Commercial SUVs

pawdee

Can someone please explain to me how it's possible that a 2019 VW Toureag without a back seat costs 47,950 and a 2019 one with a back seat costs 91,500?

43,550 for a 3 seater sofa (with a cramped middle seat) seems a little excessive. Tax is 333 a year for the commercial and 750 a year for the other. So if you keep the car ten years you pay 47,720 for having a back seat?

Who came up with this system? Robert Mugabe? Is there anything similar anywhere else in the developed world? What am I missing?

Water2626262

pawdee wrote: »

Can someone please explain to me how it's possible that a 2019 VW Toureag without a back seat costs 47,950 and a 2019 one with a back seat costs 91,500?

43,550 for a 3 seater sofa (with a cramped middle seat) seems a little excessive. Tax is 333 a year for the commercial and 750 a year for the other. So if you keep the car ten years you pay 47,720 for having a back seat?

Who came up with this system? Robert Mugabe? Is there anything similar anywhere else in the developed world? What am I missing?

It’s the amount VRT applied. Also is 47k ex VAT?

Heres Johnny

pawdee wrote: »

Can someone please explain to me how it's possible that a 2019 VW Toureag without a back seat costs 47,950 and a 2019 one with a back seat costs 91,500?

43,550 for a 3 seater sofa (with a cramped middle seat) seems a little excessive. Tax is 333 a year for the commercial and 750 a year for the other. So if you keep the car ten years you pay 47,720 for having a back seat?

Who came up with this system? Robert Mugabe? Is there anything similar anywhere else in the developed world? What am I missing?

47,950 is ex vat price as vat registered companies can claim the vat back on a commercial

Add 23% on and it's going to be in the region of 60k

Still a bit of a gap to be made up
Lower vrt rate on a commercial than a passenger too and I imagine the toureg is pretty high rate for vrt as it won't be an efficient car. Now you might be up to 70k like for like but not sure of rates on vrt.

Now I'd hazard a guess the commercial is the base model with no extras where the passenger at 90k would be the higher spec model with plenty of extras pushing up price.

Vw charge way more for the passenger with extras and tax is levied as a percentage of price.

This happens in plenty of countries, we are by no stretch of the imagination the dearest motoring country in Europe. Dearer than UK which we benchmark against usually but we are also, on average, wealthier than the average UK person.

Onky in Ireland! My least favourite rant that goes on all the time like everywhere else is some beautiful utopia with no crime, perfect legal systems and cheap motoring.

A 90k touareg is an optional, luxury item and should be taxed heavily.

California Dreamer

Heres Johnny wrote: »

A 90k touareg is an optional, luxury item and should be taxed heavily.

So we should all drive bog standard 1 litre cars with little or no imagination?

Heres Johnny

California Dreamer wrote: »

So we should all drive bog standard 1 litre cars with little or no imagination?

No. Drive whatever car you can afford.

colm_mcm

One is a tax dodge, the other isn’t. Simple.

Lots of countries have anomalies in their systems. Look at the chicken tax in the US for example.

colm_mcm

colm_mcm wrote: »

One is a tax dodge, the other isn’t. Simple.

Lots of countries have anomalies in their systems. Look at the chicken tax in the US for example.

One is totally and utterly over taxed and one is at least in the ball park of reasonable more like it.

colm_mcm

colm_mcm wrote: »

One is a tax dodge, the other isn’t. Simple.
......

I can see the tax dodge angle with 5 seaters but 2 seat SUVs are fairly undodgy from a tax viewpoint.

Marcusm

Augeo wrote: »

I can see the tax dodge angle with 5 seaters but 2 seat SUVs are fairly undodgy from a tax viewpoint.

Not really; N1 classification is designated as vehicles designed and constructed primarily for the carriage of goods. None of these vehicles should have ever qualified.

So all car derived vans shouldn't have qualified as vans. Fiesta vans etc?

AMKC

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Vw charge way more for the passenger with extras and tax is levied as a percentage of price.

This happens in plenty of countries, we are by no stretch of the imagination the dearest motoring country in Europe. Dearer than UK which we benchmark against usually but we are also, on average, wealthier than the average UK person.

Only in Ireland! My least favourite rant that goes on all the time like everywhere else is some beautiful utopia with no crime, perfect legal systems and cheap motoring.

A 90k touareg is an optional, luxury item and should be taxed heavily.

Fyp for you.

Also I agree that Ireland in not a beautiful utopia that has no crime and perfect legal system. Be great if it was but its just not. The legal system in this country is broken and backwards.

AMKC

AMKC wrote: »

Fyp for you.

