Living in London - applying for jobs in Ireland, no response! Any similar experiences

cottonsocks

Hi all,

I am currently living in London and have done so for the last 8 years, moving here after I have graduated.

Both my partner and I (who is British) have decided to move to Ireland to buy a house as living in London is not sustainable.

I have a good CV now, and have gained some excellent experience. I am currently a Marketing Manager in an international school in Central London, earning £35k.

I have began applying for jobs in Ireland - Dublin - in fact I have applied for quite a few - but absolutely nothing has come of it. Maybe I am mistaken, but I had thought the jobs market had improved? The roles I am applying for are typically Marketing Manager, €40-50k, so I don't think I'm asking too much of a jump. I have 5 years marketing experience (spent the other 3 as a Primary School Teacher!)

I guess what I'm asking is, why do you think I'm getting no responses? Has anyone who has moved from the UK or London to Ireland had the same experience? Is it because employers see on my CV a London address and discount me? Am I pitching my salary too high? What might it be? All I ever get is the email saying 'thank you for applying blah blah' and then nothing further.

My fiancé works in Finance in London and is having the exact same experience as me. We both have 3 months notice, so quitting our jobs and moving to Ireland with nothing secured isn't really an option.

Any thoughts or opinions or experiences to share greatly appreciated!

OMM 0000

I think you're getting no response because you're in London.

Scenario:

I advertise a Marketing Manager position.

I get 5 responses.

4 are in Dublin. 1 is in London.

I will prioritise the Dublin folk.

It's also possible your cover letter or CV are not that good. Do you write a custom cover letter for each job? Has someone reviewed your CV?

theteal

I will be in a very similar situation at some stage i.e. moving back.

How's your cover letter? I would have your intentions for moving back mentioned very early in it.

Notice period is a bit long too. Maybe you need to be looking to more senior roles where it's more accustomed to wait such periods of time.

TG860

cottonsocks wrote: »

Hi all,

I am currently living in London and have done so for the last 8 years, moving here after I have graduated.

Both my partner and I (who is British) have decided to move to Ireland to buy a house as living in London is not sustainable.

I have a good CV now, and have gained some excellent experience. I am currently a Marketing Manager in an international school in Central London, earning £35k.

I have began applying for jobs in Ireland - Dublin - in fact I have applied for quite a few - but absolutely nothing has come of it. Maybe I am mistaken, but I had thought the jobs market had improved? The roles I am applying for are typically Marketing Manager, €40-50k, so I don't think I'm asking too much of a jump. I have 5 years marketing experience (spent the other 3 as a Primary School Teacher!)

I guess what I'm asking is, why do you think I'm getting no responses? Has anyone who has moved from the UK or London to Ireland had the same experience? Is it because employers see on my CV a London address and discount me? Am I pitching my salary too high? What might it be? All I ever get is the email saying 'thank you for applying blah blah' and then nothing further.

My fiancé works in Finance in London and is having the exact same experience as me. We both have 3 months notice, so quitting our jobs and moving to Ireland with nothing secured isn't really an option.

Any thoughts or opinions or experiences to share greatly appreciated!

It will be tricky for both of you (on 3 months notice) to secure a job in Ireland at roughly the same time so that everything lines up perfectly for a relocation to Ireland. If one of you can secure a job pre-moving I'd be happy enough with that. Finance is booming in Ireland so you're fiancé will likely have more luck finding something quicker.

Perhaps your marketing sector experience is a little niche for the Dublin market? There aren't that many international schools in Ireland, especially compared to London. It may be worth speaking to a recruiter in your industry to get a sense of the market and which sectors you should aim at.
Realistically you will have to interview in person in Ireland to seal the deal, even if you do well in an inital skype interview. So be prepared for that and indicate a willingness to do it, even if a skype interview would be preferable at the first stage.

seamus

Take your address off your CV for a start. No need to have it there.

Update your LinkedIn profile so that it doesn't necessarily look like you're London-based, or that at the very least you are searching for jobs in Ireland.

If you can get yourself an Irish phone number forwarded to your English mobile, even better.

If your name doesn't scream "I'm Irish", then try to Irish yourself up a bit. I dunno, if your name is "Peter Jones", then maybe change your LinkedIn profile so it shows "Peter Jones (Peadar Mac Seán)" or something. Recruiters obviously aren't permitted to discriminate on nationality...but they do.

On the topic of LinkedIn, be active on it. Make sure your profile stands out as much as possible and is marked so that it looks like you're open. If you're not getting irritated by recruiters getting in touch, then you're not visible enough on LinkedIn.

