The awful N11 cycling track - can anything be done

maddy1026

Hi folks,

Anyone here cycle through the god awful cycle tracks on the N11?
Particularly, the one from Stillorgan grange apartments to UCd/Donnybrook.

Too many cracks on the road, tracks not merging properly. This makes it more of an off road experience than city cycling. Not something one looks forward to whilst cycling to work.

Is there a place where I can register my grievance about this. Thanks and have a good evening.

Alexzont

I've been cycling it out of town for the last 6 years, the only improvement they've ever made in that time is patching up HALF the strip going along by RTE. I don't even bother taking it in and stick to the Rock road. It's a shame since it's such a busy route.

10-10-20

I agree. That N11 section AND the Leopardstown Rd.
Especially the deep-dish, double-sided, extra lumpy with added tree-roots section between Foxrock Manor and Torquay Rd...

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.2753384,-6.1901672,3a,75y,219h,73.47t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s-Am34CS7xmusN-RPDlLQ5A!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

One wrong move there and you'll end up with a pizza face. Hate it.

tomasrojo

I usually use the Clonskeagh/Ranelagh route to avoid it. I try to traverse it, if necessary, and never follow it.

work

I think you could just call the council and ask?
Disgraceful dangerous scary ....so many issues not fixed and a 7 year old could plan it better. The route from RTE TO UCD is insane:
Never cleaned, collects rain so potholes lethal with heavy rain, Drains in the cycle lane all the way and change side all the time like dodgums, Busses beep and intimidate you (only some), Cars park in lane, Busses pull in in front of you forcing you out, Surface quality lethal. It's an embarrassment and the Ross minister of muppetry should be shot (not literally).

On the way in to town before the Radison coming down the hill recently a lane was put behind a new bus stop. Great but would love to know the cost it took weeks to do. But importantly what fool designs these. The new stop has a decent curve the cyclist must negotiate so you lean to the right....they put a huge lamppost right by the cycle lane...scary for the cyclist and dangerous.
Design geniuses put a bin on another stop and it only opens from the cycle lane......Honestly a child would do better.

Sorry for the rant but it is unforgivable to put us in danger like this.

maddy1026

tomasrojo wrote: »

I usually use the Clonskeagh/Ranelagh route to avoid it. I try to traverse it, if necessary, and never follow it.

Unfortunately for me , can't avoid it.

maddy1026

work wrote: »

I think you could just call the council and ask?
Disgraceful dangerous scary ....so many issues not fixed and a 7 year old could plan it better. The route from RTE TO UCD is insane:
Never cleaned, collects rain so potholes lethal with heavy rain, Drains in the cycle lane all the way and change side all the time like dodgums, Busses beep and intimidate you (only some), Cars park in lane, Busses pull in in front of you forcing you out, Surface quality lethal. It's an embarrassment and the Ross minister of muppetry should be shot (not literally).

On the way in to town before the Radison coming down the hill recently a lane was put behind a new bus stop. Great but would love to know the cost it took weeks to do. But importantly what fool designs these. The new stop has a decent curve the cyclist must negotiate so you lean to the right....they put a huge lamppost right by the cycle lane...scary for the cyclist and dangerous.
Design geniuses put a bin on another stop and it only opens from the cycle lane......Honestly a child would do better.

Sorry for the rant but it is unforgivable to put us in danger like this.

I completely agree with you , it's poor design and not well thought out at all.

Do you mean call the Dublin city council ?

magicbastarder

re which council to call - the flyover at UCD and south of that is DLR, north of it is DCC.

ted1

maddy1026 wrote: »

I completely agree with you , it's poor design and not well thought out at all.

Do you mean call the Dublin city council ?

The UCD flyover is the boundary between Dublin City and Din laoighre rathdown councils

maddy1026

magicbastarder wrote: »

re which council to call - the flyover at UCD and south of that is DLR, north of it is DCC.

Thanks , will update you folks if anything useful /positive

Macy0161

My main issues are really Whites Cross to Kilmacud Road. I generally take the bus lane for those sections (where it's not on the road anyway). Whitescross to Brewey road is appauling surface (cedes right of way too), and then dumps you in a crap position. The Hill (where Esmonde Motors was) to Kilmacud Road is an ok surface, but dumps you out ceding right of way at the pedestrian crossing.

There's a few holes that they could fill, but I don't find it too bad tbh. The new section, while it took ages for what it is, I generally take handy enough as still lots of potential pedestrian interactions. I hadn't noticed the lamppost tbh.

I do sometimes do Nutley Lane to UCD southbound too - I don't even bother with that clusterf*ck of a cycle lane with all the cracked concrete and sunken grates.

I only generally go as far as UCD at the moment, but when I was in Town I used the Rock Road. I haven't done it in a few years, but I never found Temple Hill to Deansgrange that pleasant tbh, particularly outbound in rush hour. Maybe there's a better alternative that I never discovered back up to the N11/ Shankill from the end of the Blackrock bypass?

