Leisure Industry Insurance Crisis

Cee-Jay-Cee

I'm sure everyone is aware of the crisis effecting the leisure industry and many other businesses also. The only company that previously provided insurance for the leisure industry has pulled out of Ireland due to excessive and exaggerated claims. As a result many businesses are closing down as they cannot get or afford the rising costs of insurance.

Now to my point...can these businesses not operate without insurance? For example, play/activity centres...If parents/guardians were informed and asked to signa waiver acknowledging that they do not have insurance and therefore any injury or damage caused is at their own risk blah blah...surely anyone willing to sign such a waiver (I know I would) couldn't realistically take a claim against the company/business having been advised there was no insurance and that their children or who ever were admitted to the premises knowing this and at their own risk? Is that not the way forward?

Trigger Happy

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

I'm sure everyone is aware of the crisis effecting the leisure industry and many other businesses also. The only company that previously provided insurance for the leisure industry has pulled out of Ireland due to excessive and exaggerated claims. As a result many businesses are closing down as they cannot get or afford the rising costs of insurance.

Now to my point...can these businesses not operate without insurance? For example, play/activity centres...If parents/guardians were informed and asked to signa waiver acknowledging that they do not have insurance and therefore any injury or damage caused is at their own risk blah blah...surely anyone willing to sign such a waiver (I know I would) couldn't realistically take a claim against the company/business having been advised there was no insurance and that their children or who ever were admitted to the premises knowing this and at their own risk? Is that not the way forward?

I dont think the waiver would stand up in court as a waiver cannot cover alleged negligence on behalf of the provider. The cost of defending that case alone would wipe out many businesses.
And I doubt any business would want to be the first test case as one claim would have massive consequences for them if unlimited liability.
And would you trust the muppets out there to sign a waiver and not sue you anyway?

Gregor Samsa

I'm no law talking guy, but I don't think you can sign away your legal rights like that. I mean, you can say you won't take a claim against them, and you can stand by that promise if anything did happen, but the company won't have a cast iron guarantee that you won't change your mind and go after them.

It probably gets even more complicated when there's children involved, who don't have the legal capacity to sign away their rights themselves, but could be the ones that would be making the claims. I'd say it could be argued that a parent doesn't have the right to completely nullify the legal rights of a child like this.

Bob Harris

Business's could self-insure as in cover the costs of any claims themselves.
I think to do so they would need some sort of fund to cover or defend potential claims and they may not have the cash to set aside for this.
A waiver won't save them from claims where it can be proved they have been negligent.

Wayne Jarvis

In before Borties Herse

Your Face

I wonder will there be a rise the number of sibins now.

suicide_circus

it will take for us to have no nice things in order for change to happen

AlanG

A waiver against negligence has no legal standing in Ireland. I might be wrong but I think in New Zealand such waivers are allowed and that is why there are so many extreme sports operators there.

The problem here is that judges seem to think almost everything is negligence by the companies and the users have to take no personal responsibility.

Sleepy

Waivers aren't worth the paper they're written on when it comes to a court case.

badabing106

This post is going to be the first and last time Maria Bailey is mentioning in this thread, okay?

Plumbthedepths

badabing106 wrote: »

This post is going to be the first and last time Maria Bailey is mentioning in this thread, okay?

Don't forget Alan Farrell.

_Brian

Nope.

If an accident occurred that was caused or contributed to by the owners negligence then in the event of no insurance they would be personally liable, risking loosing all assets they may have and perhaps jail on the event of non payment of costs etc.

Only a manic would operate a public facing business without public liability insurance.

jamesbere

We're going to turn into the boring Republic soon.

Ger Roe

Generally, the insurance model in this country is not working.

We have a national population that is the size of a small European city and it doesn't provide enough consumer competition for the insurance industry, or the energy supply or broadband industry either, for that matter. Consumer choice and actions alone, can not drive costs down.

Add to that, the fact that the court injury and damage awards are off the scale and the whole situation becomes a gigantic rip off, particularly where there are statutory or contractual requirements to have various insurances (motor, mortgage/building, etc), but no real need for providers to compete for the business.

I once ran a business that needed up to five different types of insurance - from public liability to motor on several vehicles, to building and contents on several sites, and other industry specific covers. I was able to bundle all my requirements together and present them to a broker to negotiate for a best deal, as a job lot. I also have several different insurance requirements from a personal household perspective, but have never found any broker willing to take on the range of covers required and do the same bundle approach.

The only reason I can think of is that it is far easier to rip me off individually for each type of insurance that I require. I also have to chase around every year to get the best deal on each as the renewal quote with any incumbent provider will always be the highest.

The government needs to step in before it all gets completely out of hand, if we are obliged to have specific insurances, there must be some national responsibility to ensure we at least are operating a competitive marketplace. Otherwise we are being set up as lambs for the commercially motivated slaughter.

How can we be the greatest little country in the world in which to do business, if we can't actually afford to do business in it? Or was that famous Enda Kenny soundbite only intended for foreign multinational operations with offset site location grants and reduced corporation tax deals?

shesty

Very good post.