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Declined Mortgage Protection Insurance - ADVICE PLEASE

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  • 12-05-2020 6:47pm
    #1
    Crumtrin
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭


    Hi All,

    Myself and my partner are in the process of buying a house.

    I have been approved for Mortgage Protection Insurance, however my partner has been declined due to BMI.

    We have tried a number of brokers and companies here and they have said it will be a straight decline due to my partners BMI.

    My partner is the main earner, however they have a very generous death in service package and several pensions.

    The application is with AIB.

    We have contacted pulse in the UK for a quote through a broker.

    My questions are this, is it likely that we will get a waiver ? What are the chances ? And does anyone here have experience with getting insurance with pulse, if so, can they outline how long it took to get cover in place and a general ball park in terms of premium ?

    And would it be better to get a waiver or try the pulse route ? Does anyone have any experience here or advice ? Thanks

    Any advice here would be greatly appreciated, as we are at our wits end.

    Thanks.


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    #2
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,479 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    Can the death in service policy be assigned to the bank? If so, they might accept that instead of mortgage protection insurance. Likewise any life insurance policy etc that he has.

    I really don't want this to sound like unhelpful advice, but by refused because of his BMI, do you mean his weight? If so, could he work on this for six months and then reapply? I mean, it's not nice to be refused an insurance product due to health, but it isn't an incurable disease.


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    #3
    ladystardust
    Registered Users Posts: 131 ✭✭ladystardust


    Crumtrin wrote: »
    Hi All,

    Myself and my partner are in the process of buying a house.

    I have been approved for Mortgage Protection Insurance, however my partner has been declined due to BMI.

    We have tried a number of brokers and companies here and they have said it will be a straight decline due to my partners BMI.

    My partner is the main earner, however they have a very generous death in service package and several pensions.

    The application is with AIB.

    We have contacted pulse in the UK for a quote through a broker.

    My questions are this, is it likely that we will get a waiver ? What are the chances ? And does anyone here have experience with getting insurance with pulse, if so, can they outline how long it took to get cover in place and a general ball park in terms of premium ?

    And would it be better to get a waiver or try the pulse route ? Does anyone have any experience here or advice ? Thanks

    Any advice here would be greatly appreciated, as we are at our wits end.

    Thanks.

    Hi,

    I was in the same situation about 2 weeks ago. We were sale agreed etc and I have a pre existing condition. We were advised to budget more as it would be weighted. We were grand with that. Unfortunately, we were declined altogether, as it turned out not even for my pre existing condition, but something small from years back that actually turned out to be nothing. They wanted clarification and a check from a consultant to back up my claims that it wasnt relevant (I was honest about investigations that turned out to be normal, but they weren't happy) . The chances of me getting a non urgent appointment at the best of times with a specialist would be infinitesimal. My gp had never seen the likes of the strictness before. I happen to know an underwriter who told me that they have all but been instructed to decline or postpone if there is anything at all due to covid.

    We tried other places, same story. Tried brokers who advised us the same. We applied for an exemption and it was not granted and our LTV was 50%. Not a huge mortgage at all.

    I know it's not the news you wanted and I'm sorry. You could always ask for the exemption. But if your partner is main earner (like me) it's unlikely.


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    #4
    lomb
    Registered Users Posts: 6,031 ✭✭✭lomb


    What Bmi may I ask? Is it above 30?


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    #5
    KilOit
    Registered Users Posts: 2,987 ✭✭✭KilOit


    They have to give it if you are declined,
    get all the refusal letters as prove

    https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/buying_a_home/mortgage_protection.html


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    #6
    Crumtrin
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭Crumtrin


    They declined on BMI so height and weight. This is what they told us the reason for the decline was. no underlying conditions, just BMI. Seems really strict


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    #7
    lomb
    Registered Users Posts: 6,031 ✭✭✭lomb


    Crumtrin wrote: »
    They declined on BMI so height and weight. This is what they told us the reason for the decline was. no underlying conditions, just BMI. Seems really strict

    but what number is her BMI? and what age?


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    #8
    Crumtrin
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭Crumtrin


    Age is 40 and BMI is 48


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    #9
    lomb
    Registered Users Posts: 6,031 ✭✭✭lomb


    Crumtrin wrote: »
    Age is 40 and BMI is 48

    Ok she is very high risk so by any standard. Corona affects high Bmi much worse, even Im not immune, Im around 31 was accepted as standard back in Feb ,now Im not so sure...


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    #10
    ladystardust
    Registered Users Posts: 131 ✭✭ladystardust


    KilOit wrote: »
    They have to give it if you are declined,
    get all the refusal letters as prove

    https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/buying_a_home/mortgage_protection.html

    I could be wrong. But these circumstances only make it a legal exception to requiring it. This does not mean the bank has to give it to you. They may waive it but at their discretion. This is what I was told.


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    #11
    iwillhtfu
    Registered Users Posts: 6,368 ✭✭✭iwillhtfu


    Crumtrin wrote: »
    Age is 40 and BMI is 48

    I can't offer advice and mean no offence and perhaps it's a medical condition but if my BMI was 48 and I was refused insurance based on that alarm bells would be going like the clappers in my head never mind the mortgage.

    If possible work on your partners health first then worry about a mortgage, I'm assuming her job isn't going to change in the next 6-12 months but as the bank see's it your partner possibly may not be here in 6-12 months.

    I do wish ye well either way and as I said I'm not trying to offend.


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    #12
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,572 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Just get standard death policy in order to draw down the Mortgage. It’s a basic policy and pays the mortgage off should one of you die.

    Once you have the mortgage you can always work towards getting the fancy policy like mortgage protection.

    I just have the basic on my properties also.


