Soil sample results

badgerhowlin

Hi,

What would people recommend


https://imgur.com/XZd257o

Say my name

Dung, slurry, compost.
And lots of it.

Buford T. Justice XIX

badgerhowlin wrote: »

Hi,

What would people recommend


https://imgur.com/XZd257o

As Smn said, plenty of organic fertiliser where the P&K are lowest. Slurry where K is lowest and dung where P is lowest.

Looking at the lime requirement there, that's some amount of lime recommended for pHs above 6:eek:

Edit: 2t/ac for a pH of 6.2?

mr.stonewall

Pig slurry if you can get it is great to build them indexs, cheaper than the bag.

roosterman71

Any harm to ask where you got the sampling done?

badgerhowlin

roosterman71 wrote: »

Any harm to ask where you got the sampling done?

teagasc €25 a sample

badgerhowlin

Thats what you get when you farm is leased out for 15 years.


I will the in the dog house if i bring pig slurry home with me.
The wife is already giving out about he smell of silage on my clothes.

€1500 of lime on 15ac
Going to be an expensive year getting the land back in order...

wrangler

Say my name wrote: »

Dung, slurry, compost.
And lots of it.

Very slow method of building fertility, It probably depends whether you need fertility built up for 2021 or 2030.
For grazing even I'd be using 150kg 10 10 20 /ac plus whatever ''Dung, slurry, compost'' you could scrounge.

mengele

Grass is still going to grow even at those index levels. What I would do for the next few years is just spread 18.6.12 each time you need to spread very. If you have slurry and ding spread it out when you can or else just a bag or two of 0.7.30 to give it an extra boast at the start of the season.

Farmer_3650

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

As Smn said, plenty of organic fertiliser where the P&K are lowest. Slurry where K is lowest and dung where P is lowest.

Looking at the lime requirement there, that's some amount of lime recommended for pHs above 6:eek:

Edit: 2t/ac for a pH of 6.2?

Sounds high alright...am I right in saying 1t lime/acre increases pH by 0.15?

morphy87

I am just wondering if anyone here could tell me after doing a soil test and getting a result do you see much of an improvement by spreading the fertilizer recommended by the test results? And is 0 7 30 a good fertilizer to spread in the spring with nitrogen?

wrangler

morphy87 wrote: »

I am just wondering if anyone here could tell me after doing a soil test and getting a result do you see much of an improvement by spreading the fertilizer recommended by the test results? And is 0 7 30 a good fertilizer to spread in the spring with nitrogen?

I recommended 10 10 20 because it has 10% nitrogen to get it growing, there's also 10% phosphorous which is important for growth and is 50% more phosphorous than what's in 0 7 30. There's enough potash in 10 10 20 as well to make a difference

Just edited to say that if the pasture is all weeds, building fertility take a while to make a difference

morphy87

wrangler wrote: »

I recommended 10 10 20 because it has 10% nitrogen to get it growing, there's also 10% phosphorous which is important for growth and is 50% more phosphorous than what's in 0 7 30. There's enough potash in 10 10 20 as well to make a difference

Just edited to say that if the pasture is all weeds, building fertility take a while to make a difference

No weeds but I know it would depend on the results but how long would it take to build? Also if you her low in p but ok for k what fertilizer would you recommend? Or would it be possible to improve it without lime? And finally if you spread 2 ton of lime what would you be exspecting your p and k’s to rise?

green daries

Lime may not increase your indexes but it releases the p and I which becomes locked up in the soil and it also helps to make use of and hold onto the nutrients that are added during the year through chemical fertiliser or slurry/dung

Apologies p and k

wrangler

morphy87 wrote: »

No weeds but I know it would depend on the results but how long would it take to build? Also if you her low in p but ok for k what fertilizer would you recommend? Or would it be possible to improve it without lime? And finally if you spread 2 ton of lime what would you be exspecting your p and k’s to rise?

Ps and Ks will become more available, don't think indexes will rise though.
You can spread Superphosphate on its own if there's enough potash,

morphy87

green daries wrote: »

Lime may not increase your indexes but it releases the p and I which becomes locked up in the soil and it also helps to make use of and hold onto the nutrients that are added during the year through chemical fertiliser or slurry/dung

Apologies p and k

Thanks for that I spread 2 ton of lime to the acre two years ago,

morphy87

wrangler wrote: »

Ps and Ks will become more available, don't think indexes will rise though.
You can spread Superphosphate on its own if there's enough potash,

So how would you rise your indexes so?

