Dealing with macamore soil

CarPark2

We are based in Co. Wexford and have macamore soil which is really poor draining. There is an area beside the house that would be perfect for a swing set but the soil is water logged all winter. Has anybody else been in this situation and managed to find a resolution?
I had an idea that if we were to fit a non-permeable surface on a slight slope, we could stop the rainwater getting into the ground and, due to the slope, we could collect it at the edge in a drain (covered with a metal/plastic grate). There is a stream downhill from the area, so the idea would be to pipe the water down to the stream. I guess (but i am not sure) that some of the wet-pour playground surfaces would be non-water permeable. But this is all a theoretical solution. I don't know anybody that has done this.
In real-life, have you any experience of dealing with this type of soil and converting it into an area where kids can play all year? What did you do and did it work well?
All advice gratefully received.

Tails142

People try things like digging small trenches through the poor draining area and filling with gravels and sand, people also use perforated pipes in these trenches. The idea is to give a route for the water to get away from the poorly drained soil. You could run the pipes or trenches toward the stream, I have also seen people run the pipes to a sump and pump the water away using a small electric pump on a float switch.

Our houses are built on a heavy clays so we have a similar problem though I am not too badly affected. A neighbour of mine tried to dig through the clay to put in a drainage trench, but when he broke through the clay layer he was left with water nearly gushing up as he had hit the water table which was confined beneath the clay. Their house being at the bottom of a hill. So that's something to watch out for.

Best of luck.

CarPark2

Tails142 wrote: »

People try things like digging small trenches through the poor draining area and filling with gravels and sand, people also use perforated pipes in these trenches. The idea is to give a route for the water to get away from the poorly drained soil. You could run the pipes or trenches toward the stream, I have also seen people run the pipes to a sump and pump the water away using a small electric pump on a float switch.

Our houses are built on a heavy clays so we have a similar problem though I am not too badly affected. A neighbour of mine tried to dig through the clay to put in a drainage trench, but when he broke through the clay layer he was left with water nearly gushing up as he had hit the water table which was confined beneath the clay. Their house being at the bottom of a hill. So that's something to watch out for.

Best of luck.

Thanks for that.
The clay is so dense that we would need to have those trenches no more than one or two feet apart. At the moment, there is a joke which I dug and the water is visible in that about 1 foot below the ground. Less than two feet away the water is visible at ground level. So there is no lateral flow as well as no vertical flow of water through this clay!

macraignil

The garden in my parents' house has a heavy clay which was not a problem up until I wanted to grow some vegetables there and found it very difficult to work with. The water table was very high and there was not much of a slope to allow much drainage and there was water coming down to the area from the garden to the north which was slightly uphill. I could tell the drainage was particularly bad as if I dug down into the soil only the first 30cm or less was normal brown top soil and then there was just a solid layer of rust that I think is called a hard pan and below that just yellow clay.

What I did was dig a trench from the point where water could be channeled away to the middle of my intended vegetable plot and another trench at the side and running along the slightly uphill side of the garden to intercept water coming down from the neighbours' that were slightly uphill. The trench with a slight slope to keep water moving to where it could be drained had PVC standard drain pipes laid down to keep a channel open for the water to flow away. I made a loose box of concrete blocks to keep the uphill side of the pipes open to take in water. The pipes where then buried when back filling the trenches. Then I planted the area with fruit trees and shrubs which would send roots down into the ground and hopefully break up the hard pan in the clay. I also added a lot of organic material over a few years and the soil structure in the area has improved and is no longer waterlogged in winter. In hindsight I would have drilled some holes in the PVC piping to allow it drain over its full length and take measures with the pipes to prevent them being accessed by rats and mice but these points were not relevant overall as the drainage pipes did the job of keeping the soil dry enough for the fruit trees and shrubs to get established and these have helped the soil structure to the extent that now the pipes no longer seem to be required. Even after long periods of rain the ground does not seem to be waterlogged and the pipes are no longer spewing water like they did when initially installed.