Also, 3 months notice is way over the odds for the salary you're looking for. If anyone asks, your notice period is one month. If you get a job, negotiate the notice period down with your current employer. Worst case scenario is that you leave after a month with them a bit irritated by you. They won't suing you for breach of contract.

cottonsocks

TG860 wrote: »

It will be tricky for both of you (on 3 months notice) to secure a job in Ireland at roughly the same time so that everything lines up perfectly for a relocation to Ireland. If one of you can secure a job pre-moving I'd be happy enough with that. Finance is booming in Ireland so you're fiancé will likely have more luck finding something quicker.

Perhaps your marketing sector experience is a little niche for the Dublin market? There aren't that many international schools in Ireland, especially compared to London. It may be worth speaking to a recruiter in your industry to get a sense of the market and which sectors you should aim at.
Realistically you will have to interview in person in Ireland to seal the deal, even if you do well in an inital skype interview. So be prepared for that and indicate a willingness to do it, even if a skype interview would be preferable at the first stage.

I think the worst bit of 3 months notice is that the jobs I've applied to aren't even aware of this yet! My fiance does need 3 months because he is more senior than me, and also in the UK it's a requirement in terms of the type of role he has in finance, but for my normal, ordinary Marketing Manager job it is just way over the top! Wish I had thought a bit more before accepting this position but oh well...!

cottonsocks

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I think you're getting no response because you're in London.

Scenario:

I advertise a Marketing Manager position.

I get 5 responses.

4 are in Dublin. 1 is in London.

I will prioritise the Dublin folk.

It's also possible your cover letter or CV are not that good. Do you write a custom cover letter for each job? Has someone reviewed your CV?

Thanks! I am strongly suspecting where we are based seems to be the biggest drawback - I'm surprised, as I would have thought employers would know we would be willing to pay for our own flights / make ourselves available promptly for interviews but it is more prohibitive than I anticipated...

cottonsocks

Thanks so far everyone. I think the biggest hurdle regarding location is even if we remove address etc, it still says we presently work in roles based in London going by most recent position dates... not sure how to get around that one just yet!

Generally, in Ireland (because I graduated and came here I've never worked professionally in Ireland!) are employers quite slow to get back to you after applying? How many weeks would you expect typically? They are quite quick in the UK - if they want you, they want you, and will pick you up and put you though the recruitment process fast if they like you!

Ohmeha

cottonsocks wrote: »

Generally, in Ireland (because I graduated and came here I've never worked professionally in Ireland!) are employers quite slow to get back to you after applying? How many weeks would you expect typically? They are quite quick in the UK - if they want you, they want you, and will pick you up and put you though the recruitment process fast if they like you!

I'm guessing it can vary depending on industry from my experience here if you're going to be contacted for an interview you would likely hear something by two weeks, my record is 3 months after applying

Hobosan

Personally, I'd never hire someone moving from London. I don't run a business so the logistics of it would be unworkable.

I imagine most people won't hire you for that very reason.

listermint

We interview and hire people from all over EU. But we are a technology company.


The CV has to shine though. Does yours say to someone marketing or does it say teacher that got a job marketing in the same school. It may require a professional to assist on it.

endabob1

cottonsocks wrote: »

Hi all,

I am currently living in London and have done so for the last 8 years, moving here after I have graduated.

Both my partner and I (who is British) have decided to move to Ireland to buy a house as living in London is not sustainable.

I have a good CV now, and have gained some excellent experience. I am currently a Marketing Manager in an international school in Central London, earning £35k.

I have began applying for jobs in Ireland - Dublin - in fact I have applied for quite a few - but absolutely nothing has come of it. Maybe I am mistaken, but I had thought the jobs market had improved? The roles I am applying for are typically Marketing Manager, €40-50k, so I don't think I'm asking too much of a jump. I have 5 years marketing experience (spent the other 3 as a Primary School Teacher!)

I guess what I'm asking is, why do you think I'm getting no responses? Has anyone who has moved from the UK or London to Ireland had the same experience? Is it because employers see on my CV a London address and discount me? Am I pitching my salary too high? What might it be? All I ever get is the email saying 'thank you for applying blah blah' and then nothing further.

My fiancé works in Finance in London and is having the exact same experience as me. We both have 3 months notice, so quitting our jobs and moving to Ireland with nothing secured isn't really an option.

Any thoughts or opinions or experiences to share greatly appreciated!

I spent about 2 years applying for jobs in Ireland. I have worked all over the world and have loads of experience in reasonably senior roles.

