Employer Avoiding Overtime

SweetCaliber

Hi all,

Quick question,

If an employee does extra hours that ends up putting him/her over 40 hours that week, is your employer allowed split your hours over two payslips, without your consent (hours on payslips are different to those on the clock machine) to avoid going over 40 hours that week and having to pay overtime?

Not asking for legal advice just seeing what your opinion is on the matter! :pac:

_Brian

So are they pretending you worked less than 40hrs to compensate for hours worked beyond 40hrs other weeks ?

When you say split over two payslips to avoid paying overtime, does that mean you worked less than 40 yours the second week but are still being paid for it? Is that not time in lieu? You work more one week, less another week to balance out at 40 hours.

Dirkziggler

It sounds similar to a job share? The hours split over the weeks, but balance out at the end of the month? Your not very clear on the play come end of month so I'm only guessing

SweetCaliber

_Brian wrote: »

So are they pretending you worked less than 40hrs to compensate for hours worked beyond 40hrs other weeks ?

Basically yes. Explained below.

Dav010 wrote: »

When you say split over two payslips to avoid paying overtime, does that mean you worked less than 40 yours the second week but are still being paid for it? Is that not time in lieu? You work more one week, less another week to balance out at 40 hours.

No, I worked more than 40 weeks one week but did not get paid for it either the first week or the second. See below.

Dirkziggler wrote: »

It sounds similar to a job share? The hours split over the weeks, but balance out at the end of the month? Your not very clear on the play come end of month so I'm only guessing

I get paid weekly so wouldnt see it as a job share.

Basically 2 weeks ago my base hours were 35, however I worked an extra 10 hours which brought me up to 45 hours that week.

When my payslip came in it showed 39 hours on it. They only paid me 4 of my extra hours that week.

So my next payslip came in yesterday. While I only worked 30 hours last week it is showing 36 hours. Those 6 hours are the remainder of the extra hours worked the week before.

So what happened is the first payslip my hours should have been 45. Thats 5 overtime hours. However they capped the hours on my payslip at 39 and then the second week paid the remainder of the extra hours to avoid paying overtime in both cases.

Apologies if confusing, its hard to explain.

sportsfan90

Are you sure you're entitled to an additional rate for overtime?

SweetCaliber

sportsfan90 wrote: »

Are you sure you're entitled to an additional rate for overtime?

Yes time and a quarter.

_Brian

SweetCaliber wrote: »

Basically yes. Explained below.



No, I worked more than 40 weeks one week but did not get paid for it either the first week or the second. See below.



I get paid weekly so wouldnt see it as a job share.

Basically 2 weeks ago my base hours were 35, however I worked an extra 10 hours which brought me up to 45 hours that week.

When my payslip came in it showed 39 hours on it. They only paid me 4 of my extra hours that week.

So my next payslip came in yesterday. While I only worked 30 hours last week it is showing 36 hours. Those 6 hours are the remainder of the extra hours worked the week before.

So what happened is the first payslip my hours should have been 45. Thats 5 overtime hours. However they capped the hours on my payslip at 39 and then the second week paid the remainder of the extra hours to avoid paying overtime in both cases.

Apologies if confusing, its hard to explain.

So they paid you 4hrs OT the first week as above..
The second week did they pay you 6hrs OT ?


Is it possible they are spreading the OT out over a few weeks but your still getting the same amount ? I've seen this done where a department manager was running tight on his permitted OT budget so they just spread the hours about over a few weeks to meet the budget constraint, but the employee would have been given a heads up.

SweetCaliber

_Brian wrote: »

So they paid you 4hrs OT the first week as above..
The second week did they pay you 6hrs OT ?


Is it possible they are spreading the OT out over a few weeks but your still getting the same amount ? I've seen this done where a department manager was running tight on his permitted OT budget so they just spread the hours about over a few weeks to meet the budget constraint, but the employee would have been given a heads up.

If that was the way it would be fine but I did not get paid overtime at all, the 4 Hours and the 6 Hours were paid at my basic rate.

_Brian

What are your contracted hours on your contract ?


Theres definitely some creative accounting happening here, your down about 2.5hrs pay going by what your saying..


Like I said, I've seen places move hours about for budgetry reasons but it should be explained to the employee first..

