Doing temporary I.T work in US...

Shy_Dave!

Hi guys, firstly I apologize if this is the wrong place to post this query! Your advice would be appreciated. Here's my situation -

I am an Irish national, living in Ireland. I do mostly developement work for clients in Ireland.
I have the possibility with a US-based client of having steady employment where they would have me work for them remotely most of the year while also travelling over there to work and train on site for a month or so every quarter.

My query is whether this is even possible, what are the requirements etc. from my research a H1B visa seems most suitable but difficult to obtain.
From my understanding an L visa wouldn't work as they do not have any offices here in Ireland. What other options are available?

Thanks in advance for any help and advice.

él statutorio

Not an expert, but, I think you're ok to "train" there without a visa.

Have a few friends who go back and forth to San Francisco with some of the tech firms and it's always "training" they don't have any visa other than an ESTA.

Hard to define where the line between "Work" and "training" begins and ends.

Stark

Training is fine though the immigration staff might be suspicious and give you a grilling if it's one month in every 3 that you're over there. Entry is at their discretion at the end of the day. At no point are you allowed do actual work while you're over there. Also I believe there's a limit of 90 days a year that you can travel on ESTA.

ReturningForY

Yeah you can go over there to train on the VWP, but to stay on the safe side legally you probably would have to have the US company stop paying you while you're over there.

In general your case is kind of tricky because you seem to be somewhere between an independent contractor and an actual employee. The only visa option I can think of is a visa called "B-1 in lieu of H-1B" - it's a special kind of B-1 visa issued to employees of foreign consulting companies who are going over to the US temporarily to perform H-1B-type work for a US company. You would almost surely have to hire a US immigration attorney to actually do this - and it's not clear the embassy in Dublin issues these kinds of visas, either. Also, this assumes that you have created some kind of "shell company" that "hires" you to do work.

Apiarist

ReturningForY wrote: »

Yeah you can go over there to train on the VWP, but to stay on the safe side legally you probably would have to have the US company stop paying you while you're over there....

Yes, but if the US company pays an Irish entity (Shy_Dave! Ltd) for services, then Shy_Dave! is not actually employed by the US company and can go to meet the customer while the US company pays the Irish Ltd for services. Then Shy_Dave! does not need any visa, as he is just visiting to meet a customer and not being employed by the US company. Right?

Shy_Dave! wrote: »

to work and train on site for a month or so every quarter.

Of course, my suggestion above could only work for short visits, staying in the USA for several months a year is a different matter.

ReturningForY

victor8600 wrote: »

Yes, but if the US company pays an Irish entity (Shy_Dave! Ltd) for services, then Shy_Dave! is not actually employed by the US company and can go to meet the customer while the US company pays the Irish Ltd for services. Then Shy_Dave! does not need any visa, as he is just visiting to meet a customer and not being employed by the US company. Right?

I think the problem is that there's a very thin line between "meet the customer" and "be temporarily placed as a worker at the customer's site". The former is permissible on the VWP; the latter is absolutely not. My reading of the OP's message is that he's going to go to the company's site, be given a desk, and do work for the company while there. It's hard to argue that's meeting the customer.

For example, Indian IT companies that temporarily place their workers at US customers' sites need to get H-1Bs for these employers (in fact, they basically monopolize the H-1B program )

Also, anecdotal, but when I was in the embassy in Dublin last summer there was a person ahead of me in line who was working for the Irish division of a US multinational and had been visiting one of their sites in the US, but recently had been denied entry to the US based on his travel history ( :eek: ) under the suspicion they were working in the US. They were in the embassy to get an L-1, I think. This kind of case shows how tricky it can be to separate "meeting" from "working" - and, under Trump, it's more likely to be interpreted as "working" IMO.

Stark

ReturningForY wrote: »

Also, anecdotal, but when I was in the embassy in Dublin last summer there was a person ahead of me in line who was working for the Irish division of a US multinational and had been visiting one of their sites in the US, but recently had been denied entry to the US based on his travel history ( :eek: ) under the suspicion they were working in the US. They were in the embassy to get an L-1, I think. This kind of case shows how tricky it can be to separate "meeting" from "working" - and, under Trump, it's more likely to be interpreted as "working" IMO.

I think that might have been my boss They got suspicious as he was going over and back so often and when they questioned him, they found out he had people reporting to him in the States so needed an L-1 visa as you're not allowed have reports in the US under the waiver scheme.

coylemj

Stark wrote: »

At no point are you allowed do actual work while you're over there.

él statutorio wrote: »

Not an expert, but, I think you're ok to "train" there without a visa.

You can travel to the US under the Visa Waiver Progam for business. There is no need to pretend it's 'training' when you are going to be engaged in short-term work for your employer.

However what the OP is talking about is working for (and being paid by) a company based in the US which would probaly be a diffferent matter.

The Visa Waiver Program (VWP), administered by the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) in consultation with the State Department, permits citizens of 38 countries to travel to the United States for business or tourism for stays of up to 90 days without a visa.

https://www.cbp.gov/travel/international-visitors/visa-waiver-program

When must I obtain a visa to travel to the United States?

• If you intend to arrive in the United States aboard a non-signatory air carrier.
• If you intend to visit the United States for more than 90 days.
• If you believe any grounds of inadmissibility of the Immigration and Nationality Act § 212(a) apply to you, you should apply for a nonimmigrant visa before traveling to the United States.
• If you are traveling to the United States for a purpose other than short-term tourism or business.

Shy_Dave!

I really appreciate the help and discussion so far guys, Thank You!

Fathom

Just to be sure. Check with US Embassy in Ireland.

jme2010

Stark wrote: »

Also I believe there's a limit of 90 days a year that you can travel on ESTA.

I used to believe this was true, that you could only spend 90 days in America per year. It's actually 90 days per visit. I now live in Toronto and drive in/out to the Sates regularly. Buffalo NY is 1hr 30 mins drive away. I could spend evey weekend there if I wanted - I wold be issued a 60 day land crossing visa, hand it back in before the 60 day period, when coming back I would be issued another 60 day visa.

You of course will be destroyed by the customs agent if you stayed a full whack of 60-90 days, went home and tried to re-enter, even though it would be legal, the boarder agent would be rejecting the entry.

dennyk

Correct; the US doesn't have any statutory limit on the total number of days spent in the country per year under the visa waiver program, or any minimum time required between visits. However, as jme2010 noted, if you tried to abuse the visa waiver program to take up de facto residence in the US by staying the maximum length of your visitor permission and then leaving and trying to re-enter again after a very short absence, you would be found out eventually and the immigration officials would deny you entry (which would definitely make you ineligible for ESTA and could make you ineligible for a US visa at all for up to a decade).

Fathom

Shy_Dave! wrote: »

I have the possibility with a US-based client of having steady employment where they would have me work for them remotely most of the year while also travelling over there to work and train on site for a month or so every quarter.

Have you asked your "US-based client" for visa assistance? Some large corporations like Johnson & Johnson have legal departments that make arrangements.