My experience of the Irish job hunt is not good. In the end I gave up and came to the conclusion that the only way you will have a chance is to take the plunge, resign and move back.

I did a few interviews, flying back at my own expense and without exception the lack of professionalism astonished me. In hindsight (always 20:20) I think with possibly 1 exception the companies I interviewed with, didn't really know what they wanted and probably interviewed loads of candidates.

Also I had no intention of working in Dublin as to be honest I see it as similar to living in London so I would expect the big multinationals would be a different kettle of fish. My experiences were mainly with SME Irish companies. In 2 instances I was told I was too senior, and in 2 I stances I had litteraly no feedback, zero.

I have got work overseas remotely before, so I know it can be done but in the case of moving back to Ireland I think you really need to be there. It will open up the temp/contract market to you which would be a good stepping stone in terms of both getting some Irish experience on your cv and potentially just getting a foot in the door.

listermint

Lack of professionalism...

The companies didn't know what they were looking for


I had no intention of working in Dublin.



Yet you moved back and were doing interviews.



Erm
..........

whatnext

When I look at a CV / application from overseas there are a couple of things I am looking for.


The key one is that there is a definite plan.

Little things in the cover note like these can help:


We have decided to return to Dublin as opposed to I’m thinking of coming home.

How can I interview them? I can do a Skype interview with 24 hours notice or face to face with a weeks notice. Tuesdays suit best for a day trip as the flights are less expensive and it’s easier to get out of work. OR I am back in Dublin on the following dates(not to far in the future) if it suits for a face to face interview.

We will be living in Dublin XX so Commuting to XXXXXX is straight forward. We have tempory accommodation lined up for 3 to 4 months when we arrive home.

I would be hoping to achieve a salary in the region of €XXXXXK.

I am on 3 months notice and would be in a position to take up a new role within X weeks of offer. There may be scope to negotiate this down but it’s not something I can address prior to receiving a formal offer.

My partner works in XXXXXX field and is also currently interviewing with firms in the Dublin X area.

What the above tells me is that there is a plan, it’s thought through and everyone is in on it. A lot of the info above is stuff some people are afraid to ask about, so you have the opportunity to put their mind at ease.
The reality is with online ads most people don’t read the specs anymore so a bit of evidence that you have and know something about the company you are applying to will also help.

If I get a generic cover note riddled with mistakes my view is it probably one of many applications sent out and then less of a priority for me. If it looks like the note was written specifically with my job ad in mind I think this person is a. Genuinely interested in the role. b. Probably not interviewing with everyone in town so if I do invest my time in meetings them there is a good chance they will accept if offered.

Nikki Sixx

Is it Brexit jitters are sending you back to Ireland? You’ll be paying a fortune in rent over here, have you factored that into the equation?

endabob1

listermint wrote: »

Lack of professionalism...

The companies didn't know what they were looking for


I had no intention of working in Dublin.



Yet you moved back and were doing interviews.



Erm
..........

I didn't move.... that's the whole point

joeguevara

You have received some great advice here. Use the fact that you are working in London to your advantage as it's something other people won't have.

If you have not received any interview invites then there has to be something wrong with the way you have structured your application which as others have said is probably your cover letter. It should allay the prospective employers concerns that you are not in Ireland. Demonstrate your London experience and the positives from that but also make it clear that you are serious about moving to Ireland.

One thing that might be an idea is go to a recruitment consultant in London that also has an office in Ireland. This might make it easier to get an interview. I am currently recruiting for a position and have received CVs from international candidates and haven't progressed because I am not convinced how they would have specific experience Irish experience. But also I am not going to the bother of discussing the role with people who couldn't be bothered explaining their desire to actually move to Ireland. It appears that they have scattergunned their CV because it was on a website.

I am however, interviewing 3 international candidates next week because they are coming through a recruitment consultant who explained why they are suitable for the role and also the fact that they are moving here. I am not advocating that Recruitment consultants are the way to go but is an example of how you can get a foot in.

I hope the job search works out. It will be easier when you are here. But the way you apply makes such a difference and living in London should be a plus rather than a hindrance.

beejee

Interesting experiences here, echoing personal experience (myself and those I know)

You could be running the wall Street stock exchange single-handed for 100 years, yet you'll get a very lukewarm response in ireland, if any.

There's always a hint of begrudgery in ireland, May or may not be a factor. Also Dublin is just not a city with great opportunity, it's a very limited market (remember we have a national population less than many medium/large cities)

It's incredibly expensive for what it is, too. (not that London is much different)

So, sparse opportunity beyond entry level stuff, very expensive, and a large spectre of nepotism.

