Groove cut under floor heating

Yellow_Fern

Hi,
I am interested in fitting under floor heating in my insulated concrete floor. I have heard it been fitted in groves cut into existing cement floors. I know cutting concrete is very messy but companies exist in the UK that have a method that is dust free. Do any Irish companies offer this? Seems obvious with all the heat pumps being retrofitted now. I dont want to dig up my floor and clip on methods will lose ceiling space.

sydthebeat

Sounds like a method that would seriously effect the structural integrity of your floor slab

Also, if inadequate insulation is under this slab, then its a waste of money

Markcheese

Isn't there a system with a plastic grid fixed to existing floor, that you click the pipes in and then "float" a floor over it, obviously it raises your floor and your existing insulation needs to be good,.
as to where I saw it....

Markcheese

https://youtu.be/yzMpZPitrf0

Just Googled retro fitting underfloor heating , this came up, it works with a screed, no idea how "good it is" or if its easily available in Ireland,
But seems less extreme than cutting the ****e out of your floor...
There's other crowds doing similar...

Gumbo

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

Hi,
I am interested in fitting under floor heating in my insulated concrete floor. I have heard it been fitted in groves cut into existing cement floors. I know cutting concrete is very messy but companies exist in the UK that have a method that is dust free. Do any Irish companies offer this? Seems obvious with all the heat pumps being retrofitted now. I dont want to dig up my floor and clip on methods will lose ceiling space.

When was your concrete floor slab poured?
o you know the thickness and what insulation is under it?

Dudda

I'm using something like this in an area of my house.

In areas of my house I dug out the floor and subfloor so I could put down lots of insulation but from the areas I couldn't did out (due to cost and disruption it causes) I'm using something like this
https://www.wundatrade.co.uk/product-category/home/overfloor-retro-fit-solutions/reftro-fit-floor-heating-kits/ *
I've an ok amount of insulation. Obviously the more insulation you have the better it works. It will raise the finished floor level if you put it over the existing. I really wouldn't go cutting groves out of a concrete floor. It sounds like a disaster and half a$$ way of doing it.
An option might be to just dig out the screed and put down some insulation and the above kit like what I'm at. This is presuming you've a concrete sub floor.


*Obviously lots of products are available and I've no link to this company.

Yellow_Fern

The groves go down about 16 mm. I hadn't thought if they could damage the cement floor but perhaps so. I have a regular modern insulated cement floor. These retrofit plate UFH systems look great but I am wondered about door thresholds and uneven steps.

Dudda

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

The groves go down about 16 mm. I hadn't thought if they could damage the cement floor but perhaps so. I have a regular modern insulated cement floor. These retrofit plate UFH systems look great but I am wondered about door thresholds and uneven steps.

Do you know the buildup? Is it from bottom; crushed stone, then reinforced concrete subfloor, then insulation and then cement screed or do you have crushed stone, then insulation and reinforced concrete floor with a flat finish?

autumnalcore

What year was it built? There's no such thing as a regular modern insulated concrete floor. Things in Ireland are generally built to the minimum prevailing spec at the time they were built (if you're lucky)

Simplest solution is insulation boards with built in aluminium spreader plates (don't go for the cheaper foil ones), you'll gain about 20mm in floor height though and as said if insulation isn't sufficient then you are throwing away money especially if you cover it with timber.

Yellow_Fern

autumnalcore wrote: »

What year was it built? There's no such thing as a regular modern insulated concrete floor. Things in Ireland are generally built to the minimum prevailing spec at the time they were built (if you're lucky)

Simplest solution is insulation boards with built in aluminium spreader plates (don't go for the cheaper foil ones), you'll gain about 20mm in floor height though and as said if insulation isn't sufficient then you are throwing away money especially if you cover it with timber.

Built in the last four years. Would you not have an off step on step 1 and step 2? I hate uneven steps in sheds and castles.

sydthebeat

built in the last four years would lead me to ask the question "why do you want to do this"?

whats your current heat supply? oil? A2W?

i assume a radiator system currently?

do you want to do UFH everywhere?

Yellow_Fern

It is just a gas powered house with radiators everywhere. We try want to try UFH to save space and have warmer floors while heating the house. We are not sure if we really wish for it on every floor just yet.

randombar

Resurrecting an old one here. Looking at an UFH retrofit myself, just in the kitchen initially.

existing floor:

150mm 804

Radon

140mm Xtratherm thin r

150mm 30n concrete

In two mins about milling.

As I'm only doing the retro one area at a time there will be a step.

Also as I'm mixing radiators with UFH would there be a greater risk of blockages in the UFH especially with thin pipes.

Hard to tell what's better tbh.

BenIrishHome

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120223325#Comment_120223325

Hey, Randombar, your UFH should use different pipe from the rads, from an UFH manifold, while your rads come straight from the boiler/heatpump. you can easily have both.

I am also picking up on this old thread. Anyone have success with these concrete milling systems or lo-profile UFH?

I see they are more common in the UK but I was wondering if our better (more resctrictive) building regs would prevent them here. Both the One Stop Shops i have spoken to have said i HAVE TO dig out floors, put down radon membrane + 100-150mm insulation etc. One quoted me €38000 so far for a 90sq m ground floor.

For ref, i have a 2001 dormer bungalow in Wicklow. Sure has some insulation under the floors, right? Our kitchen floor near back doors is FREEZING, hence why need UFH!

[Also I've never heard of anyone getting sick from Radon]

I only found two companies adverting the concrete milling in Ireland. ProEnergyRetrofit in Limerick & Blackwell Energy in Cavan.

I'd prefer to mill the floors and even if some leaches into the ground slab, i would heat it at cheap night rates (or with solar) and let the heat dissipate during the rest of the day. Is that a reasonable thing? I will be getting A2W etc…

Appreciate to hear anyone's experience. Thanks

randombar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122938971#Comment_122938971

I got the milling done afterwards, did exactly what you're saying.

Was a dose of a job to get the old tiles up but the lads were in and out in two days, fantastic job.

UFH is fantastic, much more balanced heat around the house.

Markcheese

I'd check does a particularly cold patch in one part of the house mean there's a problem with the insulation in that point , might be worth ripping up that corner if no where else -

BenIrishHome

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122941561#Comment_122941561

yes that’s what I am thinking. The bit by the kitchen back door. We might do a small 3x1m glass box extension here so we would dig out that particularly cold part of the kitchen and pour a new floor in that area so the most exposed back part of the house has extra underfloor and perimeter insulation. Make sure this part of our kitchen I toasty warm.

BenIrishHome

Thanks randombar! Do you find it efficient enough? Not costing you the earth? How does it store heat and how do you use it (night vs day)?

I got a call back from proEnergyRetrofit straight away yesterday after I emailed them for advice. Super helpful. Very reassuring this is a viable alternative to digging up the whole floor.

randombar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122941581#Comment_122941581

It does retain the heat quite well. For October/Mid Nov it (Ecodan HP) was only coming on for the cheap rate at night. It does have to heat the water separately so it does that first. This time of year it's working a bit harder so would be on a bit more (mornings and evenings). The reports are only okish from Ecodan. Need to add the shelly to get a proper view of what's going on but that's on a long list. PM me if you've any questions etc. can send some photos