Finding septic drain field

Igotadose

Any recommendations on clever, not too destructive way to locate a septic drain field? The planning permission shows it located in a part of the yard not too close to the house, but we've had no luck finding it at all, there are no pipes, manholes, nothing.

I want to avoid bringing in a digger to root around in the yard if at all possible.

The septic tank is near the house, equipped with a pump that pumps in the approximate direction of where the planning permission states. This is in a 'wild' part of the yard - other side of an earthen "berm" (wall of stones, grass, dirt) that until a couple weeks ago had decades of blackberries and whatnot in it. Had the land cleared, but nothing's shown up.

I know that back in the US, you could hire people with ground radar to locate pipes, as well as some of the septic companies actually had transmitters you could flush and track via rfid or some such. Haven't found anything like that here in West Kerry, but maybe I'm asking the wrong questions.

I'm trying to locate the field in order to begin the process for planning permission, which requires 'septic system certification' including the field. House is 15 years old if that matters.

Recommendations welcome, thanks.

Hoagy

I think you could have a problem with certification in any case.

The EPA Code of Practice stipulates that the outflow from the tank runs by gravity to a distribution box which is accessible for inspection.

_Brian

I’d imagine some of the drain cleaning companies will be able to locate it for you.

Odelay

_Brian wrote: »

I’d imagine some of the drain cleaning companies will be able to locate it for you.

Would agree. These lads are well used to these situations. Best to ask for an experienced operator when making the call.

muffler

+1 on the last couple of posts.

A couple of tell tale signs you could watch out for is where frost is clearing faster on the soil on a cold morning (heat from tank) and / or look out for lush green grass or copious amounts of nettles growing which indicates sewage in the immediate area.

Igotadose

muffler wrote: »

+1 on the last couple of posts.

A couple of tell tale signs you could watch out for is where frost is clearing faster on the soil on a cold morning (heat from tank) and / or look out for lush green grass or copious amounts of nettles growing which indicates sewage in the immediate area.

Thanks for all the information everyone. The planning documents show it somewhere it isn't. Digging around we found where it was constructed & the distribution box installed. Unfortunately, - now the problem is, there's no water flowing to it. It's going 'somewhere'.

Have a look at various satellite images from google or bing.

If they were taken during the drought a few years ago they might show up a greener if the grass had otherwise died back.

shane b

Igotadose wrote: »

the distribution box installed. Unfortunately, - now the problem is, there's no water flowing to it.

How do you know there is no water flowing to the distribution box? Is the box dry?
I have a septic tank with a treatment unit that includes a pump. The pump out from the tank to the distribution box is on a timed basis, normally an 8 hour cycle.
Do you know what make of treatment unit is installed? if there is a pump installed there must be a details on the control panel somewhere.

mickdw

If nothing is reaching the distribution box, start rodding from box back to tank or tank to box and see where obstruction is.
The pipe is likely damaged somewhere.
Alternatively, someone did a botch job at some stage due to poorly functioning percolation system. If that is the case, they have likely cut flow to percolation and basically diverted it to a drain.
Should be easy enough to figure out.

Igotadose

The D-box is indeed dry (we just discovered it a few months ago - it was in a blackberry thicket in a side yard. This is what precipitated all the investigation we've been doing). As far as I can tell, the box has always been dry. It even lacks a lid. Running the pump doesn't result in any water entering the box, we've tried this a number of times.

Theengineer we had out said that the pipes and dbox were compliant for the time the field was built (early 2000's), and that the material in the field was compliant as well.

My theory is that the outflow from the tank, had some problem reaching the d-box and the builder (the owner, who has taken numerous other shortcuts that we're undoing), diverted it to a rainwater soakaway nearby when something didn't work.

There have never been any signs of lines in the lawn, nor odors, since we've moved in, and the grass/weed mix grows uniformly throughout the area. Even in last year's month+ drought, nothing showed up and the lawn dried out.

mickdw

Igotadose wrote: »

The D-box is indeed dry (we just discovered it a few months ago - it was in a blackberry thicket in a side yard. This is what precipitated all the investigation we've been doing). As far as I can tell, the box has always been dry. It even lacks a lid. Running the pump doesn't result in any water entering the box, we've tried this a number of times.

Theengineer we had out said that the pipes and dbox were compliant for the time the field was built (early 2000's), and that the material in the field was compliant as well.