Good luck!

cottonsocks

Thanks for all of your replies. Very useful actions, which I have taken on board! One final question - I've noticed on a number of job descriptions there is a large focus on education and qualifications compared to what I have seen in the UK. Is this an important factor for recruiters/hiring managers?

My experience here is that relevant work experience has always been evaluated far higher than educational attainment.

endabob1

cottonsocks wrote: »

Thanks for all of your replies. Very useful actions, which I have taken on board! One final question - I've noticed on a number of job descriptions there is a large focus on education and qualifications compared to what I have seen in the UK. Is this an important factor for recruiters/hiring managers?

My experience here is that relevant work experience has always been evaluated far higher than educational attainment.

This is also my experience of working in the UK;

However I have also worked in Australia & South Africa and they were very focused on having the right qualifications, I think for the most part (after graduate/entry level) the UK is slightly at odds with other places in that they will look more at your experience than whether you got a 2:1 or a 2:2 10 years ago

seamus

Again depends on industry I feel.

There was a time when some big tech companies wouldn't look at people who had less than a 1:1 degree. But now for anyone with 5+ years of experience, qualifications are largely unimportant.

My limited exposure to finance says that they're more concerned with making sure the appropriate certifications are in place, especially when it comes to the bigger companies.

average hero

Hey cottonsocks. I have recently returned to Dublin from London so I will give you a quick synopsis of my story and then what my opinions are.

I left Dublin in 2013 after graduating from university here. The country was still recovering from the financial disaster so things were tight and I moved to London. In London it took me about 2 months to secure a job in a good graduate leadership programme and I worked hard at it for nearly four years. I moved into senior management, gained a masters and worked in a senior role for quite some time. The training I received really was quite excellent. I was applying for jobs in Dublin from London quite frequently but I got zero responses.

At Christmas 2018, I decided to try to make a return to Dublin and make a go of it. Some of my reasons were quite similar to yours. I claimed job seekers for a couple of months and my job coach thought my CV was very impressive. I attended a jobs fair where I met a career coach who worked in my industry and she also thought my experience was great. She thought that I should hold out and try to get a senior job in my trained-in field. Due to financial pressures and getting few responses from CVs I sent into places, I took an entry-level job in financial services and started recently.

So - that's my synopsis over.

My experience is that I received ZERO responses from Dublin job applications I submitted from London. Recruiters flat out told me that it would be better if I was back in Dublin. Even when I had returned to Dublin, there was what appeared to be skepticism or begrudgery towards my CV and experience. A poster above mentioned that too. There is also an aspect of nepotism here in places, in Dublin.

So my opinion would be that to really source something or something good, you would want to be on the ground here, meeting recruiters, pretending you are here already. Could you fly over for a few days and meet a few recruiters?

Other than that, advice I would give would be to tailor your cover letter and CV to every job you apply for. Just draw out the exact experience they are looking for in their job description a little more in your CV. Fawn over the company and the role in your cover letter and make it sound like you are in Dublin and would love that role in particular.

Other than that, good luck! Anything else - just PM me!

lainey_d_123

Nikki Sixx wrote: »

Is it Brexit jitters are sending you back to Ireland? You’ll be paying a fortune in rent over here, have you factored that into the equation?

LOL. Do you think they're not paying a fortune in rent in London? Have you been to London?

Del2005

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

LOL. Do you think they're not paying a fortune in rent in London? Have you been to London?

They'll be in for a shock if they think Dublin will be cheaper to live, along with the general lack of rental options. So similar costs, less options for housing than London and currently no responses to job application's.

Its not a good idea to start thinking its nepotism its begrudgery, its the adcidemic qualficication they want and so on, It might simply that the market in Dublin is highley competitive and much smaller that London.

experiMental

I'm living in Canada and tried to apply for contract work in Ireland. Out of 6 different recruiters, I got two replies - but I knew one personally, and another was from a message board that I frequently used.

It may be better to contact someone you know, and then get their friends who are recruiters to get back to you.

I have found that cold e-mailing to enquire about job opportunities from outside of Ireland has limited success rate.

tricky D

Work the hell out your LinkedIn. Load it up with skills, endorsements, accomplishments, etc. Make sure your CV and LI profile align. Get LI Premium at €31pm after free first month - the insights from this are massive. Do similar on the other job portals: Indeed, Jobbio, etc. though they won't have anywhere near the power of LI.

One of the biggest tricks people miss is picking up the phone. There is nothing like personal contact. A CV, email or whatever, can be binned with no consequence, but talking establishes personal connection where people in general tend to want to assist as empathy kicks in.