Ending a Tenancy

AGreorio

Hi All,

Once the tenants find a new property to move out within the landlords notice period, they still have to give a month notice to leave the property?

Thanks!

Graham

Assuming a part 4 tenancy see the below RTB guidance:

https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/ending-a-tenancy/notice-periods-that-a-landlord-should-give/

The_Conductor

In general- a landlord sucks it up- they gave notice, they're getting the property back early, its good manners to take it on the chin- and providing there is no damage over and above normal wear and tear, and utilities have been paid up to date- should return the deposit in full and wish the tenant all the very best for the future.

Unfortunately in today's world- where its next to impossible to get rentals- the opposite is far more likely to be the case- whereby the tenants out of necessity have to overstay (because they have nowhere else to go).

Its opening doors you really don't want to open- if you insist on going down the road of exact tenancy cut-offs. Life isn't perfect- and the current rental market out there is a bitch- you don't want to cause unnecessary fuss- particularly in light of the fact that its you who gave notice.

dennyk

Technically the tenant would still be obliged to give the required statutory notice to end their tenancy before the effective date of the landlord's own notice, but a shorter notice period is permissible if the landlord and the tenant mutually agree, and a landlord who's already served notice to a tenant would have to be extraordinarily foolish to take the risk of turning an amicable parting into an acrimonious overstay by trying to squeeze an extra month or so of rent out of the departing tenant.

JustMe,K

I would have assumed the tenant still needed to give notice in those circumstances but was advised last year that once a landlord has given notice, the tenant can move out whenever they want without giving notice, as the landlord has already terminated their agreement.

The_Conductor

JustMe,K wrote: »

I would have assumed the tenant still needed to give notice in those circumstances but was advised last year that once a landlord has given notice, the tenant can move out whenever they want without giving notice, as the landlord has already terminated their agreement.

Who gave you this advice?
It runs counter to the provisions of the Residential Tenancies Act- there is no provision for what you are suggesting.
Its wishful thinking on someone's part.
In theory its what happens- however, in practice, if a landlord decided to get sticky- they could hold the tenant liable to the end of the notice period.

What you are describing is not addressed in legislation- and while most landlords are happy to get their property back early- you could just encounter the odd lunatic who decides to spell out the letter of the law and refuse to budge from it.

JustMe,K

The_Conductor wrote: »

Who gave you this advice?
It runs counter to the provisions of the Residential Tenancies Act- there is no provision for what you are suggesting.
Its wishful thinking on someone's part.
In theory its what happens- however, in practice, if a landlord decided to get sticky- they could hold the tenant liable to the end of the notice period.

What you are describing is not addressed in legislation- and while most landlords are happy to get their property back early- you could just encounter the odd lunatic who decides to spell out the letter of the law and refuse to budge from it.

a legal professional.

The_Conductor

JustMe,K wrote: »

a legal professional.

There are qualified nurses or orthopaedic surgeons or doctors out there with more competence in Residential Tenancy law- than some 'legal professionals'. Simply asking a solicitor for advice (or indeed a doctor) means very little if you are seeking information outside of their core competencies.

There are some organisations offering advice on tenancy law- who have been shown conclusively to be offering, time and time again, completely biased advice that has little grounding in actual law- because it suits their purpose.

'A legal professional' means very little.

Graham

JustMe,K wrote: »

I would have assumed the tenant still needed to give notice in those circumstances but was advised last year that once a landlord has given notice, the tenant can move out whenever they want without giving notice, as the landlord has already terminated their agreement.

There is a difference between not having to give notice and seeing out the notice that has been given.

While you're probably right that a tenant that has been given notice, isn't then required to give notice. That does not mean the tenant does not contractually/legally have to see out the full notice period.

That said, many landlords would be happy to see the earlier departure of a tenant that has already been given notice.

JustMe,K

Like I said, I was surprised to be told that and I would presume that in the current housing climate such situations aren't regularly tested in highly populated areas. It would be interesting to see what would happen if a landlord was to pursue a tenant for leaving early.

Graham

My guess, landlord might just retain the proportion of the deposit required to cover the notice period.

punisher5112

Graham wrote: »

My guess, landlord might just retain the proportion of the deposit required to cover the notice period.

Can't do that.

It can only be withheld for damages or cleaning which have invoices or receipts to prove.

I'd look at it this way, isn't it better they're leaving and not over holding and it ends up costing more especially if they stop paying.

Graham

This deposit is held by the landlord and is returned at the end of the tenancy to the tenant, once no rent arrears, bills, taxes or charges are due or damage beyond normal wear and tear has occured.

If at the end of the tenancy, there is rent outstanding, the landlord may retain part or all of the deposit to cover the rent arrears.

If a tenant provides insufficient notice of their termination of the tenancy, or they terminate a fixed term tenancy before the end of the agreed term.

Source: RTB

dennyk

punisher5112 wrote: »

Can't do that.

It can only be withheld for damages or cleaning which have invoices or receipts to prove.

I'd look at it this way, isn't it better they're leaving and not over holding and it ends up costing more especially if they stop paying.

The deposit can be retained to cover rent arrears, which the tenant would have if they stopped paying rent before the end of the landlord's notice period (or the end of their own notice period, whichever comes first).

meijin

from https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/downloads/tribunal-report/TR0319-003628_Report.pdf

The Tribunal finds that the Landlord was not entitled to stipulate a period in which the Tenant had to remain in the dwelling, as if the requirements of a valid notice of termination were met, the Tenant would have been entitled to vacate at any time on or before the termination date in the notice of termination.

and another one, even with invalid notice, and fixed term lease https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/downloads/tribunal-report/TR0319-003630_Report.pdf

As a notice of termination had
been served by the Appellant Landlord, albeit that it was invalid, the Respondent Tenants
were only under an obligation to pay rent until such time as they vacated the dwelling,
given that under s. 62 they are required to vacate the dwelling “on or before” the
termination date. In those circumstances, the Appellant Landlord was not entitled to retain
the deposit and should have returned it to the Respondent Tenants.

Graham

Thanks Meijin, that certainly appears to clarify the RTBs interpretation where a landlord issues a notice of termination.