Four bay charger opening at Kinnegad services today apparently!

Zenith74

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/four-electric-vehicle-rapid-chargers-to-be-opened-at-m6-m4-1.3910089?mode=amp

Assume this is the first of the new ESB locations?

Edit: So this is actually an EasyGo.ie location. There are two charger units going in, but only one is active so far. The charging units have two connectors (CHAdeMO and CCS), with one usable at a time.

Now that's very welcome news if ESB have now started the expansion project. Have to go to take a look at there tomorrow.

Zenith74

Looks to be an Easygo location - https://twitter.com/Easygo_ie/status/1133451256268238849

So it's Easygo. Nice one for thinking big. Sounds like them and Supermacs are working together to equip some other MSAs with more chargers too. Competition is good. I recently visited the Barack Obama Plaza and it seemed really busy with only one charger.

jusmeig

Great news. Good sign that EVs are gaining traction!!
What's the pricing like I wonder, won't need ESB to upgrade network if Ionity and these guys keep it up!

ethernet

jusmeig wrote: »

Great news. Good sign that EVs are gaining traction!!
What's the pricing like I wonder, won't need ESB to upgrade network if Ionity and these guys keep it up!

I looked at the EasyGo map earlier and it said 35c per minute.

KCross

It seems to me that Pat McDonagh (Supermac's owner) understands that EV drivers are a target for his food and thats why he is driving the installation of them. At least someone gets it!

35c/min sets the rate for eCars for their chargers. At least there's some element of competition starting to pickup.

unkel

Free public charging is actually a lot more expensive than charging at home :pac:

Zenith74

KCross wrote: »

It seems to me that Pat McDonagh (Supermac's owner) understands that EV drivers are a target for his food and thats why he is driving the installation of them. At least someone gets it!

I've eaten a LOT more Supermac's since getting my EV!

liamog

Zenith74 wrote: »

I've eaten a LOT more Supermac's since getting my EV!

We saved €10 a charge when we installed the home charger. I think McDonald's and Starbucks may start putting in planning complaints against home chargers

kanuseeme

liamog wrote: »

We saved €10 a charge when we installed the home charger. I think McDonald's and Starbucks may start putting in planning complaints against home chargers

If they put in a Fast charger they could get more customers charged up, Fed and also their caffeine hit

Shefwedfan

So if I was planning a route tomorrow, how do I find these chargers? one that has eCars/Easygo and Ionity

Dont be at yourself

Shefwedfan wrote: »

So if I was planning a route tomorrow, how do I find these chargers? one that has eCars/Easygo and Ionity

Zap Map or Chargemap should have them.

Mickeroo

Plugshare and plugsurfing should have them too.

liamog

I'm not seeing them on ZapMap yet

Rafal

It is on Plugshare.

uphillonly

Dont be at yourself wrote: »

Zap Map or Chargemap should have them.

Ionity’s first station at Cashel isn’t showing on Zap-Map yet.

September1

Has anyone been there? Any photos? :-)

liamog

uphillonly wrote: »

Ionity’s first station at Cashel isn’t showing on Zap-Map yet.

It show's on the ZapMap Website, but not the app for some reason.

Zenith74

Somebody posted a photo here - https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10219692340318658&set=gm.2285412468366695&type=3&eid=ARAPhR66HjgmvgSalYi7IRkXcs3fo7y0pzUC9r0zgGDo8dlr-G-p0r5_maTMfAvp6ifLPxiyLw_UyXCT&ifg=1

Seems there was a little bit of spin going on in the original announcement. One charger unit has gone live, which has a CHAdeMO and CCS connector, you can only use one connector at a time. There is a second charger unit to come online shortly. So it may be four connectors when it's done, but only two can be used at once. Still a lot better than nothing, two is a huge difference over one from a reliability/queuing point of view.

Shefwedfan

Zenith74 wrote: »

Somebody posted a photo here - https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10219692340318658&set=gm.2285412468366695&type=3&eid=ARAPhR66HjgmvgSalYi7IRkXcs3fo7y0pzUC9r0zgGDo8dlr-G-p0r5_maTMfAvp6ifLPxiyLw_UyXCT&ifg=1

Seems there was a little bit of spin going on in the original announcement. One charger unit has gone live, which has a CHAdeMO and CCS connector, you can only use one connector at a time. There is a second charger unit to come online shortly. So it may be four connectors when it's done, but only two can be used at once. Still a lot better than nothing, two is a huge difference over one from a reliability/queuing point of view.

Four or two is better than none

Zenith74

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Four or two is better than none

Yeah 1000%. I just got super excited when I heard four and imagined an Ionity style location but with CHAdeMO for me prehistoric CHAdeMO car :rolleyes:

Silent Running

According to a screenshot there, the bill for a time based charge works out at €0.70 per kW. That's a bit rich when you consider that the UK chargers are between £0.30 (€0.34) and £0.35 (€0.39) per kW.

