Belvedere - why pay to go into a public park

G-Man

Belvedere is a very good park with its location, scenic walks and the amazing history of its monuments.

The park should be available to all people of westmeath for free as a very important resource. 23 EUR family ticket is quite expensive and makes it less attractive to those who need it most.

Its a very good park but similar sized ones elsewhere - Marlay - Dublin, Newbridge- Fingal, Lough Key roscommon are free at the point of entry (Lough key - 4eur car park)

They have very similar size, features and walks, meticulously maintained but paid for out of general councel budget.

How much money does the park gate fees generate to the overall cost of the park.. Is it jam on too fund a few admissions staff. Would that admissions staff be better deployed improving maintenance of the park and make it available for all.

Saint_Mel

Only been there once and thought the exact same. Very nice place but after walking around it with the kids I was left wondering what we actually paid for!

GarIT

Is it privately owned? If so the owner can charge what they like. If it's owned by the council then those prices are very steep.

flazio

It's the same situation with Birr castle isn't it?

G-Man

I assume burr is private and it's a historic castle and gardens...

Belevedere was bought by westmeath CoCo for 250k in 1982. Yes millions were spent on renovations, but that is surely amortized by now.

My point is why do other co. Councils be able to provide a large park, parking, cafe concessions, events and not have to charge..

What is wrong in westmeath CoCo that they have to charge. Why do they own the park if they won't let the public in.

We have an obesity and fitness crisis, towns and villages ruined by traffic with nowhere safe to walk and then they charge you to get into the one place that's good to walk..

lmimmfn

I don't mind a few quid to keep the riff raff out, but Belvedere is stupidly expensive for a family, I've only been there a handful of times because of it.

They have a yearly pass which if I remember correctly is around 150euro but then you have to go there for the sake of it. Even if you have the pass you have to pay for other events there.

beggars_bush

lmimmfn wrote: »

I don't mind a few quid to keep the riff raff out, but Belvedere is stupidly expensive for a family, I've only been there a handful of times because of it.

They have a yearly pass which if I remember correctly is around 150euro but then you have to go there for the sake of it. Even if you have the pass you have to pay for other events there.

riff raff?

lmimmfn

beggars_bush wrote: »

riff raff?

Yes, 5 mins in the park in mullingar will give you an idea of what I mean.

GarIT

beggars_bush wrote: »

riff raff?

I was out at Lough Ennell when the weather was good and it was crowded with people playing music unsuitable for children at concert levels of volume and drinking bags of cans, shouting at each other, smoking around children playing. It just didn't seem the right place for families to enjoy.

AngryHippie

Right on all counts above.

Belvedere does cost a lot to maintain, Its not about amortized cost of purchase, its about ongoing maintenance costs for the entire site.

I worked and swam at all three of the popular swimming spots (Lilliput, Lough Owel Diving board and the Cut at Lough Lene) and unfortunately if there is no entry condition, when you get a few nice days, a crowd will turn up and treat it like a beer garden and it gets invaded by people that want to skull cans, smoke joints and generally treat the place like its their back garden rather than a family friendly precious natural amenity.
I believe that is unavoidable in Irish society, its an issue of respect and it is a sad part of our culture, I couldn't believe the difference in attitude outside of Ireland, it was one of the biggest culture shocks I experienced when I encountered public facilities like clean public barbecues, public toilets, change rooms, showers etc. that weren't getting trashed by folks that just don't give a F.

I wouldn't go near any of the three of the popular bathing spots around Mullingar on a hot crowded day for the reasons above and also because I'm a good enough swimmer and generally go to other spots that would be considered "dangerous" to most people.

beggars_bush

AngryHippie wrote: »

Right on all counts above.

Belvedere does cost a lot to maintain, Its not about amortized cost of purchase, its about ongoing maintenance costs for the entire site.

I worked and swam at all three of the popular swimming spots (Lilliput, Lough Owel Diving board and the Cut at Lough Lene) and unfortunately if there is no entry condition, when you get a few nice days, a crowd will turn up and treat it like a beer garden and it gets invaded by people that want to skull cans, smoke joints and generally treat the place like its their back garden rather than a family friendly precious natural amenity.
I believe that is unavoidable in Irish society, its an issue of respect and it is a sad part of our culture, I couldn't believe the difference in attitude outside of Ireland, it was one of the biggest culture shocks I experienced when I encountered public facilities like clean public barbecues, public toilets, change rooms, showers etc. that weren't getting trashed by folks that just don't give a F.

I wouldn't go near any of the three of the popular bathing spots around Mullingar on a hot crowded day for the reasons above and also because I'm a good enough swimmer and generally go to other spots that would be considered "dangerous" to most people.

Those lakeside spots used to to be far busier on a hot day.
The behaviour has actually improved!

Surely contacting Westmeath County council or the gardai is the way to express your concerns

slave1

We had a family day in Belvedere last year, very disappointing, the house itself is open and you wander around with way too few fixtures and fittings still there, went on a walk afterwards but very underwhelming.
We'll go back to Birr this year where at least the surroundings are worth the entry

Feisar

23EUR for a family ticket! That's crazy, if I wanted a walk I'd go to Mullaghmeen. Or head down to the Slieve Blooms. Was in the house years ago, very underwhelmed.

G-Man

Feisar wrote: »

23EUR for a family ticket! That's crazy, if I wanted a walk I'd go to Mullaghmeen. Or head down to the Slieve Blooms. Was in the house years ago, very underwhelmed.

And the 23 EUR family ticket, does not include children.. Yep you have to pay extra for the third child.. And the best bit, children are not allowed be children there, no scooters, no walking aids, no push trikes.. And when you get in, some of the outdoor facilities are not well maintained, rotten seats, falling down signs, fenced off cottages, areas closed.. Playground is terribly mediocre.

Now house is included.

The other thing I noticed, is that the entry to the park after reception, is quite lax and makes me wonder if its only the misguided out of town visitors pay it.. There is no clear signs that leaving the cafe puts you in the park, yet outside the cafe there is a small playground to tempt you out.. Very easy to be in the know and decide you are not paying.


With regard to a particular price point being set to exclude antisocial types, possibly, but Kildare CoCo solved this by charging 4 EUR in doneadea forest park for car parking only, not 23 EUR.

How come all the dublin parks, do not have any huge incidence of antisocial behavour (ok some, but for the size of the population very few) and they are all free. I make regular weekend trips to many of the big ones in Dublin and Leinster, and I see very rarely asocial behaviour, or if so its non perisistent, i.e one bad day in the year.