Getting used to racing handlebars?

silverharp

Ive had hybrids forever so have only had flat handlebars, while I have only had one trip with drop bars, I found the down hills a bit disconcerting, both the steering feeling very light and the fact that the breaks were not in easy reach as I probably defaulted when I can to holding the top of the bars.
Anything to look out for, a bit of practice? read up on posture? Can additional break handles be added? Any adjustments possible?

Raam

Ride your bike, a lot. You will get used to them and learn to love them.
happy cycling

ED E

Dont add additional brake levers, they're a recipe for an accident (outside pros doing Roubaix).

Your primary position is normally on the "hoods", that is the top of the shifters. If you don't feel secure here you can move them up the bars or rotate the bars so that they're at a more acute angle "trapping" you hands.

Shift between on the drops and on the hoods when you need a change and try to avoid the tops.

doozerie

Yeah, practice is the answer.

You can add additional brake levers on the "flat" section of the bars, cyclo cross bikes often have them for example, but they are usually not as effective as your existing brake levers and add some faff, so best reserved for when you have no alternative.

magicbastarder

Steering will feel lighter if you hold the top of the bars as your hands are closer to the steering axis, so you'll feel more stable in the hoods. Also, the reach on many brake levers can be adjusted if you find you're having to reach farther than is comfortable to reach them.

Wishbone Ash

Get into the drops on descents - it lowers you center of gravity, gives more stability, more aero position and easier to brake.

Canis Lupus

Was the bike bought from a proper shop and you got at least a basic fit or is it a second hand yoke you bought?

You should be pretty comfortable with your hands on the hoods and the brakes/gear levers then accordingly within easy reach of finger tips. If you can't then you need to make sure your frame size is right and check online on how to do a basic road bike set up. There's a period of adjustment too if you've only used flat bars in the past.

The thought of descending with your hands on the tops is vaguely funny mind you. I usually only go there on an ascent.

07Lapierre

doozerie wrote: »

Yeah, practice is the answer.

You can add additional brake levers on the "flat" section of the bars, cyclo cross bikes often have them for example, but they are usually not as effective as your existing brake levers and add some faff, so best reserved for when you have no alternative.

IMO, Adding levers to the flats is a BAD idea. It will discourage the OP from using dropped bars correctly and will make decending hills feel very unstable. As others have said, their OK if your a pro rider riding across cobbles or doing CX riding, but not for road cycling.

ED E

"Suicide Levers" are an apt monicker they acquired.

They were created for people who wanted fashionable drop bars but couldnt actually ride them in the 70s apparently (before my time). Now Liv(Giant) are at it again.

Canis Lupus

07Lapierre wrote: »

IMO, Adding levers to the flats is a BAD idea. It will discourage the OP from using dropped bars correctly and will make decending hills feel very unstable. As others have said, their OK if your a pro rider riding across cobbles or doing CX riding, but not for road cycling.

More importantly they look naff and we all know bike riding is 99% image 1% fitness.

Cookie_Monster

in drops downhill or hoods? Personally i pretty much never use the drops at all

Lumen

Hoods on small ring, drops on big ring.

If you can't comfortably ride the drops your bike fit is wrong.

edit: sorry, there's one exception to this. In the neutralised rollout of a race, it is permitted (nay, expected!) to use the hoods.

nak

Bars can be swapped out easily enough and don't have to be expensive. I prefer narrower bars with a short reach - don't think I've ever used the stock bars that came with a bike.

It's well worth getting a bike fit done.

secman

On hoods mostly, on flat climbing, rarely if ever use drops..... practice practice practice. Only ever ridden straight bars on mtb, even then, put on those "bull" bar extensions for alternative grip on bars. Straight bars are so one dimensional

silverharp

thanks for the tips, probably just need to get used to it, have the same decent from Glencree back to Dublin planned for tomorrow

Wishbone Ash

silverharp wrote: »

thanks for the tips, probably just need to get used to it, have the same decent from Glencree back to Dublin planned for tomorrow

Jesus I wouldn't be descending that on the bars. Not particularly steep but a lot of bends, rough surface with loose gravel in places. Did you descend the last very steep bit into Enniskerry on the top of the bars? :eek:

silverharp

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Jesus I wouldn't be descending that on the bars. Not particularly steep but a lot of bends, rough surface with loose gravel in places. Did you descend the last very steep bit into Enniskerry on the top of the bars? :eek:

im pretty sure I had my hands on the breaks most of the time. I was going clockwise so Enniskerry isn't that steep coming out from Dublin, the faster bit is the decent towards Rockbrook, I kept the speed under 40km/h

Wishbone Ash

silverharp wrote: »

... I was going clockwise so Enniskerry isn't that steep coming out from Dublin...