Castlekeeper

Badger, apart from the fact tgat olit gas been leased gor years, can you gve us some more background info
What has the land been used for?
How has it been managed?
What level of fertiliser has it got annually?
What do you intend to use it for?
Is it old pasture or has it been re-seeded?
Are there any problems that need fixing? Eg is it damaged or does it need drainage?

Apart from the pH which is grand for grassland,
I wouldn't worry about the P and K from a standard (salesman's) soil test, which only measures water soluble/leachable P and K. If the pH is ok after being ignored for 15 years, dont interfere, things underground must be doing something right.
Most of the answers you'll get here will be based on using expensive, highly acidic, soluble (and leachable) inorganic fertilisers to make the soil test look good, but will destroy your existing soil biology, directly avd indirectly. This is effective at producing large quantities of low dm, low nutrient grass when used on perennial ryegrass swards at high N rates, but you can't get away from the system once you're on it, any attempt to reduce inputs will see a corresponding reduction in output.
Soil quality will also deteriorate over time.
Grazing management and species diversity are your best tools in improving your land and getting the most out of it with the least input.

green daries

Index's are increased by adding p and k through your fertiliser slurry/dung.
You will get a return in your fertiliser by having a increase in grass growth for the season. but indexes will be slower to increase as some of your p and k are used in grass production if you are cutting silage use 0 7 30 and slurry and cut sward
For grazing as a poster said earlier 18 6 12 is probably the best alround fertiliser for less intensive systems

wrangler

morphy87 wrote: »

So how would you rise your indexes so?

Applying fertiliser every year, the only way to rise indexes is to put on more fertiliser than the crops will use.
I don't know what your aim is, plenty on here will tell you to leave it alone.
but raising fertility will grow more grass and better grass, that grass will produce more thrive in animals than lesser quality grass .
However if you're not in a position to take advantage of it there's no point.
A neighbour asked me for similar advice a couple years ago, land was all weeds from cutting hay even to the point that he had to rise out of cutting hay and he wanted improved, I didn't soil test but told him to put 150kg 0 10 20/acre . It really responded well and after two years grazing it really looked wll this spring after two years,
He thought it looked so well this year that he cut hay offit again.....pfft
There's no future in building it up to sell hay/silage off it, better to leave it as it is

green daries

To be fair .... what he says ðŸ‘ðŸ˜႒

speckled_park

Never take chemical fertiliser advise from a farming forum, you won't be long breaking your P allowance

morphy87

green daries wrote: »

Index's are increased by adding p and k through your fertiliser slurry/dung.
You will get a return in your fertiliser by having a increase in grass growth for the season. but indexes will be slower to increase as some of your p and k are used in grass production if you are cutting silage use 0 7 30 and slurry and cut sward
For grazing as a poster said earlier 18 6 12 is probably the best alround fertiliser for less intensive systems

So at the start of the grazing season if I went with two bags of 18 6 12 to the acre and then nitrogen for the rest of the year after topping or grazing how would that work? What rate of application would you recommend for silage with the fertilizer you recommended?

morphy87

wrangler wrote: »

Applying fertiliser every year, the only way to rise indexes is to put on more fertiliser than the crops will use.
I don't know what your aim is, plenty on here will tell you to leave it alone.
but raising fertility will grow more grass and better grass, that grass will produce more thrive in animals than lesser quality grass .
However if you're not in a position to take advantage of it there's no point.
A neighbour asked me for similar advice a couple years ago, land was all weeds from cutting hay even to the point that he had to rise out of cutting hay and he wanted improved, I didn't soil test but told him to put 150kg 0 10 20/acre . It really responded well and after two years grazing it really looked wll this spring after two years,
He thought it looked so well this year that he cut hay offit again.....pfft
There's no future in building it up to sell hay/silage off it, better to leave it as it is

Your right more grass and better quality and the cattle thrive better,would you think spreading a bag of cut sward after cutting silage be a good idea?

wrangler

morphy87 wrote: »

Your right more grass and better quality and the cattle thrive better,would you think spreading a bag of cut sward after cutting silage be a good idea?