In short to stop water logging improving the soil structure is the main solution.

CarPark2

macraignil wrote: »

The garden in my parents' house has a heavy clay which was not a problem up until I wanted to grow some vegetables there and found it very difficult to work with. The water table was very high and there was not much of a slope to allow much drainage and there was water coming down to the area from the garden to the north which was slightly uphill. I could tell the drainage was particularly bad as if I dug down into the soil only the first 30cm or less was normal brown top soil and then there was just a solid layer of rust that I think is called a hard pan and below that just yellow clay.

What I did was dig a trench from the point where water could be channeled away to the middle of my intended vegetable plot and another trench at the side and running along the slightly uphill side of the garden to intercept water coming down from the neighbours' that were slightly uphill. The trench with a slight slope to keep water moving to where it could be drained had PVC standard drain pipes laid down to keep a channel open for the water to flow away. I made a loose box of concrete blocks to keep the uphill side of the pipes open to take in water. The pipes where then buried when back filling the trenches. Then I planted the area with fruit trees and shrubs which would send roots down into the ground and hopefully break up the hard pan in the clay. I also added a lot of organic material over a few years and the soil structure in the area has improved and is no longer waterlogged in winter. In hindsight I would have drilled some holes in the PVC piping to allow it drain over its full length and take measures with the pipes to prevent them being accessed by rats and mice but these points were not relevant overall as the drainage pipes did the job of keeping the soil dry enough for the fruit trees and shrubs to get established and these have helped the soil structure to the extent that now the pipes no longer seem to be required. Even after long periods of rain the ground does not seem to be waterlogged and the pipes are no longer spewing water like they did when initially installed.

In short to stop water logging improving the soil structure is the main solution.

Thanks for that. For the drains, piping etc did you do it yourself or get somebody to do it for you? If somebody else, was it builder or landscape gardener or somebody else?

uck51js9zml2yt

macraignil wrote: »

The garden in my parents' house has a heavy clay which was not a problem up until I wanted to grow some vegetables there and found it very difficult to work with. The water table was very high and there was not much of a slope to allow much drainage and .

I'm in a similar position. Is there any chance of a photo to see where you put your trees in relation to the veg?

macraignil

CarPark2 wrote: »

Thanks for that. For the drains, piping etc did you do it yourself or get somebody to do it for you? If somebody else, was it builder or landscape gardener or somebody else?

Just did the work myself. I have experience of landscape gardening and building and so would trust my own sense on how such a drainage system should work. It would very much depend on your individual site and circumstances as to how such a system would apply to your situation. In my own circumstances the drains only applied an initial assistance to the trees and shrubs getting established and as mentioned it is now the improved soil structure that provides the drainage in that area of the garden.


To cultivate a clay soil successfully organic matter and deep rooting plants can help form a soil structure with "peds" or lumps of soil that allow air and water flow through rather than be held in a congealed mass.

macraignil

Deacon Icy Creator wrote: »

I'm in a similar position. Is there any chance of a photo to see where you put your trees in relation to the veg?

No photos online to show the position of trees in relation to the vegetables I was planting but this video clip shows some blackcurrants growing in the area of the garden that was most waterlogged previously. When I realised the drainage was such a problem in this area I decided to grow more fruit in this area and vegetables on another part of the garden where digging the ground in the winter was less of a problem. Here is a clip I posted earlier of a bay laurel shrub I planted to provide a deep rooting plant in the poorly draining soil.

secman

I too have macamore clay, right now its saturated as there has been a lot of rain down there of late. When we bought the site, the farmer had put in drainage, last summer with the drought they were clear to see where they were in the garden. Trenches across the site to the ditch, bedded with gravel and the yellow drainage piping put on top of the gravel, the water drains into the ditch. We learnt the hard way as to what you can plant in macamore clay. Has benefits too on the Summer as it retains water longer for the grass and plants, winter can be problematic though.