's easier to sustain that level of effort going uphill that it is on on flat or rolling roads.

Building up power will take time, so don't expect noticeable improvements in weeks. Think months.