Confused about alarm quotes

awec

Hi folks,

We got a quotation from 2 places, a local installer, who installs HKC equipment, and Phone Watch. The two quotes vary massively.

We were quoted roughly 800 quid for the HKC stuff, which includes 1070 alarm, sirens inside and out, decoy, all windows and all doors inertia sensors and contacts. ~150 on top if we want the GSM box for controlling with phone.

Monitoring is ~180 a year.

On the other hand, phone watch said they'd install for 250, but their monthly cost for monitoring is like double I think.

I can't figure out how phone watch is so much cheaper. Is it because we're pretty much buying the HKC equipment, and can change our monitoring company in future? Whereas phone watch are happy to give us the equipment cheap because we'll be stuck with phone watch forever?

Anyone any recommendations or pointers here? I know nothing about these things!

bk

Well with PhoneWatch the monitoring charge is €40 monthly or something like that. If you work out the cost over say ten years, including the monitoring, then you will see that it will end up costing at least twice as much.

For example:
PhoneWatch over 10 Years: 40 × 12 × 10 + 300 = 5,100
HKC over 10 years: 180 × 10 + 800 + 150 = 2,750

A few more things to note:
- With PhoneWatch you don't own the alarm, if you stop paying the monthly fee, it won't work anymore and they can even take it back at any time!

- HKC, if you stop paying the monitoring fee, it is still yours and it will continue to work as a non monitored basic alarm.

- You don't need to get the 180 remote monitoring for HKC. Another option is to do self monitoring with the HKC app, which I think costs about €80 or so per year. Which would make the above HKC set up cost just €1750 over ten years or roughly 1/4 the cost of Phonewatch!

Phonewatch is very much the razor and blade model, sell you the razor for cheap, but then lock you into expensive contract. It is cheap upfront, but far more expensive in the long term.

awec

How reliable is the app for monitoring?

To use the app, we've to pay €5 a month for a SIM in the alarm I think. You're saying this would be instead of the 180 a year for monitoring, that there's no need for both?

bk

awec wrote: »

How reliable is the app for monitoring?

To use the app, we've to pay €5 a month for a SIM in the alarm I think. You're saying this would be instead of the 180 a year for monitoring, that there's no need for both?

I believe the €70 or €80 per year that HKC charge includes the SIM card, so you don't have to pay separately for a SIM card, they take care of that for you.

Oh the app does cost €8 to buy from the ios/android app store.

Unless your installer is trying to pull a fast one, giving you an old GSM dialer, rather then the newer HKC dual path wifi/gsm setup. This is what I'd be looking for if I was getting a HKC system today:

https://www.hkcsecurity.com/ie/product/gsm-wifi/communicators/

It could be a good idea to get quotes from other HKC installers.

With self monitoring, you don't need the 180 remote monitoring.

You can of course have both if you want, they aren't quite the same thing, but there is overlap.

- Self Monitoring (€70 to 80 per year): An app on your phone that allows you to remotely arm and disarm the alarm. And also sends you notifications if the alarm goes off.

- ARC Monitoring. A Company monitors your alarm, if if goes off, they try calling you, if they can't get through and if two or more sensors trigger, then they might call the Gardai.

Self monitoring is cheaper, the downside is if you were away on holidays and asleep, you might not hear the notification on the phone until the next morning.

Depends on your needs. I'm happy with just doing self monitoring.

awec

Yep it's the HKC GSM WIFI that we've been quoted for. But it says there's a payment of ~5 per month for the world SIM.

van_beano

I'm paying €59.88 per year self monitoring through the App with HKC. This money comes out once a year by DD, I get the invoice beforehand from them.

bk

BTW I mistyped how much HKC with self monitoring over ten years would cost, it would look something like this:

HKC with self monitoring: (80 × 10) + 800 + 150 = 1,750

Of course the self monitoring fee might increase, but then so could the phonewatch one.

bk

awec wrote: »

Yep it's the HKC GSM WIFI that we've been quoted for. But it says there's a payment of ~5 per month for the world SIM.

And does that include the use of the HKC service and app? Or is it just sending you text messages?

Could be just a misunderstanding or an installer pulling a quick one. I'd double check with him and if not happy get quotes for others.

