What if

mattthetrasher

In the last 8 years 100,000 farmers have been wiped out in the USA alone,in what can only be termed as industrial genocide.The worst part is we are next farmers are fighting amongst themselves while our processors are rolling in cash laughing at the stupid slaving farmers.so what if..... what if we scale up high output low margin ..answer no it only makes slaves of ourselves and our families all work and no pay = slavery .what if..... we go shelter under the green umbrella cut production worldwide by say 40% cull your worst animals pigs sheep cows beef everything,everywhere get a decent price for what we do have and imagine profit what if margins double or triple on milk world cheap food policy ended what if beef made profits with half the numbers and farmers held up as hero’s for saving the earth ..what if indeed

_Brian

mattthetrasher wrote: »

In the last 8 years 100,000 farmers have been wiped out in the USA alone,in what can only be termed as industrial genocide.The worst part is we are next farmers are fighting amongst themselves while our processors are rolling in cash laughing at the stupid slaving farmers.so what if..... what if we scale up high output low margin ..answer no it only makes slaves of ourselves and our families all work and no pay = slavery .what if..... we go shelter under the green umbrella cut production worldwide by say 40% cull your worst animals pigs sheep cows beef everything,everywhere get a decent price for what we do have and imagine profit what if margins double or triple on milk world cheap food policy ended what if beef made profits with half the numbers and farmers held up as hero’s for saving the earth ..what if indeed

I’m worried that you associated cutting animal numbers with “saving the earth”

Fossil fuel consumption is way bigger threat to the earth than farming animals. Let’s see some proper movement on elimination of needles flights before we start cutting the food supply.

I’m all for extensive animal farming as a better way, but let’s not go with the lie that it’s the solution to save the earth, since the earth isn’t under threat from animals.

djmc

mattthetrasher wrote: »

In the last 8 years 100,000 farmers have been wiped out in the USA alone,in what can only be termed as industrial genocide.The worst part is we are next farmers are fighting amongst themselves while our processors are rolling in cash laughing at the stupid slaving farmers.so what if..... what if we scale up high output low margin ..answer no it only makes slaves of ourselves and our families all work and no pay = slavery .what if..... we go shelter under the green umbrella cut production worldwide by say 40% cull your worst animals pigs sheep cows beef everything,everywhere get a decent price for what we do have and imagine profit what if margins double or triple on milk world cheap food policy ended what if beef made profits with half the numbers and farmers held up as hero’s for saving the earth ..what if indeed

In an ideal world it would be great if the farmers of the world could stick together and cut production as part of a food strike protest but unfortunately I cant see it ever happening as people are always looking to make quick money and if some farmers cut back more would seize the opportunity and scale up.
Food is so plentiful and cheap in todays world most people on the planet wont even know where it comes from

mattthetrasher

_Brian wrote: »

I’m worried that you associated cutting animal numbers with “saving the earth”

Fossil fuel consumption is way bigger threat to the earth than farming animals. Let’s see some proper movement on elimination of needles flights before we start cutting the food supply.

I’m all for extensive animal farming as a better way, but let’s not go with the lie that it’s the solution to save the earth, since the earth isn’t under threat from animals.

I know and you know that farming is being scapegoated but if we as farmers can make more money by cutting production why not if we look at the pig prices at the moment they have gone over €2/kg it’s supply and demand the oil producing nations control the price by supply why don’t we

mattthetrasher

djmc wrote: »

In an ideal world it would be great if the farmers of the world could stick together and cut production as part of a food strike protest but unfortunately I cant see it ever happening as people are always looking to make quick money and if some farmers cut back more would seize the opportunity and scale up.
Food is so plentiful and cheap in todays world most people on the planet wont even know where it comes from

As it is they neither know nor care we are all guilty of selling something at a good price and saying to ourselves ‘tis a pity I didn’t have twice as many and turn around the following year and have two or maybe even three times as many and prices end up on the floor but if we stop the tail wagging the dog it’s the only way that family farms will survive

Lano Lynn

you just have to look at what has happened already to see what will happen the US family farm is being wiped out and corporate farm companies step in with cheap (often illegal)labour ,they go bust and the clever hedge fund sells out to an even bigger corporate bunch of smart lads. this is repeated in NZ, OZ, south America etc .

cheap food has a cost and the environmental and social cost is enormous

alps

mattthetrasher wrote: »

In the last 8 years 100,000 farmers have been wiped out in the USA alone,in what can only be termed as industrial genocide.The worst part is we are next farmers are fighting amongst themselves while our processors are rolling in cash laughing at the stupid slaving farmers.so what if..... what if we scale up high output low margin ..answer no it only makes slaves of ourselves and our families all work and no pay = slavery .what if..... we go shelter under the green umbrella cut production worldwide by say 40% cull your worst animals pigs sheep cows beef everything,everywhere get a decent price for what we do have and imagine profit what if margins double or triple on milk world cheap food policy ended what if beef made profits with half the numbers and farmers held up as hero’s for saving the earth ..what if indeed

Suppose the concept could work...how could you possibly ensure that every farm reduced output, and how could you ensure that the price of product started to rise as production decreased.

