Marriage help

LegacyUser

I'm looking for advice on what I should do. I am in my mid 40s, married with 2 kids. The kids are age 12 & 8. My wife and I are together about 15 years but I feel it has run it course. My wife has no interest in a physical relationship, mostly due to menopause. While I understand this, I find it hard to get past. On top of this my wife would be a reserved person, so she would not be a outwardly affectionate type person, which was fine with me, but since we are also not physical it has lead to me falling out of love with her.

I have asked her about it, and she gets upset and admits there are issues, but life just seems to go on. I have raised the issue a few times but my wife has never initiated any conversations about our relationship. It is almost like she is happy to go on like this. I have had other significant relationships before and I know what I have now isn't what it can be. Even though it is hard to compare a married relationship to past ones where there were no kids.

It has got me quite down. I went to a therapist for a few months last year, and while it was good to get some perspective, it hasn't made a change to life as the issue is going nowhere. I don't see any value in couples counselling. Can't see my wife going for it.

Some people would probably advise me to leave but then what about my kids? I don't want to affect their lives. Would I just end up moving in with parents as I would still be paying for a mortgage for the family home?

I don't see a solution.

Finchie1276

Hi,

I was struck by this:' Some people would probably advise me to leave but then what about my kids? I don't want to affect their lives'
Do you really think your kids don't see what is going on? Your 12 year old in particular in at the stage where relationships, dynamics, family systems are all becoming of interest and evident.

Its our job as parents to be the role models for our kids. That is in all parts of life - how we use money, how we treat people, how we relate to work, how we put boundaries in place.

If you stay without resolving this you will be giving them a view of relationships that will very much interact on their future relationships- relationships are cold, sex is odd, affection is odd, don't show your feelings, don't talk, go silent and don't let emotion in....

Relationships, for the most part are supposed to be cooperative, warm, friendly and harmonious. Sure, there are arguments but it is the healthy way in which we resolve them that our kids learn from. Relationships are also physical, sex and sexual commitment, pleasure and mutual satisfaction are the glue that holds things together in many relationships. Kids should know that sex is an important part of healthy relationships so they know its healthy for theirs.

There are two people in this relationship who can make choices about what happens next.
Your wife seems to have opted out and wont engage.
You are frustrated and have already tried counselling.
You are not having sex with each other.
You think your kids don't notice.

For me this can only play one way:
Tell your wife what you said here, ask her to try couples counselling with you. If she refuses or you BOTH try and it does not work then you leave and seek happiness in another relationship in time. Your kids will be fine, only if you are honest with them, have tried to resolve it and it did not work.

If it does resolve it (and I have seen family therapy resolve this situation) then great. You will both learn how to communicate your feelings better and learn to be physically engaged with each other too. Bear in mind your wife may have decided that she wants out but is too afraid to move to the next step.

The world is full of kids who wished their parents did split up because they hated the atmosphere growing up. Its also full of happy kids who saw their parents separate, make it work and have fulfilling new lives afterwards. Which lesson do you want to teach to your kids?

Its hard but not having anywhere to stay, go or relying on your wife to come up with an action plan is not going to work.
Don't give ultimatums about counselling or having sex etc. Just say you think the relationship is in trouble and would she consider going to a counselling service, committing to 6 - 8 sessions and seeing where it gets you. If its a flat no then you know the next step.

JustAThought

sorry to hear about your situation OP. Having watched close friends ambivalent marriages fall apart with no other person involved and the upset and devastation it causes to the family dynamic , finances and children I’d be asking is there a way of saving it or getting past this bad phase?
Do you want to be living in a bedsit only seeing your children on random evenings or truging around the zoo and mcdonalds with them until you have nothing in common and Dad days are a chore and they want to stay at home or hang out with their friends. How much of a burden would it be on your parents and their dynamic to have an adult child move in with them - dint they want their own privacy and personal space and lives?

Do your wife and you other than having no sex have anything you enjoy together or is there no tenderness ir kindness or common interest left in the marriage at all? Do you speak? Maybe its worth going to counselling together - there may be something other than disinterest in sex fuelling this - or she may not be happy with the sex but not able to say it to you? Might be worth trying.