Also I agree that Ireland in not a beautiful utopia that has no crime and perfect legal system. Be great if it was but its just not. The legal system in this country is broken and backwards.

Fairly difficult to see what you did to it tbh.

AMKC

Augeo wrote: »

Fairly difficult to see what you did to it tbh.

Just took out a K and put in an L in a four letter word at the start of the third last sentence.

Heres Johnny

AMKC wrote: »

Just took out a K and put in an L in a four letter word at the start of the third last sentence.

It was my post he fixed (don't you just love when people fyp) and I can't see what he did. What was it?

Edit: I see it now, fixed a typo. Thanks

Marcusm

Augeo wrote: »

So all car derived vans shouldn't have qualified as vans. Fiesta vans etc?

The dividing line has been set at 3 seats if the load space is in the same vehicle compartment so those remain ok. As do multiseat crewcabs where the load area is separate - Hilux etc. Perversely, a Transit type vehicle with a second row of seats are caught. Real tradesmen can criticise the people who thought Discos Range Rovers and Bentaygas should qualify. In reality a crew vehicle with 5 seats for the work crew would need a much bigger load bay to carry the tools.

Augeo

Augeo wrote: »

I can see the tax dodge angle with 5 seaters but 2 seat SUVs are fairly undodgy from a tax viewpoint.

Marcusm wrote: »

Not really; N1 classification is designated as vehicles designed and constructed primarily for the carriage of goods. None of these vehicles should have ever qualified.

Augeo wrote: »

So all car derived vans shouldn't have qualified as vans. Fiesta vans etc?

Marcusm wrote: »

The dividing line has been set at 3 seats if the load space is in the same vehicle compartment so those remain ok. As do multiseat crewcabs where the load area is separate - Hilux etc. Perversely, a Transit type vehicle with a second row of seats are caught. Real tradesmen can criticise the people who thought Discos Range Rovers and Bentaygas should qualify. In reality a crew vehicle with 5 seats for the work crew would need a much bigger load bay to carry the tools.

Yeah, I agree, my initial point was 2 seat SUVs are fairly undodgy from a tax viewpoint. Like, they're essentially vans.

Marcusm

Marcusm wrote: »

The dividing line has been set at 3 seats if the load space is in the same vehicle compartment so those remain ok. As do multiseat crewcabs where the load area is separate - Hilux etc. Perversely, a Transit type vehicle with a second row of seats are caught. Real tradesmen can criticise the people who thought Discos Range Rovers and Bentaygas should qualify. In reality a crew vehicle with 5 seats for the work crew would need a much bigger load bay to carry the tools.

If they are certified from factory then they are still ok. Do ford make a crew cab transit, I’d be surprised if they didn’t and once it’s factory certified as commercial it’s still fine. Same for any 4x4, just look at paddy connollys stock he has stuff in 5 seat commercial that wasn’t available before the rules changed Land Rover stuff mostly as they obviously have a deal with the factory to certify stuff.

Marcusm

Sergio Hot Stirrup wrote: »

If they are certified from factory then they are still ok. Do ford make a crew cab transit, I’d be surprised if they didn’t and once it’s factory certified as commercial it’s still fine. Same for any 4x4, just look at paddy connollys stock he has stuff in 5 seat commercial that wasn’t available before the rules changed Land Rover stuff mostly as they obviously have a deal with the factory to certify stuff.

Not for VRT anymore; quote from Revenue.

Also included in the Category A rate, from 31 July 2018, are those N1 vehicles that have 4 or more seats and in which the passenger and cargo/functional compartments are contained in a single unit. A single unit is considered as:
An area of a vehicle that is covered by a generally continuous roof or that has a generally continuous floor or floorpan.
These vehicles will be charged VRT in the same manner as M1 vehicles i.e. the charge will be levied by reference to their CO2 emissions in accordance with table below. Therefore, it is essential that the CO2 of the vehicle is available when presenting the vehicle for registration to ensure the correct charge to tax.

Marcusm

Marcusm wrote: »

Not for VRT anymore; quote from Revenue.

Also included in the Category A rate, from 31 July 2018, are those N1 vehicles that have 4 or more seats and in which the passenger and cargo/functional compartments are contained in a single unit. A single unit is considered as:
An area of a vehicle that is covered by a generally continuous roof or that has a generally continuous floor or floorpan.
These vehicles will be charged VRT in the same manner as M1 vehicles i.e. the charge will be levied by reference to their CO2 emissions in accordance with table below. Therefore, it is essential that the CO2 of the vehicle is available when presenting the vehicle for registration to ensure the correct charge to tax.

The vrt I’m not sure off but you can reclaim VAT and tax them commercially.