Cars that are uninsurable. GTIs, performance cars - considering buy cheap and export

TheBoyConor

Hi,

I'm just looking to know if there are certain types of car out there that are basically uninsurable to the kind of people would be most interested int hose type of cars. I'm thinking the likes of GTI golfs or Focus RS or indeed any type of higher performance or non standard car being uninsurable.

Im thinking that maybe examples can be bought for cheap owing to their general unsuability in Ireland. Would there be any margin to be made by exporting these to the UK where they might be worth more as they don't face the same insurance issues?

Heres Johnny

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Hi,

I'm just looking to know if there are certain types of car out there that are basically uninsurable to the kind of people would be most interested int hose type of cars. I'm thinking the likes of GTI golfs or Focus RS or indeed any type of higher performance or non standard car being uninsurable.

Im thinking that maybe examples can be bought for cheap owing to their general unsuability in Ireland. Would there be any margin to be made by exporting these to the UK where they might be worth more as they don't face the same insurance issues?

No. Plenty of people can insure them, just not inexperienced drivers.

bazz26

Heres Johnny wrote: »

No. Plenty of people can insure them, just not inexperienced drivers.

This.

A Golf GTi is not expensive to insure unless you are a young driver will limited driving experience, have not much claims free driving or have a driving conviction. A Golf GTi would actually be cheaper for me to insure than my current BMW 530d.

Eric Cartman

GTI's aren't the issue. 90s Cap performance cars perhaps but the scene tax means you'd never make money.

pinktoe

Certain high performance JDM would be hard to insure, Evos seem difficult for example at any age but I don't there is many for sale in Ireland.

I haven't checked prices in the UK

I wouldn't think a GTI is hard tó insure. I got a quote off the AA for a Nissan Gtr for under 900 which is less than I'm paying for an XJ. No idea how that makes sense.

millington

Insurance really has little impact on the value of interesting cars. High import costs means they're as valuable here as anywhere else.

colm_mcm

Export to where?

TheBoyConor

The UK.

hoodie6029

You could take a different tactic and look at cars that are expensive to tax here but not in the UK and have a following there.
I'm think non-commercial Land Cruisers and Discoverys. Or any post 2008 car that cost €750 plus a year to tax.

TheBoyConor

Or both high tax and high insurance cars here. Looking on done deal there are a good few large petrols that will be expensive to run that are advertised for weeks and prices reducing. I could offer them small money cash in thehopes of a discount to buy and perhaps they'd turn a profit in the UK.

What are the costs involved in exporting to the UK

Isambard

i wouldn't think just now would be a good time to expect car prices to be buoyant in the Uk given the kicking in the nuts their economy is currently getting.

Tacitus Kilgore

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Or both high tax and high insurance cars here. Looking on done deal there are a good few large petrols that will be expensive to run that are advertised for weeks and prices reducing. I could offer them small money cash in thehopes of a discount to buy and perhaps they'd turn a profit in the UK.

What are the costs involved in exporting to the UK

Depends, are you going to export them from Dundalk to Newry, or from Cahersiveen to Aberdeen?

User1998

You might make a few quid exporting a cheap high tax car to the UK that was originally a UK import as you’d get the VRT back.

A lot of Polish lads buy high tax Lexus/Merc/BMW etc and send them home, they don’t pay road tax over there so there worth a lot more over there.

The UK has a newish road tax system tho from about 2 years ago so best check it out

Eric Cartman

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Or both high tax and high insurance cars here. Looking on done deal there are a good few large petrols that will be expensive to run that are advertised for weeks and prices reducing. I could offer them small money cash in thehopes of a discount to buy and perhaps they'd turn a profit in the UK.

What are the costs involved in exporting to the UK

Like that e60 550i , a great export which has f*ck all chance of selling here

Neilw

Performance cars aren’t hard to insure here if you have a clean driving record.
Plus the UK has far more performance cars already on sale there, usually much cheaper than here too.
Op, your idea has a lot of flaws.

TheBoyConor

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Like that e60 550i , a great export which has f*ck all chance of selling here

I'd be exporting from cork. To avoid costs myself I've been wondering would a UK buyer generally come over and collect like Irish buying in UK do?

I'd consider buying something with done work necessary before it's ready for sale.

lawred2

This is an expensive small peripheral market. There is near zero chance of any sort of business that involves exporting to a larger generally better value market.

Midnight_EG

Don't forget that the UK market is riddled with performance cars as they're much more accessible there.

TheBoyConor

Midnight_EG wrote: »

Don't forget that the UK market is riddled with performance cars as they're much more accessible there.

What do you mean buy then being more accessible? We in the fancy cars are cheaper or there's more rich people to buy them?

You mentioned vrt refunds?

Could there be money to be made by selling to UK recently imported cars subsequently scrapped, and then reclaiming the vet?

Toyotafanboi

I dont think you know enough about this to make a serious fist of it.

If there was a lucrative element to these ideas somebody would already be at it.

Esel

Car does not have to be a UK import to qualify for VRT refund on export, afaik.

Midnight_EG

TheBoyConor wrote: »

What do you mean buy then being more accessible? We in the fancy cars are cheaper or there's more rich people to buy them?

You mentioned vrt refunds?