Xterminator

HI Op

do you get the sense that your wife is happy with how things are, or is also unhappy? If she wants to coast along with as things are, then you are probably right that she has no desire or inclination for change, and that any attempt to change is at best an unlikely hope. Does she at least acknowledge there is an issue here?

if she is unhappy too at how things are maybe she would agree to try couples counselling or some other way to see if you can evolve to a new stage in your relationship where you get something back, some connection between you and some personal fulfillment.

i would ask her what she expects the relationship to be like at this stage, ie what does an ideal relationship look like in her head. do you share a part of that vision? Can you get from where you are now to there?

I would seek to find the things that you share/.could share, to build a connection. EG hobbies or talk about revisiting places you have holidayed in with good memories , doing some activity together. Arrange a baby sitter, if that is agreed, to allow you to be something other than mum and dad every day.

If you cannot move to forward together you will have a decision to make. Can you stick it? Are you willing to break up your family unit to seek personal fulfilment? Are you going to stick it out for financial reasons, or for the kids etc ?

Personally i would advise you exhaust every opportunity to make it work before tearing it down.

shesty

Try and make it work first.And I know you said you have had other significant relationships, and what it 'can be' but I am guessing none of those involved 15 years of marriage and 2 kids.Don't make the mistake of thinking the grass is greener elsewhere, because things have gone stale where you are.

I would suggest couple's counselling, or family therapy of some sort.

LegacyUser

shameasiteverwas wrote: »

Some people would probably advise me to leave but then what about my kids? I don't want to affect their lives.

You are effecting their lives already. Speaking as someone who was one of those kids, they know something is wrong. My parents marriage slowly died over several years but they refused to accept it 'for the kids sake' My siblings and I knew what was happening and it really effect us. It gives a really bad example of what relationships should be like and you find yourself repeating the same mistakes.

For the sake of your kids do something, it could mean separating for a while or it could mean divorcing for good but just treading water is helping no one.

Tiddlypeeps

This problem can very likely be solved but it will be a lot of work for both you and your wife. So the first thing you need to decide is if you even want to try or if at this point you just want out.

If this problem only started around menopause then it's unlikely she coincidentally went off you at the same time so take some solace in that the problems are not likely caused by her no longer being attracted to you or no longer being in love with you. Menopause can cause a wide range of symptoms that can cause a woman to go off sex. A lot of which can be embarrassing and hard to talk about. If one or more of these symptoms are the reason she has gone off sex then she should be working with her doctor and/or gynecologist to work through them. Most of the issues a woman is likely to run into during menopause can be solved.

The biggest hurdle for you is getting her to communicate about the problem. To find out if it's physical, mental or both and encouraging her to seek the right help for it. You say you've tried to talk about it, she gets upset and admits there is a problem but does she shut down the conversation? Or what has been the barrier to getting to the root of the issue?

LegacyUser

OP here. Thanks for all the advice.

Finchie1276 wrote: »

Hi,

I was struck by this:' Some people would probably advise me to leave but then what about my kids? I don't want to affect their lives'
Do you really think your kids don't see what is going on? Your 12 year old in particular in at the stage where relationships, dynamics, family systems are all becoming of interest and evident.

Its our job as parents to be the role models for our kids. That is in all parts of life - how we use money, how we treat people, how we relate to work, how we put boundaries in place.

If you stay without resolving this you will be giving them a view of relationships that will very much interact on their future relationships- relationships are cold, sex is odd, affection is odd, don't show your feelings, don't talk, go silent and don't let emotion in....

Your post is really insightful. I know that a lot of what you say is correct. I'm not sure how much my children know. I grew up in a house without much affection between my parents. I just thought that was normal. My parents never hugged or kissed, but I didn't think they were going to break up.

JustAThought wrote: »

Do you want to be living in a bedsit only seeing your children on random evenings or truging around the zoo and mcdonalds with them until you have nothing in common and Dad days are a chore and they want to stay at home or hang out with their friends.

This is a fear I have of making the break. Being skint and some form of weekend dad. I had a mate who broke up with his missus and went totally of the rails drinking. He got himself back together but it was hard.

Xterminator wrote: »

do you get the sense that your wife is happy with how things are, or is also unhappy? If she wants to coast along with as things are, then you are probably right that she has no desire or inclination for change, and that any attempt to change is at best an unlikely hope. Does she at least acknowledge there is an issue here?
....
If you cannot move to forward together you will have a decision to make. Can you stick it? Are you willing to break up your family unit to seek personal fulfilment? Are you going to stick it out for financial reasons, or for the kids etc ?

