Can we get insurance on a Duplex that has been converted into 3 separate apartments?

dancar10

Hi,


We are looking at purchasing a 3 story duplex apartment - that has been converted into 3 separate apartments by the previous owner (over 10 years ago).

The auctioneer has informed us - there was no planning permission requested by the previous owner when the apartments were converted in 1999.

The auctioneer mentioned that because the development happened more then 7 years ago - it is now statute barred and the council don't have any recourse on the lack of planning permission.

We are cash buyers - so would not need to get a mortgage on the property (which I know would be a no go without planning permission of the property).


We are just wondering :

Is it possible to get tenant/liability insurance on a building that has been converted without planning permission?

If the property was converted in accordance with the fire regulations of the time (1999) when the conversion took place - we should not have any issues with fire reg's?


Is there anything else we should be aware of in buying such a property - that has been converted into separate apartments without planning permission?

Caranica

Is there a management company? The contract I signed for my duplex said it could not be subdivided

peteb2

There's no such thing as tenant liability policies. Are you looking to get cover for the buildings? That would be difficult if it's part of a bigger block of buildings as you can't insure X number of units in isolation from a block.

If you are looking to get property owners liability in isolation from having building cover, again you will struggle.

You might be able to get a contents policy that will pick up your liability as as landlord to tenants also. It won't ask about planning permission on any proposal form

Gumbo

dancar10 wrote: »

Hi,


We are looking at purchasing a 3 story duplex apartment - that has been converted into 3 separate apartments by the previous owner (over 10 years ago).

The auctioneer has informed us - there was no planning permission requested by the previous owner when the apartments were converted in 1999.

The auctioneer mentioned that because the development happened more then 7 years ago - it is now statute barred and the council don't have any recourse on the lack of planning permission.

We are cash buyers - so would not need to get a mortgage on the property (which I know would be a no go without planning permission of the property).


We are just wondering :

Is it possible to get tenant/liability insurance on a building that has been converted without planning permission?

If the property was converted in accordance with the fire regulations of the time (1999) when the conversion took place - we should not have any issues with fire reg's?


Is there anything else we should be aware of in buying such a property - that has been converted into separate apartments without planning permission?

You may be ok from an Enforcement point of view with regards to Planning, But Building control can commence proceedings against you for lack of Fire Safety Certificate. Also, because its now apartments, Fire Services Act applies.

Also, because its within a Managed complex, the Management Company will need to be notified.

Marcusm

dancar10 wrote: »

Hi,


We are looking at purchasing a 3 story duplex apartment - that has been converted into 3 separate apartments by the previous owner (over 10 years ago).

The auctioneer has informed us - there was no planning permission requested by the previous owner when the apartments were converted in 1999.

The auctioneer mentioned that because the development happened more then 7 years ago - it is now statute barred and the council don't have any recourse on the lack of planning permission.

We are cash buyers - so would not need to get a mortgage on the property (which I know would be a no go without planning permission of the property).


We are just wondering :

Is it possible to get tenant/liability insurance on a building that has been converted without planning permission?

If the property was converted in accordance with the fire regulations of the time (1999) when the conversion took place - we should not have any issues with fire reg's?


Is there anything else we should be aware of in buying such a property - that has been converted into separate apartments without planning permission?

If it’s three storeys, it’s a tripled unless it’s a duplex with an attic conversion. If the subdivision was undertaken without the permission of the ONC/freeholder then it is likely a serious breach of the lease which could prompt forfeiture proceedings. I would want a significant discount on market value to take on that risk.

dancar10

Caranica wrote: »

Is there a management company? The contract I signed for my duplex said it could not be subdivided

Yes there is a management company and block insurance.

I will contact them to check if they are aware of the current configuration and if the block in insurance still covers the tripled unit in its current configuration.

dancar10

peteb2 wrote: »

There's no such thing as tenant liability policies. Are you looking to get cover for the buildings? That would be difficult if it's part of a bigger block of buildings as you can't insure X number of units in isolation from a block.

If you are looking to get property owners liability in isolation from having building cover, again you will struggle.

You might be able to get a contents policy that will pick up your liability as as landlord to tenants also. It won't ask about planning permission on any proposal form

Yes - we will contact Property Management company to confirm block insurance is still valid with its current configuration.

We also want to make sure we can get liability insurance, from a tennant/guest injuring themselves in the unit. I will contact our broker to make sure we can secure content/landlord insurance with the building in its current configuration.

kceire wrote: »

You may be ok from an Enforcement point of view with regards to Planning, But Building control can commence proceedings against you for lack of Fire Safety Certificate. Also, because its now apartments, Fire Services Act applies.

Also, because its within a Managed complex, the Management Company will need to be notified.

Thanks for the heads up. I will double check with architect. Do you know what are the main differences between regular fire regs and Fire Services Act? Thanks.

Marcusm wrote: »

If it’s three storeys, it’s a tripled unless it’s a duplex with an attic conversion. If the subdivision was undertaken without the permission of the ONC/freeholder then it is likely a serious breach of the lease which could prompt forfeiture proceedings. I would want a significant discount on market value to take on that risk.

I will check with property management company / freeholder - if they are aware of the current configuration of the tripled.

The property is currently on the market at a premium compared to the similar properties in the development that sold recently. I suppose that is because it generates more revenue as it is split into 3 units.