My theory is that the outflow from the tank, had some problem reaching the d-box and the builder (the owner, who has taken numerous other shortcuts that we're undoing), diverted it to a rainwater soakaway nearby when something didn't work.

There have never been any signs of lines in the lawn, nor odors, since we've moved in, and the grass/weed mix grows uniformly throughout the area. Even in last year's month+ drought, nothing showed up and the lawn dried out.

Is this system pushing the effluent uphill from the septic tank? If not, the pump won't be supposed to push effluent out at all, only an air pump to add air to the effluent in the tank to aid treatment.
If it is pumping up hill, it should be relatively easy to sort as generally the riser is just a 1.75 inch wavin pipe between tank and distribution box.

listermint

Igotadose wrote: »

Thanks for all the information everyone. The planning documents show it somewhere it isn't. Digging around we found where it was constructed & the distribution box installed. Unfortunately, - now the problem is, there's no water flowing to it. It's going 'somewhere'.

had the same problem, the feed pipe had a join in it and it had sagged slightly resulting in blockages and seeping into the soil.

Are you getting blockages anywhere ?

I just drew a straight line from the the inlet pipe to the tank back to the nearest manhole and made that the line. Tried putting a rod down it until it got stuck. Measure the length and dug up where the distance was.

Found the sagged joint, cut it all out and replaced both sides with new pipe and joins and filled them properly with stones and sand for support

Igotadose

listermint wrote: »

had the same problem, the feed pipe had a join in it and it had sagged slightly resulting in blockages and seeping into the soil.

Are you getting blockages anywhere ?

I just drew a straight line from the the inlet pipe to the tank back to the nearest manhole and made that the line. Tried putting a rod down it until it got stuck. Measure the length and dug up where the distance was.

Found the sagged joint, cut it all out and replaced both sides with new pipe and joins and filled them properly with stones and sand for support

Don't know if it's getting blockages yet. The pump goes slightly uphill - the 'mound' that the Dbox is at the top of, is about a meter above the septic tank.
I will see about rods and determining if its simply a break/block or not. The scary thing is it seems its never been used; the lack of a lid on the d-box concerns me, it should have one.

shane b

If the d-box is dry the pump put from the tank must be going elsewhere. Depending on the size of outlet pipe from the pump maybe try some rods or a cobra reel to determine how far the pipe goes. That should give you an indication of how far from the tank the waste is being pumped to.

_Brian

Why is this a problem ?

If the tank is working, your garden not flooding, why are you searching for this ?

Igotadose

_Brian wrote: »

Why is this a problem ?

If the tank is working, your garden not flooding, why are you searching for this ?

Considering getting planning permission for an add-on, the council are fussy about the septic systems for the homes in our area as it's very boggy.

Car99

shane b wrote: »

If the d-box is dry the pump put from the tank must be going elsewhere. Depending on the size of outlet pipe from the pump maybe try some rods or a cobra reel to determine how far the pipe goes. That should give you an indication of how far from the tank the waste is being pumped to.

No waste shoukd come out of the tank to the distribution box , the distribution box only recieves water pumped from the third chamber of a biocycle system . By the time the water gets to pumped out it should be relatively clean , clear and odourless.

Normally a 1.5 inch hydrodare pipe takes the water to the percolation area distribution box so if you know where the treatment tank is and where the distribution box is it would not be difficult to run a new hydrodare pipe from the pump to the distribution box.

Igotadose

Car99 wrote: »

No waste shoukd come out of the tank to the distribution box , the distribution box only recieves water pumped from the third chamber of a biocycle system . By the time the water gets to pumped out it should be relatively clean , clear and odourless.

Normally a 1.5 inch hydrodare pipe takes the water to the percolation area distribution box so if you know where the treatment tank is and where the distribution box is it would not be difficult to run a new hydrodare pipe from the pump to the distribution box.

There is a 1.5 inch pipe running to the d-box from 'somewhere', we've not yet traced it all the way back to the pump in the septic tank. However, there's no sign of there ever being anything in the d-box, no water, nothing. Running the pump in the septic tank doesn't result in any water pumped to the box. And as you point out, you have a massive problem should something other than water get into the d-box.

Long term I expect to be running a new pipe to the box, or to a new box. The pipes that drain the box are not to specifications, either. They're yellow perforated 'water drain' pipe commonly used for drainage, the specs call for a red, rigid pipe instead, I think about 10cm in diameter.