This is what the app looks like:
https://itunes.apple.com/ie/app/hkc-securecomm/id876325411?mt=8

awec

bk wrote: »

And does that include the use of the HKC service and app? Or is it just sending you text messages?

Could be just a misunderstanding or an installer pulling a quick one. I'd double check with him and if not happy get quotes for others.

This is what the app looks like:
https://itunes.apple.com/ie/app/hkc-securecomm/id876325411?mt=8

The quote info we got says HKC GSM WIFI allows you to remotely control and receive notifications on the status of your alarm system worldwide via the HKC Securecomm app. There is a rental of €4.99 a month for this SIM, payable to <insert company name that is not HKC>.


Other question about self-monitoring - can you avail of the home insurance discounts for having a self-monitored alarm?

vintagecosmos

There is also a big difference between phonewatch and hkc in terms of perimeter protection. From my experience PW usually only quote for front and back door and a few PIR sensors offering no perimeter protection. Alarm only goes off when someone is inside. While HKC shocks will go off if someone attempts to force in.

bk

awec wrote: »

The quote info we got says HKC GSM WIFI allows you to remotely control and receive notifications on the status of your alarm system worldwide via the HKC Securecomm app. There is a rental of €4.99 a month for this SIM, payable to <insert company name that is not HKC>.

Ah that is ok so, that works out at €60 per year, which is what that service costs and it should include the SIM.

awec wrote: »

Other question about self-monitoring - can you avail of the home insurance discounts for having a self-monitored alarm?

Yes you can, though personally I don't recommend it with any alarm system. The problem is what if you forget to arm the alarm and your broken in? They might not pay out then.

I don't think the discount is worth the risk. Plus I've found I could get the equivalent of the discount or more by jut shopping around for insurance or at least telling them you are.

ozbackineire

We recently got an alarm installed and use the HKC app for self monitoring -€59 per year for the app, can switch the alarm on remotely from upstairs or if you forget to do it before you leave the house. Gives you a full log of every time the alarm is switched on/off/partially set. It alerts you if the alarm is going off when you are out of the house, we wouldn't be without it now.

we looked at Phone Watch but as others have mentioned it is so expensive.

bk

vintagecosmos wrote: »

There is also a big difference between phonewatch and hkc in terms of perimeter protection. From my experience PW usually only quote for front and back door and a few PIR sensors offering no perimeter protection. Alarm only goes off when someone is inside. While HKC shocks will go off if someone attempts to force in.

Just to be fair to phonewatch, they do have shock sensors too now. But you'd likely have to pay more for them. But, yes good point.

vintagecosmos

bk wrote: »

Just to be fair to phonewatch, they do have shock sensors too now. But you'd likely have to pay more for them. But, yes good point.

Ah ok. They didn't a few years ago when I was dealing with them.

Worth clarifying cost OP to.ensurr you are comparing like for like

bk

vintagecosmos wrote: »

Ah ok. They didn't a few years ago when I was dealing with them.

Worth clarifying cost OP to.ensurr you are comparing like for like

Yes, both Shock and Glass break sensors are listed here now:
https://www.phonewatch.ie/home-alarm-systems/products/

vintagecosmos

When I spoke to PW in the rds few years ago I told them it was a new build and wired for alarm. Sales rep slated wired alarms and sold me wireless pack for a few hundred. Said I can add more PIRs and door contacts on the day which would have pushed the price up a couple of hundred. I had floor plans but they were only interested in getting me signed up to monitoring and slating other companies. Needless to say I went with someone else. Lesson for me was to be aware of sales tactics.

salmocab

<SNIP>, an installer I know charges 130 a year for service charge on the hkc smart version. That covers the 5 euro a month and if you have any issues he will log in remotely and see what the issue is.

masterboy123

I am interested in HKC.

Do the have installers in every county? Its not on their website.

kub

masterboy123 wrote: »

I am interested in HKC.

Do the have installers in every county? Its not on their website.

HKC are a manufacturer, they do not have an installation business at all.

Ninety something percent of installers use HKC equipment so any licensed installer will be able to assist you.
If you are stuck for installers check out the PSA website.
As always we advise written quotes and get at least 3.