How could you stop new food producers starting up as increased prices make new production areas and methods viable, and also means that substitute foods become economical?

mattthetrasher

alps wrote: »

Suppose the concept could work...how could you possibly ensure that every farm reduced output, and how could you ensure that the price of product started to rise as production decreased.

How could you stop new food producers starting up as increased prices make new production areas and methods viable, and also means that substitute foods become economical?

They won’t all reduce but if farmer producer groups sold the produce they may be able to control that and also new startups.increased prices could mean substitutes we would expect that,it would not be perfect and we would be more than naive to expect it would but can it honestly continue with the status quo.Along with increased product prices you should have much reduced input costs such as feed ,fertilizer and silage costs.Bank costs, labour,machinery running.There are so many industries living on farmers backs we could do with a good old shake off.

mattthetrasher

Lano Lynn wrote: »

you just have to look at what has happened already to see what will happen the US family farm is being wiped out and corporate farm companies step in with cheap (often illegal)labour ,they go bust and the clever hedge fund sells out to an even bigger corporate bunch of smart lads. this is repeated in NZ, OZ, south America etc .

cheap food has a cost and the environmental and social cost is enormous

And now is the time for farmers to talk openly about regaining control of our produce and being properly rewarded for our work not taking whatever the processors decide they will get away with giving us to keep us ticking over while they make millions off our backs
If nothing else if this conversation got some legs on it wouldn’t it get them wondering

Lano Lynn

there is an increasing realisation among economists (and some are even admitting it) that simple supply and demand models and globalisation theory are flawed and not delivering benefits to the majority of the world population.

I do believe climate change is real and human behaviour is a major cause.
I don't believe that agriculture deserves a fraction of the blame it is getting.

but I am absolutely sure that if big buissness requires every square inch of Leitrim to be planted in sitka or the national sheep flock reduced by 99% (the remaining 1% will be needed for art instalations and tourist photo ops)
so that the 'consumer' can continue to fly for city breaks several times a year and buy fast fashion online from Asian sweat shops while eating south American beef ready meals then that is what will be done.

I started farming as the macsharry reforms were being formulated and since 1992 worked through various agreements ,proposals, coupling, decoupling gatt, wto, greening, mercosor etc etc each one has screwed the primary producer with ever more responsibility and less return and security and an ever increasing level of hipocracy from politicians and Davos types.

so OP the deck is stacked against your theory but I do think western consumers could benefit from a strong dose of hungry.

mattthetrasher

Lano Lynn wrote: »

there is an increasing realisation among economists (and some are even admitting it) that simple supply and demand models and globalisation theory are flawed and not delivering benefits to the majority of the world population.

I do believe climate change is real and human behaviour is a major cause.
I don't believe that agriculture deserves a fraction of the blame it is getting.

but I am absolutely sure that if big buissness requires every square inch of Leitrim to be planted in sitka or the national sheep flock reduced by 99% (the remaining 1% will be needed for art instalations and tourist photo ops)
so that the 'consumer' can continue to fly for city breaks several times a year and buy fast fashion online from Asian sweat shops while eating south American beef ready meals then that is what will be done.

I started farming as the macsharry reforms were being formulated and since 1992 worked through various agreements ,proposals, coupling, decoupling gatt, wto, greening, mercosor etc etc each one has screwed the primary producer with ever more responsibility and less return and security and an ever increasing level of hipocracy from politicians and Davos types.

so OP the deck is stacked against your theory but I do think western consumers could benefit from a strong dose of hungry.

Well lano we are the same vintage I started in 1991 and I agree with all your saying but the deck isn’t stacked against me it’s stacked against us all and maybe even the South Americans might join us now that our niche beef is now being sold at the same price as their untagged unregulated beef industry grazed on the graveyard of the Amazon

Birdnuts

20 farmers an hour are leaving the sector in the EU according to something I heard on the radio recently

Lano Lynn

What if?...………..
the clever people decided that because farming is destroying the planet they stopped producing chemical urea etc and closed all the pesticide factories all of them world wide...… intensive agriculture would cease and the peasants would be the toast of wall st.………..(I must have forgotten my anti delusion pill today):D

mattthetrasher

Lano Lynn wrote: »

What if?...………..
the clever people decided that because farming is destroying the planet they stopped producing chemical urea etc and closed all the pesticide factories all of them world wide...… intensive agriculture would cease and the peasants would be the toast of wall st.………..(I must have forgotten my anti delusion pill today):D

😂😂me too and if we keep forgetting to take them the pharmaceutical companies will fold too and we peasants will rule the world🥳🀪

Lano Lynn

mattthetrasher wrote: »

����me too and if we keep forgetting to take them the pharmaceutical companies will fold too and we peasants will rule the world����

it would just corrupt us and we would lose or natural charm:D