SweetCaliber

35 Hours are my contracted hours.

SweetCaliber

SweetCaliber wrote: »

35 Hours are my contracted hours.

If your contracted hours are 35 and they paid 39, how were the 4 not paid at the higher rate? Did you ask payroll dept?

SweetCaliber

Dav010 wrote: »

If your contracted hours are 35 and they paid 39, how were the 4 not paid at the higher rate? Did you ask payroll dept?

No clue, I've always gone over 35 hours on payslips every week and always been paid just the normal rate. Thought overtime only kicks in at 40 hours.

dennyk

Additional pay for overtime isn't required by law here, so your contract governs whether you get paid a higher overtime rate at all and if so, how such pay is calculated. As such, only paying an overtime rate for hours over 40 in a week is fine if that's what your contract specifies, even if your "normal" hours are only 35 hours a week.

If your contract states that hours worked over 40 in a work week are to be paid at a higher overtime rate, then moving hours you already worked around between different work weeks like they are doing in order to avoid paying you at that higher rate would most likely be a violation of your contract terms, unless there's some provision in your contract that specifically allows them to do that. It may also be a violation of Section 25(1) of the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997 if they are falsifying their own records of your time worked each week. If you've approached your employer about this "mistake" on their part and they have not taken action to correct it, you could file a complaint with the WRC:

https://www.workplacerelations.ie/en/complaints_disputes/making_a_complaint/

SweetCaliber

dennyk wrote: »

Additional pay for overtime isn't required by law here, so your contract governs whether you get paid a higher overtime rate at all and if so, how such pay is calculated. As such, only paying an overtime rate for hours over 40 in a week is fine if that's what your contract specifies, even if your "normal" hours are only 35 hours a week.

If your contract states that hours worked over 40 in a work week are to be paid at a higher overtime rate, then moving hours you already worked around between different work weeks like they are doing in order to avoid paying you at that higher rate would most likely be a violation of your contract terms, unless there's some provision in your contract that specifically allows them to do that. It may also be a violation of Section 25(1) of the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997 if they are falsifying their own records of your time worked each week. If you've approached your employer about this "mistake" on their part and they have not taken action to correct it, you could file a complaint with the WRC:

https://www.workplacerelations.ie/en/complaints_disputes/making_a_complaint/

Yeah contract states overtime is paid at time and a quarter over store standard hours. Time to get onto the union I think!

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

It amazes me to think that some companies will actively go about shafting their employees. How is that any way to run a company, I do not know. Get onto your shop rep and check all your previous pay slips, if you are missing an hour or two here and there you could put it down to a mistake, but if it's happening regularly, don't let it go.

SweetCaliber

Elaina Brave Backgammon wrote: »

It amazes me to think that some companies will actively go about shafting their employees. How is that any way to run a company, I do not know. Get onto your shop rep and check all your previous pay slips, if you are missing an hour or two here and there you could put it down to a mistake, but if it's happening regularly, don't let it go.

For me its not even about the money to be honest, its the principle of it that really grinds my gears and why I won't just sweep it under the carpet. I've all my hours worked and rosters documented and payslips saved for cases like this.

leitrim4life

Or you could just work your contracted 35hrs and when they query why stopping mid task at hr 35 remind them of this little story :-)

_Brian

leitrim4life wrote: »

Or you could just work your contracted 35hrs and when they query why stopping mid task at hr 35 remind them of this little story :-)

I’d rather have a chat with them over this. OP would appear to still be owed money.

Strumms

When you work OT you are essentially doing them a favor. They are in turn repaying you by not paying you properly and fûcking you around.

To be honest rather then getting on to unions I’d be getting the fûck out of there. If you are having to start talks to negotiate something as important as getting paid correctly, accurately and in a fair timely manner alarm bells should be ringing.

SweetCaliber

Strumms wrote: »

When you work OT you are essentially doing them a favor. They are in turn repaying you by not paying you properly and fûcking you around.

To be honest rather then getting on to unions I’d be getting the fûck out of there. If you are having to start talks to negotiate something as important as getting paid correctly, accurately and in a fair timely manner alarm bells should be ringing.

Yep, talks are ongoing. Contacted to WRC for advice and they urge me to open a complaint so an inspector can be sent out to deal with it. Will see what the talks come to first before going any further with the WRC.