The cost of the machine, once the capital cost is written off to tax, isn't that great and the cost of the electricity would be well below what we mere mortals would pay.

All in all, this is going to be a very profitable business. But only if people are prepared to be ripped off in this way.

grogi

Silent Running wrote: »

According to a screenshot there, the bill for a time based charge works out at €0.70 per kW. That's a bit rich when you consider that the UK chargers are between £0.30 (€0.34) and £0.35 (€0.39) per kW.

The cost of the machine, once the capital cost is written off to tax, isn't that great and the cost of the electricity would be well below what we mere mortals would pay.

All in all, this is going to be a very profitable business. But only if people are prepared to be ripped off in this way.

It's the time to officially announce beginning of 'the rich are squeezing us poor even on juice' then... It's the same talk as in the insurance thread.

Ah, FFS... Don't talk about costs and tax when you clearly have no idea about it. Do you have an idea what it takes to keep a charger working (cleaning, maintenance, insurance, electricity etc.) Do you know the projected utilisation? Do you know how much a 50kW connection costs?

Nobody forces you to use one. I would gladly pay that when I am traveling for a charger that's online and available.

Shefwedfan

I bought my CCS car over 2 years ago and I said then that chademo long term would be dead, everything I have since since then has only confirmed that

Silent Running

grogi wrote: »

It's the time to officially announce beginning of 'the rich are squeezing us poor even on juice' then... It's the same talk as in the insurance thread.

Ah, FFS... Don't talk about costs and tax when you clearly have no idea about it. Don't talk what it takes to keep a charger working.

I think that comparing the operation of charging providers is legitimate. Just as we could compare any consumer service. It's nothing to do with the rich squeezing the poor, it's about choice. Are you one of those loopers who stick with the same electricity or gas or broadband providers no matter what they charge? Or do you look around and move to the best value provider?

No I'm not an accountant, perhaps you could enlighten us with your vast knowledge of the capital and current expenditure of charging providers.

Did you step on Lego when you got out of bed this morning? :P

KCross

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I bought my CCS car over 2 years ago and I said then that chademo long term would be dead, everything I have since since then has only confirmed that

What have you seen to confirm it?
Apart from Ionity any new chargers will have Chademo.

At the end of the day chademo is just a second cable on the charger. It’s not like an operator has to buy a whole new charger to provide chademo. I don’t see an issue to be honest.

liamog

KCross wrote: »

What have you seen to confirm it?
Apart from Ionity any new chargers will have Chademo.

At the end of the day chademo is just a second cable on the charger. It’s not like an operator has to buy a whole new charger to provide chademo. I don’t see an issue to be honest.

CHAdeMO should slowly die in Europe. Its long time that Nissan get with the programme and standardise.

We're already seeing the end of AC43 installations, CHAdeMO will be next. It would be better for everyone if the charger came with two CCS cables, that would allow some fault tolerance in the event of a physical cable issue and with newer chargers coming with load sharing, it makes sense to do it across multiple identical cables.

For EasyGo, I think they are correct to be installing CHAdeMO at the moment, but I think they are short sighted only installing 50kW chargers.

Silent Running

liamog wrote: »

CHAdeMO should slowly die in Europe. Its long time that Nissan get with the programme and standardise.

We're already seeing the end of AC43 installations, CHAdeMO will be next. It would be better for everyone if the charger came with two CCS cables, that would allow some fault tolerance in the event of a physical cable issue and with newer chargers coming with load sharing, it makes sense to do it across multiple identical cables.

For EasyGo, I think they are correct to be installing CHAdeMO at the moment, but I think they are short sighted only installing 50kW chargers.

This is one of the downsides of time based fees. The longer you have to stay connected to the charger, the more money they make. If they charged per kW, they would want you off the charger as fast as possible to get the next customer on.

Blueshoe

Wouldn't consuming food cooked in Palm oil offset the ev use?

Not to mention the amount of animals whose homes have been destroyed constructing his latest cash cow.

KCross

liamog wrote: »

CHAdeMO should slowly die in Europe. Its long time that Nissan get with the programme and standardise.

True.
But its a long way off, imo.
As long as Nissan keep using it in new cars it will continue to be supported.

Nissan are clinging to it because they are developing other products (Vehicle to Home tech) around it. If they abandon Chademo they are abandoning those other products as well and they seem to be reluctant to do that.

liamog wrote: »

We're already seeing the end of AC43 installations, CHAdeMO will be next. It would be better for everyone if the charger came with two CCS cables, that would allow some fault tolerance in the event of a physical cable issue

The fault tolerance is by having multiple chargers, not multiple cables because thats where the faults generally are... in the chargers.

liamog wrote: »

... and with newer chargers coming with load sharing,it makes sense to do it across multiple identical cables.