Silage will remove the equivalent of 150kg of 0 7 30 per acre so you're indexes will be going down if you're not replacing that for every cut.
18 6 12 is probably better after silage if you want to increase fertility

morphy87

wrangler wrote: »

Silage will remove the equivalent of 150kg of 0 7 30 per acre so you're indexes will be going down if you're not replacing that for every cut.
18 6 12 is probably better after silage if you want to increase fertility

Your right about 18 6 12 after the silage never thought of that ,and what figure would 150 kg an acre of 0 7 30 be? I presume 3 bags?

badgerhowlin

Castlekeeper wrote: »

Badger, apart from the fact tgat olit gas been leased gor years, can you gve us some more background info
What has the land been used for?
How has it been managed?
What level of fertiliser has it got annually?
What do you intend to use it for?
Is it old pasture or has it been re-seeded?
Are there any problems that need fixing? Eg is it damaged or does it need drainage?

What has the land been used for?
Been leased to dairy farmer as an out farm.
So he was been using the fields to feed his replacement restock
How has it been managed?
He is a family friend so he has treated it well enough
What level of fertiliser has it got annually?
Up to last year not really sure as i have not been around but last year it got
last year it got the following
fields 1,3,4 got 15-3-20 + s 4 bags to the ac march. Bailed silage off them in mid may,
Fields 1 and 3 got another 4 bags per ac of 20-4-10+s in May, silage cut end june

Field 2 got 4 bags per ac of 18/6/12 +s in March then same again in may, july
Field 4 got 4 bags per ac of 18/6/12 +s in May and july

What do you intend to use it for?
Field 1 is silage
Field 2,3,4 grass land for stock
Is it old pasture or has it been re-seeded?
Field 1 is getting reseeded this year
rest are probable reseeded 7 years ago
Are there any problems that need fixing? Eg is it damaged or does it need drainage?
Field 3 beside river. Drainage pipes are blocked and getting the field re done once the weather picks up and field dries out enough. Rest of the fields have no dranage problems and are on good ground.

Castlekeeper

badgerhowlin wrote: »

What has the land been used for?
Been leased to dairy farmer as an out farm.
So he was been using the fields to feed his replacement restock
How has it been managed?
He is a family friend so he has treated it well enough
What level of fertiliser has it got annually?
Up to last year not really sure as i have not been around but last year it got
last year it got the following
fields 1,3,4 got 15-3-20 + s 4 bags to the ac march. Bailed silage off them in mid may,
Fields 1 and 3 got another 4 bags per ac of 20-4-10+s in May, silage cut end june

Field 2 got 4 bags per ac of 18/6/12 +s in March then same again in may, july
Field 4 got 4 bags per ac of 18/6/12 +s in May and july

What do you intend to use it for?
Field 1 is silage
Field 2,3,4 grass land for stock
Is it old pasture or has it been re-seeded?
Field 1 is getting reseeded this year
rest are probable reseeded 7 years ago
Are there any problems that need fixing? Eg is it damaged or does it need drainage?
Field 3 beside river. Drainage pipes are blocked and getting the field re done once the weather picks up and field dries out enough. Rest of the fields have no dranage problems and are on good ground.

Thanks Badger, I had formed the impression that it was old permanent pasture that was being used for meadowing and maybe set stocked and thus become "run down".
Going by what you've said above, it has gone well down the chemical route, so, unless and until you've an interest or incentive to do otherwise, you might as well stick with the status quo.

The farmer wasn't skimping on the fertilisers, amyway, in fact I've rarely heard of rented land been treated so well, especially if the term was ending. Unless there's unusually low yields, there has been a lot put in so if you follow on as before it should keep producing. As previously said some organic matter, ie FYM or slurry, could be lacking on meadows especially if they haven't been getting any. If not easily available, you could use chicken manure pellets to replace some of your bag manure, it's a really good product but needs to be spread by a bulk spreader.
If the fields have been receiving that much fert for the last year's and are really underperforming despite good management, you may have to dig deeper, so to speak, and start looking at more detailed soil tests, Ca/Mg balances etc.
On the other hand if the fields are actually doing fine, keep going as you are and don't worry too much about the soil test, you can fix that with a marker, handsome is as handsome does, and it's a crude weapon.
Maybe go out and with a spade and start looking at the soil in different parts of the field, eg the centre, uncut corners, under trees, inside gaps etc. and see what things look, feel and even smell like and gamble away from there.
Best of luck with the farming, whatever you do, do your own thing, and try and enjoy it.