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    #13
    phormium
    Registered Users Posts: 3,308 ✭✭✭phormium


    Gumbo wrote: »
    Just get standard death policy in order to draw down the Mortgage.

    That's what has been turned down, death policy/mortgage protection/life cover all names for basically same thing, all require insurance company to be happy to take on the risk of the worst happening and in this case they are not.


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    #14
    Crumtrin
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭Crumtrin


    Hi All,

    Thanks for the replies - but please look at the questions that were initially asked.

    Has anyone experience here of dealing with pulse and if so what are turnaround times and prices for cover ?

    Thanks


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    #15
    MSVforever
    Registered Users Posts: 590 ✭✭✭MSVforever


    Hi,

    We were in a similar situation back in 2018.

    We bought a new house but there was a delay with the completion date. In the meantime we had to apply for a mortgage extension and also confirm mortgage protection insurance straight after.

    (Un)fortunately I was diagnosed with cancer during this time and no insurance company would take me on (but my wife was insured).
    I applied to all insurers to get the refusal letters. I also contacted Pulse and they advised that I would have to wait at least for 2 years after my surgery (i.e. to be cancer free for this time).
    All Irish insurer were saying that I need to be cancer free for at least 5 years.

    The only solution was to apply for mortgage protection exemption with our bank. I had to produce 3 refusal letters and evidence from my employer that I have death in service benefit insurance in place. It took the underwriters about 7 weeks to make a decision. In the end I got the exemption one day before my surgery.

    We are living in our new home since April 2019 and everything is ok now.

    Any questions let me know.


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    #16
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,476 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    I've clearly been out of Ireland too long but why do you even need MPI to get a mortgage?


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    #17
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 22,317 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    I've clearly been out of Ireland too long but why do you even need MPI to get a mortgage?

    I think they are talking about life insurance to cover the mortgage in case of death.
    Mortgage protection for me would be more an income protection policy that you don't have to have. I could be wrong though


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    #18
    Samuel T. Cogley
    Registered Users Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    I think they are talking about life insurance to cover the mortgage in case of death.
    Mortgage protection for me would be more an income protection policy that you don't have to have. I could be wrong though


    I was told "Mortgage Protection" is that decreasing (in line with what's owed) life assurance policy dodad.


    Income Protection is different, and not required.


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    #19
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,459 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    I think they are talking about life insurance to cover the mortgage in case of death.
    Mortgage protection for me would be more an income protection policy that you don't have to have. I could be wrong though

    Other way around.

    Mortgage protection will pay off the sum of your outstanding mortgage if you die. It's the bare minimum cover.

    Life assurance is a fixed sum that'll be paid if you die. It doesn't decrease. It's purpose is to replace your income for your surviving partner if you die.


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    #20
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,121 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    I've clearly been out of Ireland too long but why do you even need MPI to get a mortgage?
    In the event of one of the people named on the mortgage dying it will pay off the outstanding balance.

    This is important if for example the mortgage is only affordable with two people working, or say that the current childcare wouldn't be sustainable if one died.

    https://www.ccpc.ie/consumers/money/insurance/mortgage-protection-insurance/


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    #21
    ED E
    Registered Users Posts: 36,167 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    iwillhtfu wrote: »
    I can't offer advice and mean no offence and perhaps it's a medical condition but if my BMI was 48 and I was refused insurance based on that alarm bells would be going like the clappers in my head never mind the mortgage.

    If possible work on your partners health first then worry about a mortgage, I'm assuming her job isn't going to change in the next 6-12 months but as the bank see's it your partner possibly may not be here in 6-12 months.

    I do wish ye well either way and as I said I'm not trying to offend.

    This will fall on deaf ears but this poster is right.

    Her life expectancy is -4.7yrs based on weight alone (84.3 Vs 79.6) nevermind other factors. Numbers from Lancet study (first Google result)

    *Assumed female, op wasn't clear on sex.


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    #22
    Krapfi
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭Krapfi


    Hi there,

    Just wondering how did you get on?

    I'm in a similar situation and too afraid to even try to get pre-approval for the mortgage at this stage.
    Wherever I asked for life cover we were told "no chance". Pulse UK might be an option but they only cover a maximum of 10 years.

    Not sure if any bank would grant a waiver but who would be most likely to? I only know of UB.

    Thanks!


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    #23
    jr1942
    Closed Accounts Posts: 45 ✭jr1942


    does the life insurance have to be with one from below:
    Aviva
    irishLife
    Zurich
    Royal London
    NewIreland Assurance

    or can look elsewhere?


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    #24
    ongarite
    Registered Users Posts: 8,215 ✭✭✭ongarite


    Life assurance isn't a requirement for a mortgage from a bank but they will do their best to sell you one.
    Mortgage protection insurance is the one you need unless you can get a waiver.


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    #25
    jr1942
    Closed Accounts Posts: 45 ✭jr1942


    ongarite wrote: »
    Life assurance isn't a requirement for a mortgage from a bank but they will do their best to sell you one.
    Mortgage protection insurance is the one you need unless you can get a waiver.
    Thx, Sory meant mortgage insurance. Only the above?


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    #26
    PinkSpark
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭PinkSpark


    jr1942 wrote: »
    does the life insurance have to be with one from below:
    Aviva
    irishLife
    Zurich
    Royal London
    NewIreland Assurance

    or can look elsewhere?


    You can get it from any Irish Insurer that offers it as far as I’m aware. The bank just wants to see that you’re covered and the money will go to them. We got our MPI from Laya


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    #27
    jr1942
    Closed Accounts Posts: 45 ✭jr1942


    PinkSpark wrote: »
    You can get it from any Irish Insurer that offers it as far as I’m aware. The bank just wants to see that you’re covered and the money will go to them. We got our MPI from Laya

    They aren't a broker, they actually have their own insurance?


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