Thats doesnt really matter. Load sharing doesnt care if its load sharing between 2 CCS or 1 Chademo and 1 CCS. Its not done at the cable/protocol end, its inside the charger thats done.

liamog wrote: »

For EasyGo, I think they are correct to be installing CHAdeMO at the moment, but I think they are short sighted only installing 50kW chargers.

I saw an interview with them recently where they said they would use higher powered ones once the demand picks up, so I'd say its a financial decision.

Their plan is to install high powered ones starting at 100kW which are then upgradeable in 50kW increments.

liamog

Load sharing is useless when two CCS cars turn up and there are 1 CHAdeMO and 1 CCS cable.
So there is a definite advantage in having multiple identical cables.

How many times have we seen eCars chargers with a faulty CCS or CHAdeMO cable but the other dc connector works?
I know Blanch and Lucan used to regularly see faults on one DC side, whilst the other type works.

It would be in the interests of every EV driver for us to have a standardised charging port, Nissan should have added CCS when they added type 2 to the Leaf.
They could of kept the CHAdeMO for V2H functionality, just like the London Black Cab has both connectors.

KCross

liamog wrote: »

Load sharing is useless when two CCS cars turn up and there are 1 CHAdeMO and 1 CCS cable.
So there is a definite advantage in having multiple identical cables.

True.
However, load sharing is usually across multiple rapids with each rapid having multiple cables as opposed to load sharing across cables. So, as long as there is a free rapid you are good to go.
e.g. Tesla now have two cables on their rapids to support the Model 3 but each rapid can still only service one car. The load sharing is across the rapids, not the cables.

At the end of the day its just a connector sharing the electrons the charger can deliver. I dont think it matters much. The bigger issue is having more rapids not getting rid of CHAdeMO... that's a non-issue imo.

liamog wrote: »

How many times have we seen eCars chargers with a faulty CCS or CHAdeMO cable but the other dc connector works?
I know Blanch and Lucan used to regularly see faults on one DC side, whilst the other type works.

But is that because the charger has developed an internal fault on that side or because of the cable?

Dont get me wrong, I agree it would be better if every car was CCS and have two cables etc... you are right, but I'm just countering the suggestions being made that Chademo is dead which gives the impression that someone who buys a new Leaf today is somehow going to be left with an obsolete car that cant be rapid charged during its lifetime.

I dont agree that that will happen.

liamog wrote: »

It would be in the interests of every EV driver for us to have a standardised charging port, Nissan should have added CCS when they added type 2 to the Leaf.

That was their opportunity for sure. Cant see them dumping it for the L62 either so I'd suggest its with us for a long time to come... regardless of whether we agree with their decision or not.

liamog wrote: »

They could of kept the CHAdeMO for V2H functionality, just like the London Black Cab has both connectors.

Cost, I suppose, is the issue there. Makes sense for a taxi to give them more options.
CCS is also supposed to be adding V2H to its standard but it looks like its much further along with CHAdeMO with real products actually deployed in the UK right now.

Zenith74

I'll be looking to change my Leaf24 in the next year or so, and while my preference would be for another Leaf, the lack of CCS is likely to be the thing that tips me towards one of the other options. Hopefully I'm not the only one, and this market force is what makes Nissan swap connectors.

liamog

KCross wrote: »

True.
However, load sharing is usually across multiple rapids with each rapid having multiple cables as opposed to load sharing across cables. So, as long as there is a free rapid you are good to go.
e.g. Tesla now have two cables on their rapids to support the Model 3 but each rapid can still only service one car. The load sharing is across the rapids, not the cables.

At the end of the day its just a connector sharing the electrons the charger can deliver. I dont think it matters much. The bigger issue is having more rapids not getting rid of CHAdeMO... that's a non-issue imo.

There are effectively two types of DC charger. Distributed ones such as Tesla/Ionity where there is a DC Charger stack in one location and multiple charging ending points. And all in one chargers, such as the Efacec's eCars use, and the Delta 150kW Chargers. The newer all in one chargers also have multiple DC modules so can load share across cables in the same way that the distributed chargers can.

Tesla's implementation is distributed, and load shares across 2 charging points. They can't load across the CCS/Type2 DC because they are a single DC endpoint. There are all in one chargers available that can load share across the DC cables.

It will be interesting to see which format eCars use with their expansion.

CHAdeMO may not be dead yet, and it may end up being a short term advantage for Leaf drivers, they'll have a much easier time finding a free cable!

McGiver

Would some of the users mind adding them to Zap Map? That's the only quick way to get them there. I'd added CPs to Zap map in the past myself. Cheers.