I think my wife is ok with continuing as is. She says that this is normal for couples in the 40s. It probably was the case with her parents. Part of me thinks it would be selfish for me to break the family, on the chance of finding happiness somewhere else.

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

The biggest hurdle for you is getting her to communicate about the problem. To find out if it's physical, mental or both and encouraging her to seek the right help for it. You say you've tried to talk about it, she gets upset and admits there is a problem but does she shut down the conversation? Or what has been the barrier to getting to the root of the issue?

I think she finds it embarrassing. Having to go to doctors etc about the menopause. On top of this I don' think she will want to go to counselling.



A few of you mentioned couples counselling. I'm just not sure my wife will go for it, or to be honest, I want to go for it either. If I'm truly honest I think the love has gone, but I don't see any real way of making a change.

Millionaire only not

oporignal11111 wrote: »

OP here. Thanks for all the advice.



Your post is really insightful. I know that a lot of what you say is correct. I'm not sure how much my children know. I grew up in a house without much affection between my parents. I just thought that was normal. My parents never hugged or kissed, but I didn't think they were going to break up.




This is a fear I have of making the break. Being skint and some form of weekend dad. I had a mate who broke up with his missus and went totally of the rails drinking. He got himself back together but it was hard.




I think my wife is ok with continuing as is. She says that this is normal for couples in the 40s. It probably was the case with her parents. Part of me thinks it would be selfish for me to break the family, on the chance of finding happiness somewhere else.




I think she finds it embarrassing. Having to go to doctors etc about the menopause. On top of this I don' think she will want to go to counselling.



A few of you mentioned couples counselling. I'm just not sure my wife will go for it, or to be honest, I want to go for it either. If I'm truly honest I think the love has gone, but I don't see any real way of making a change.

I have a copy cat marriage , love gone and can’t change it , it’s fair lonely at times!
I’m afraid it looks the norm from the more I talk to !

kerryjack

I think as a man the day you give up the chase is the day you die. I am heading for 50 married over 20 years and still enjoy a bit of a chase. like I am no George Clooney but I still like a bit of chating and light flirting with women, no harm and I have had a few opportunities over the years and my OH knows that, like she says herself I still have bit of a sparkle in my eye when I see an atractive women.
Keep as fit as you can look after yourself well buy nice clothes sell yourself well and your OH might wake up and take some notice.

Finchie1276

Hi

I'm following up on your reply. You are welcome to the insight but thats not gong to change your situation!
If you both choose (and you can choose but just procrastinating/ not deciding/ putting it off/ raising doubts about whether you both would go to counselling like you are doing) then you will be in the same place. Do you really want to spend the rest of your life like this? In this situation?

Are you not curious to investigate counselling? Are you afraid that it will be the end? Are you not curious what sex in a functioning relationship will be like? Everything changes in your 40's - kids are older, sex is different but maybe more satisfying and emotionally engaged.

Sure, there are lots of losses to divorcing but the gains usually outweigh them in them in the long term. You have a lot of life left to live hopefully so do the best job you can do with it. Your kids and maybe even your wife will thank you in the end.

Life is too short to accept your situation in my view.

Finchie1276

I forgot to add, you might look up the stages of change - I think you are in pre contemplation and the fears are sending you back to the safety you know.

achmairt

You don't say what age your wife is but most women enjoy intimacy into their mid 50's. I would suggest she makes an appointment with a gynaecologist who can advise her what to do. She is probably embarrassed to speak to you about it but she could get a new lease of life both in energy and sexually. Don't throw out the baby out with the bathwater yet. Good luck.

Emme

OP you said your wife's issues are mostly due to menopause. There's an awful stigma and shame surrounding the menopause now because of the fetishisation of youth, it can impact very heavily on women psychologically as well as physically. Some of the physical issues can be solved with medical help. The Well Woman Clinic might be able to help your wife. It seems a shame to throw a marriage away for something which might easily be sorted with the right help. Men sometimes need help too and should also get it where necesssary.

If she isn't open to medical help or marriage counselling then menopause isn't the main problem, it's an excuse.

AulWan

Presuming your wife is mid 40s too, she could only be at the early stages of menopause - I honestly think she is using it as an excuse and there is something else going on.

You're only mid forties - you could easily live another 35+ years. You're too young to be celibate at this stage of your life, and so is she.