The last bit (Kilgarron Hill?) is a -12% drop into the village. Always 'squeaky bum' time for me anyway!

kenmc

Always descend in the drops. If you're at speed on the hoods and hit a bump, you're probably prone to losing grip and it won't end well. Much less likely in the drops.
Drops are faster for descending too.

doozerie

07Lapierre wrote: »

IMO, Adding levers to the flats is a BAD idea. It will discourage the OP from using dropped bars correctly and will make decending hills feel very unstable. As others have said, their OK if your a pro rider riding across cobbles or doing CX riding, but not for road cycling.

I wouldn't want them on my own road bike but they have their place in certain circumstances. They come fitted on some kids bikes for example (e.g. some road models from Islabikes) so that the rider can learn to use the hoods (and drops) at their own pace. When you are already comfortable using hoods/drops it can seem ridiculous that other people, particularly adults, find them daunting, but we all had to learn at some stage and I'll bet that many of us were nervous of riding on hoods and/or drops initially no matter what age we were when we first tried them. I know I was, when I first started to use them as a teenager.

There seems to be a level of hysteria around brake levers on the "flats" that I don't understand. I don't see anyone, me included, arguing for them over the conventional brake levers, they are just not as effective at braking for one thing. On a road bike I see them primarily as something to allow you to adjust to conventional levers, should you need that period of adjustment.

In my youth, and perhaps still today, cheap road bikes always came with metal extensions to the regular brake levers, these extensions were attached to the regular brake levers and they ran parallel with the tops of the bars. They were rubbish generally, they had far less stopping power than the regular levers (they didn't operate directly on the brake cable, they just tried to move the regular brake lever by brute force basically), but in themselves they weren't death traps either. By comparison, modern cyclo-cross brake levers are at least much more effective than those by design. I'd still avoid them personally, but I can see why some people might want them.

Wishbone Ash

doozerie wrote: »

....In my youth, and perhaps still today, cheap road bikes always came with metal extensions to the regular brake levers, these extensions were attached to the regular brake levers and they ran parallel with the tops of the bars. They were rubbish generally, they had far less stopping power than the regular levers (they didn't operate directly on the brake cable, they just tried to move the regular brake lever by brute force basically)....

You've just brought me back to the 1970's. I'd forgotten about those types. They were particularly useless when the metal became worn where they engaged with the regular levers.

Idleater

I used to forever avoid the drops and use the hoods and top but two things helped me.

Cycling in the Pyrenees and getting an old style handle bar with basically no flat transition to the (brake only) levers. These two were independent.

The long descents do not lend themselves to holding the hoods, and the awkward hood type braking meant a lot of practice in the drops.

magicbastarder

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

You've just brought me back to the 1970's. I'd forgotten about those types. They were particularly useless when the metal became worn where they engaged with the regular levers.

i think part of the problem with them was that they don't actually have much leverage, for something called a brake lever.
they stick away from the plane that is most efficient to activate the brakes.

smacl

I found the change to drop bars awkward enough when I first got them. What worked for me was finding a quiet bit of road to go up and down and repeatedly going through the different hand positions until I was comfortable. These days, having slightly banjaxed shoulders that tire quickly, I swap between drops, hoods and tops regularly to avoid fatigue. Always in the drops on descending and usually in the drops with the ass slightly off the saddle if the road surface is crap. Tops for me for climbing.

Wishbone Ash

Just a question regarding those modern type of lever fitted on the top bars - are they independent of the normal levers as in, do they have a separate cable?

(I've never been up close to them to see).

C3PO

Having come to road bikes from MTBs I found cycling in the drops very disconcerting and somehow felt very vulnerable when descending on them! The hand position on the brakes also felt awkward. Finally decided to work on it last year and within a few weeks it became second nature and I'm now descending faster and I believe in more control than before. Stick with it!

Idleater

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Just a question regarding those modern type of lever fitted on the top bars - are they independent of the normal levers as in, do they have a separate cable?

(I've never been up close to them to see).

From the ones I've repaired, the cable goes through to the caliper but the housing goes to the bar lever, and from the lever on to the caliper. When you pull the lever, the two outers part so to speak.

The modulation was terrible, I wouldn't like to heavily use them.

Like vbrakes with non vbrake levers

tomasrojo

Idleater wrote: »

From the ones I've repaired, the cable goes through to the caliper but the housing goes to the bar lever, and from the lever on to the caliper. When you pull the lever, the two outers part so to speak.

I think they're called interrupter levers, which seems to be quite a good name for them.

As said, they're different from "suicide levers". I remember this, because it's one of the first facts I learnt on this forum.

Lumen

tomasrojo wrote: »

I think they're called interrupter levers, which seems to be quite a good name for them.

As said, they're different from "suicide levers". I remember this, because it's one of the first facts I learnt on this forum.

Correct.