Could there be money to be made by selling to UK recently imported cars subsequently scrapped, and then reclaiming the vet?

They're cheaper, and much more easily insured. The likes of a GTI Polo is a starter car in the UK to a lot of people. Their second cars are generally what we would consider a dream car over here.

I didn't mention a VRT refund?

drunkmonkey

bazz26 wrote: »

This.

A Golf GTi is not expensive to insure unless you are a young driver will limited driving experience, have not much claims free driving or have a driving conviction. A Golf GTi would actually be cheaper for me to insure than my current BMW 530d.

€20 cheaper, I've done that switch. Tried notifying them when I took it to stage 1 but they hadn't a clue what I was on about so just left it as is.

Midnight_EG

drunkmonkey wrote: »

€20 cheaper, I've done that switch. Tried notifying them when I took it to stage 1 but they hadn't a clue what I was on about so just left it as is.

I went from a GTI to a 530d and got back €300 :pac:

drunkmonkey

Midnight_EG wrote: »

I went from a GTI to a 530d and got back €300 :pac:

If I got €300 back I'd nearly have free insurance:)

Midnight_EG

drunkmonkey wrote: »

If I got €300 back I'd nearly have free insurance:)

It was a third of the GTI policy so I was happy

bazz26

drunkmonkey wrote: »

€20 cheaper, I've done that switch. Tried notifying them when I took it to stage 1 but they hadn't a clue what I was on about so just left it as is.

Midnight_EG wrote: »

I went from a GTI to a 530d and got back €300 :pac:

I got a quote of under €500 on a GTi PP before whereas I'm paying €700 on the 530d.

millington

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I'd be exporting from cork. To avoid costs myself I've been wondering would a UK buyer generally come over and collect like Irish buying in UK do?

I'd consider buying something with done work necessary before it's ready for sale.

No way. Importing cars is not the done thing in the UK. You will find it extremely difficult to sell into the UK from here. Plus why would they go through the hassle of travelling here to buy something if it's no cheaper than over there? By that logic, they would just buy them off the same lads you buy them off.


It works with some high end stuff with a VRT refund but you won't be able to do many that way without registering with Revenue which will take a big hit out of it aswell.

KeithTS

As far as paperwork etc. goes it's (usually) relatively straight forward. Easier if you're a registered importer/exporter but then you pay tax which is profit gone.

I've imported a couple of cars to the UK (I moved there and took my cars with me).
One went really smoothly with the paperwork and it was all signed off on a few days after bringing it into the country.

The other took 2-3 months because the DVLA wanted evidence that no modifications were done (even though nothing would indicate that there were any changes), translations on the certificate of conformity because it was in German and a load of other stuff. I obviously couldn't sell the car during this time.

Bear in mind that the car has to be insured during this period so between the insurance/mechanics to sign off on it having no alterations etc. plus the MOT and so on which is needed to register it, it would have been cheaper to buy the same car over there and scrap mine.

There are lots of little costs the rack up too, you may need to pay for the CoC if you don't have it, that could be €100 and a few weeks waiting for it.
MOT, another £30-£50 plus any work they need to do.
You may/will need to swap out an instrument cluster (or use overlays or whatever) if it's in km and not miles/km which can cost a bit. If the DVLA tell you to do this you need to provide certs from recognised mechanics/garages to do the work so it could set you back a couple of hundred.
Fuel getting to from ferry ports.
You may need to have an IVA test carried out at a specialist centre, these have been essentially shut down at the moment so testing could take weeks and weeks and it's anywhere from £199 to £580 iirc not including re-inspection fees if that's needed.

You may get people who will buy the car and do all this themselves but it's a pain and they won't be doing it unless they're saving a lot of money on the car.
I got the feeling about 18-24 months ago that they were trying to reduce the imports and were making it difficult on purpose as the market was slowing down over there due to Diesel/Petrol debates and Brexit and they wanted to have people buy rather than import, that's just me guessing though. It raises another another point on Brexit though which could make the entire process much more difficult in a few months, people don't talk about it anymore but it's still a thing and will affect imports/exports both ways from anything to insuring the car while you drive it from Ireland to the UK to the actual fees/paperwork involved.

One way around a lot of this though:
If you own the car (you may have to own it for 6+ months, I'm not sure) and it's older than 10 years you are essentially exempt from providing information about the car such as the CoC etc. It just needs to be MOT'd and have the relevant documents submitted.
However, you may need to be staying on the V5C as the registered owner of the vehicle (I'm not sure) for this to apply and selling 10 year old cars probably isn't the best way to make large profits, especially in the UK where there are lots more about for cheap.

Exporting to the UK makes very little sense.
In general cars sell for a decent amount less over there or you get more thrown in for the same price and there are loads of smaller outfits and back street garages selling cars too so there are plenty of deals to be had.

If you manage to get the car cheaper here you still need to factor in the flight/ferry so whack on another €500 or so to the price plus the time it takes.

Pair that with the fact that most people want some level of confidence when buying a car so unless they're getting a really good deal or know what they're talking about you they will probably stay local which narrows your market.

I would suggest staying well clear or at least doing a lot more research and waiting until the planet isn't face down in the s**t and if you do go ahead get all your ducks lined up in a row, have every bit of paperwork perfect and account for things going wrong or questions being asked that will set you back a while