How do Gardaí decide whether to charge someone with speeding or dangerous driving?

Crock Rock

What's the criteria?

Here we have two separate cases.

One, where a driver was caught at 56 km/h over the limit exceeding the speed limity by 112% (ie, driving at 212% of the allowed limit). (106 km/h in a 50 km/h zone).

https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1233121527744417793

And here we have a case of a driver doing 163 km/h in a 120 km/h zone, exceeding the speed limit by 43 km/h (exceeding the limit by 36%) ,ie, driving at 136% of the speed limit.

https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1149254020781019140

So driver 1: Drives at 212% of the speed limit past a school, points and a fine.

Driver 2: Drives at 136% of the limit on a motorway, day in court



What determines whether a driver is charged with dangerous driving or the lesser offence of speeding? Both are abhorrent speeds but there's no consistency. I suppose the person doing the ton on the motorway might be the lesser of the two evils.

GM228

Ultimately it comes down to discretion, but other factors have to be considered such as the surroundings and other users present, speeding in and of itself is not dangerous driving, there must be direct immediate and serious risk to the public for a dangerous driving charge.

tossy

Sending someone to court for doing 160 in a 120 is a waste of everyone’s time and money.

Doing 106 in a 50 is bananas.

Treppen

tossy wrote: »

Sending someone to court for doing 160 in a 120 is a waste of everyone’s time and money.

Doing 106 in a 50 is bananas.

Doing 160 is more bananas.. cos its faster.

OP forget about %'s

If I'm doing 20 in a 10kmph zone it's 100% over.

If I do 75 in a 50 zone it's 'only' 25% over.

Which has the greater risk of fatality?

Vic_08

Treppen wrote: »

Doing 160 is more bananas.. cos its faster.

OP forget about %'s

If I'm doing 20 in a 10kmph zone it's 100% over.

If I do 75 in a 50 zone it's 'only' 25% over.

Which has the greater risk of fatality?

106 in a built up area has far greater risk than 160 on a motorway in most circumstances.

wonski

Treppen wrote: »

Doing 160 is more bananas.. cos its faster.

OP forget about %'s

If I'm doing 20 in a 10kmph zone it's 100% over.

If I do 75 in a 50 zone it's 'only' 25% over.

Which has the greater risk of fatality?

But there are no 10km/h limits on public roads.

efanton

AS has been said already its totally down to the Gardai to determine which charge should be brought.

Also, because of the speed limit zones, in areas that are not designated safety zones for speed camera's and other detection devices the gardai will probably choose to go with the dangerous driving option to prevent technicalities stopping a conviction.

Speed camera's and he associated fixed penalty system cant operate on every stretch of road, but a dangerous driving charge can be applied anywhere.

wonski

efanton wrote: »

AS has been said already its totally down to the Gardai to determine which charge should be brought.

Also, because of the speed limit zones, in areas that are not designated safety zones for speed camera's and other detection devices the gardai will probably choose to go with the dangerous driving option to prevent technicalities stopping a conviction.

Speed camera's and he associated fixed penalty system cant operate on every stretch of road, but a dangerous driving charge can be applied anywhere.

Garda can do speed checks on any stretch of the road. They don't need to advertise it, you are mixing it up with gosafe vans

tossy

tossy wrote: »

Sending someone to court for doing 160 in a 120 is a waste of everyone’s time and money.

Doing 106 in a 50 is bananas.

It very much depends on the 50km zone. I do 80 to 100kmh in a 50kmh zone every singe day on my way to work. It’s a wide open 2 lane (in each direction) dual carriageway way with no entrance or exit roads onto it, pedestrians have underpasses so they don’t cross the road. It’s insane having a 50kmh limit.

I agree 160 in a 120 isn’t in anyway outlandish either, absolutely fine for a modern car.

The main issue we have is our speed limits are far too low in many places.

silver2020

I good Garda roads policing member will be able to make a judgement as to the severity of the offence.

106km in a well maintained car on a straight dry road when the school is closed would not necessarily be seen as dangerous. You cannot go to a court and say "well if the school was open and it was raining it would be dangerous"

I would say it was borderline for the motorist and they should think themselves very lucky especially as it was Ennis and Durcan down there likes to create headlines with sentences. This may also have played a part in the garda's discretion

Similarly, the 163 on a motorway - if it was raining or the manner of the driving raised concerns, the garda might have thought a court appearance is the better option.

The attitude of the driver also comes into play.

kenmm

I think it depends if they can get enough witnesses from the scene. Usually if they have enough drivers with their own GPS to act as eye witnesses it means they won't be able to use as much discretion.
If they find someone with multiple devices then even better.

lawred2

Treppen wrote: »

Doing 160 is more bananas.. cos its faster.

OP forget about %'s

If I'm doing 20 in a 10kmph zone it's 100% over.

If I do 75 in a 50 zone it's 'only' 25% over.

Which has the greater risk of fatality?

what?

There are reduced speed limits for a reason. And they aren't out of concern for the driver.

tossy

lawred2 wrote: »

what?

There are reduced speed limits for a reason. And they aren't out of concern for the driver.

Yeah but cos tho init!

Isambard

75 in a 50 is 50% over.




yours faithfully Pedantic Pete

mikeecho

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1961/act/24/section/53/enacted/en/html

Dangerous driving.

53.—(1) A person shall not drive a vehicle in a public place at a speed or in a manner which, having regard to all the circumstances of the case (including the nature, condition and use of the place and the amount of traffic which then actually is or might reasonably be expected then to be therein) is dangerous to the public.



http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1961/act/24/section/47/enacted/en/html


Offence of exceeding speed limit.

F103 [ 47. — (1) A person shall not drive a mechanically propelled vehicle at a speed exceeding the speed limit —

( a ) that applies in respect of that vehicle, or

( b ) that applies to the road on which the vehicle is being driven where that speed limit is lower than that applying to that vehicle.

(2) A person who contravenes subsection (1) is guilty of an offence.

There you go.

Speeding is speeding, but dangerous driving takes all circumstances into consideration.. ie road, weather, other road users etc etc