Car99

Igotadose wrote: »

There is a 1.5 inch pipe running to the d-box from 'somewhere', we've not yet traced it all the way back to the pump in the septic tank. However, there's no sign of there ever being anything in the d-box, no water, nothing. Running the pump in the septic tank doesn't result in any water pumped to the box. And as you point out, you have a massive problem should something other than water get into the d-box.

Long term I expect to be running a new pipe to the box, or to a new box. The pipes that drain the box are not to specifications, either. They're yellow perforated 'water drain' pipe commonly used for drainage, the specs call for a red, rigid pipe instead, I think about 10cm in diameter.

Percolation pipes are normally 4 inch wavin pipes with perforations on the lower half of the pipe , the yellow pipe you mention sounds like the cheaper pipe used for land drains .

Do you have your own well for your domestic water supply ?

Igotadose

Car99 wrote: »

Percolation pipes are normally 4 inch wavin pipes with perforations on the lower half of the pipe , the yellow pipe you mention sounds like the cheaper pipe used for land drains .

Do you have your own well for your domestic water supply ?

No, mains water. And yes, the pipes in question are the land drain pipe, we're in West Kerry, I've seen those drain pipes used in a lot of places.

Car99

Igotadose wrote: »

No, mains water. And yes, the pipes in question are the land drain pipe, we're in West Kerry, I've seen those drain pipes used in a lot of places.

The pipe from the pump must be rerouted to a land drain ditch of dyke near by whatever you choose to call it. Put a pot of a bright coloured dye into the last chamber of the tank and get it to pump out . Then walk any suitable outlet for the pipe and should be easy enough to spot where its going to.

Car99

Car99 wrote: »

The pipe from the pump must be rerouted to a land drain ditch of dyke near by whatever you choose to call it. Put a pot of a bright coloured dye into the last chamber of the tank and get it to pump out . Then walk any suitable outlet for the pipe and should be easy enough to spot where its going to.

Might be best leave sleeping dogs lie though as it wasn't rerouted for nothing.

pango

the outlet to my drainfield (actually A DITCH) is completely blocked and cannot be recovered.Is it possible to have a NEW drainfield

opened up. To avoid the septic tank overflowing i have to have it emptied every 9 months. just two elderly people in a bungalow with to wastage of water. hope someone out there can help

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121786482#Comment_121786482

I built a new drainfield. It is a very big job, I'd recommend a contractor if you can find a good one. You need the space, obviously, and the size is based on the number of bedrooms&bathrooms, not occupants. We were the same, just 2 people, we ended up putting in 36 metres of perforated drain pipe in a field that's roughly 10mx12. You'll need a distribution box and possibly a stilling chamber.

shane b

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121786482#Comment_121786482

You can create a new percolation area, but you would have to be careful that it doesnt overlap where the old one was. The soil conditions on site, size of the house and whether its a standard tank or tank with treatment unit will all determine the size of percolationn you will need. Starting point would be to get a site survey and a percolation test carried out.

As the post above mentioned you would be better hire a specialist contractor for the job. If your septic tank was registered, you may be able to get a grant for the upgrade works

I had to get a new percolation area done 10 years ago and have details of the process i can share if you want to pm me an email address.

pango

thanks but i have no drainage field just connected to a drain. I had a contractor out this afternoon who sad it was only water and to keep an eye on it and buy a pump and use it when it fills up. he was kind of annoyed for calling him out for 30mins & 250 EURO. Should we just do that.He's doing this work for 30yrs but we are still very anxious about water, we appreciate the answers and hope for more .

monseiur

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121789490#Comment_121789490

If you have power at septic tank or nearby, build a sump at the outfall from the s. tank. The sump is basically a concrete tank with a lid or it can be plastic (something like a small oil tank may do the job) Place an electric submersible pump with a float in this sump. Every time this sump fills up the float will activate the pump and empty it out. All this will operate automatically so no need to worry about switching pump on/ off etc. Get your electrician to fit a flashing beacon which will flash and notify you in case of pump failure / malfunction.

pango

No electricity near the tank. we could ask an electrician to bring it from the house down and fit the pump. Our budget is limited. 2retired senior citizens .Would 4.000Euro cover a job like this. Thanks for all the help so far. Much appreciated