Suicide levers are an integral extension to traditional (non-brifter) brake levers.

Idleater

Lumen wrote: »

tomasrojo wrote: »

I think they're called interrupter levers, which seems to be quite a good name for them.

As said, they're different from "suicide levers". I remember this, because it's one of the first facts I learnt on this forum.

Correct.

Suicide levers are an integral extension to traditional (non-brifter) brake levers.

Suicide as in the secondary lever hits the bars before the pads contact the rims?

tomasrojo

https://sheldonbrown.com/gloss_e-f.html#extension

There under "Extension Lever", which is linked to when you look up "Suicide Lever".

This system has several drawbacks:

• The extension lever partially applied the main brake lever, reducing the available lever travel. Not all brands/models suffered from this, but the most common ones did.
• The attachment hardware precluded the use of the top of the brake lever hood as a comfortable riding position.
• They encouraged the practice of riding with the hands on the top, middle section of the bar, which is a position that doesn't give very secure control, especially on bumpy surfaces, because the hands are too close together.
• The hardware that held the extension levers to the main levers was prone to fall off.

doozerie

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

You've just brought me back to the 1970's. I'd forgotten about those types. They were particularly useless when the metal became worn where they engaged with the regular levers.

My first "road bike" was in the 80's, and came with these brake extension levers fitted. Not that "cheap" and "rubbish" always went hand in hand, but it certainly did in this case. They were basically a standard part on basic/cheap bikes even then.

My one lingering memory of the shop where I bought that bike is seeing them re-centre brake callipers by holding a screwdriver against the calliper and belting the screwdriver handle with a hammer. Even with very little real bike-wrangling experience by then that approach just seemed wrong. You could get away with it with steel callipers, but it was one measure of how poorly designed the callipers were (I still recall the relief of my first half-decent callipers, they didn't go off-centre at the slightest provocation, and if they did they could be re-centred without a hammer - bliss!).

Those brake extension levers were invariably a loose/sloppy fit to start, which in itself would have been enough to make brake performance poor, like having a slack brake cable. But that combined with their attempt to move the primary brake lever from the top (= minimal leverage), plus rubbish callipers, made them particularly ineffective/rubbish. More like speed attenuators than brakes - mind you, that's something they had in common with some of the early designs of "proper" road brakes (I had a set of Campag brake calipers and brake-only levers from the 80's which were almost as awful, particularly with their stock "last forever"/hard as nails brake pads fitted).

On that first cheap road bike I replaced the stock rubbish brake levers + extensions with a much higher quality set, an early bit of bike tinkering on my part. The replacement ones were a much better design, nowhere near the same degree of slop in their fit to the primary brake lever body. I felt almost awesome, the one-eyed kid in the valley of the blind.

Despite being a massive improvement though, those "awesome" (= less sh1te) extension levers were still predictably inferior to the main levers. Plus I still recall getting my fingers pinned between the extension lever and the handlebars if I let the brake pads wear too much or let some slack develop in the brake cable over time. Steep learning curve - maintain your brakes or prepare for a fright when you really really need to use them.

Don't know why people call those extension brake levers "suicide levers" though. Clearly from a purely mechanical point of view they are not as effective as the primary brake levers, but I can say from personal experience that some of the conventional primary brake levers were rubbish too (not just due to the levers themselves, but also the callipers + their adjustment, choice of brake pad + their adjustment, etc.).

Mostly though I suspect that the worst examples of those brake extension levers were so bad due to poor bike maintenance as much as bad design of the levers - some people just don't know or care about bike maintenance and that is as true at the top end of bicycle price range where extension brake levers don't exist, as at the bottom end where they perhaps still appear as standard.

doozerie

Idleater wrote: »

The modulation was terrible, I wouldn't like to heavily use them.

Like vbrakes with non vbrake levers

One possibility here is that the pull ratio of those levers isn't well suited to your brakes (callipers?). Not unlike the challenge of finding a good match between modern drop-bar brake levers/brifters and cantilever brakes on CX bikes.

I've never had to install CX brake levers on a bike but I'd expect finding a good match would be part of the challenge. My daughter's bike came with CX levers fitted though, paired with canti's and low-end Shimano brifters, and both sets of brake levers seem to be similarly effective.

tomasrojo

doozerie wrote: »

Don't know why people call those extension brake levers "suicide levers" though. Clearly from a purely mechanical point of view they are not as effective as the primary brake levers, but I can say from personal experience that some of the conventional primary brake levers were rubbish too (not just due to the levers themselves, but also the callipers + their adjustment, choice of brake pad + their adjustment, etc.).

The Sheldon Brown link above mentions that the extension levers were marketed as "safety levers", so the nickname was trying to counteract that.

silverharp

was down to Glencree yesterday,went much better, used a kind of pistol grip for the brakes which worked better rather than using a full grip