I will however give special mention of whoever in DLR gave permission for what they've done with the closed cycle lane/ bus lane out in Loughlinstown. Zero reason the footpath couldn't be shared space (if it even needs closing at all at that point), rather than the official choice of dismount or out on the road! Email gone in this morning anyway...

loyatemu

BusConnects plan for the Stillorgan Road was released today. You can view it here.

loyatemu

Macy0161 wrote: »

My main issues are really Whites Cross to Kilmacud Road. I generally take the bus lane for those sections (where it's not on the road anyway). Whitescross to Brewey road is appauling surface (cedes right of way too), and then dumps you in a crap position. The Hill (where Esmonde Motors was) to Kilmacud Road is an ok surface, but dumps you out ceding right of way at the pedestrian crossing.

There's a few holes that they could fill, but I don't find it too bad tbh. The new section, while it took ages for what it is, I generally take handy enough as still lots of potential pedestrian interactions. I hadn't noticed the lamppost tbh.

I do sometimes do Nutley Lane to UCD southbound too - I don't even bother with that clusterf*ck of a cycle lane with all the cracked concrete and sunken grates.

I only generally go as far as UCD at the moment, but when I was in Town I used the Rock Road. I haven't done it in a few years, but I never found Temple Hill to Deansgrange that pleasant tbh, particularly outbound in rush hour. Maybe there's a better alternative that I never discovered back up to the N11/ Shankill from the end of the Blackrock bypass?

I will however give special mention of whoever in DLR gave permission for what they've done with the closed cycle lane/ bus lane out in Loughlinstown. Zero reason the footpath couldn't be shared space (if it even needs closing at all at that point), rather than the official choice of dismount or out on the road! Email gone in this morning anyway...

I use Kilgobbit Park when I cycle in, rather than go through Deansgrange. It's a slight detour but much more pleasant than cycling on the road:

https://goo.gl/maps/rUiH5Bo1wUk

more generally I prefer the Rock Road for going into town. Cycle lane on the Rock Bypass is actually pretty decent and from there to Vincents is OK. Through Ballsbridge isn't great though.

Macy0161

It was the Stradbrook Road to Deansgrange I never liked - I generally found the Clonkeen Road onwards ok. Maybe through Bakers Corner onto Pottery Road or down and through the park might be a better option though. I may be back into town later in the year, but always worth having a few routes!

jive

The biggest pain in the hole is you get so much aggro from motorists for not using the extremely ****e bits (e.g. nutley lane to UCD with all the drains).

Also the 'cycle lane' in Donnybrook is such a waste of paint, I can't for the life of me understand why they bother throwing down the broken line for a cycle lane when the lane is barely wide enough for a car. I'd genuinely like to know what the reason for that is if anyone knows?

MojoMaker

It's called lip service, a.k.a tokenism.

eeeee

The N11 is a nightmare, I don't have to take it anymore thank fcuk, but I did for about 12 years. It is irredeemably hideous.
The lines painted on the road, I actually like controversially. I'm not a fan of segregated infrastructure, as we can't seem to ever build it right, and the lines on the road remind motorists that cyclists exist and need/take up space on the road.

PaulieC

I use it most days from Donnybrook to Brewery and find it fine. Could be better but certainly not as bad as some of the hyperbole above suggests.

maxamillius

Macy0161 wrote: »

My main issues are really Whites Cross to Kilmacud Road. I generally take the bus lane for those sections (where it's not on the road anyway). Whitescross to Brewey road is appauling surface (cedes right of way too), and then dumps you in a crap position. The Hill (where Esmonde Motors was) to Kilmacud Road is an ok surface, but dumps you out ceding right of way at the pedestrian crossing.

There's a few holes that they could fill, but I don't find it too bad tbh. The new section, while it took ages for what it is, I generally take handy enough as still lots of potential pedestrian interactions. I hadn't noticed the lamppost tbh.

I do sometimes do Nutley Lane to UCD southbound too - I don't even bother with that clusterf*ck of a cycle lane with all the cracked concrete and sunken grates.

I only generally go as far as UCD at the moment, but when I was in Town I used the Rock Road. I haven't done it in a few years, but I never found Temple Hill to Deansgrange that pleasant tbh, particularly outbound in rush hour. Maybe there's a better alternative that I never discovered back up to the N11/ Shankill from the end of the Blackrock bypass?

I will however give special mention of whoever in DLR gave permission for what they've done with the closed cycle lane/ bus lane out in Loughlinstown. Zero reason the footpath couldn't be shared space (if it even needs closing at all at that point), rather than the official choice of dismount or out on the road! Email gone in this morning anyway...

Got hit with that lane closure this morning, absolute joke, to be honest I’ve cycled the route from Shankill to town on the N11 for the last 5 years and it’s a joke of a path. Really needs a lot of work, the route coming home is slightly better but not much, just past fox rock church is in terrible condition.

Macy0161

maxamillius wrote: »

Got hit with that lane closure this morning, absolute joke,

I emailed DLR County Council on it yesterday. I have a case number and it's been referred to "Traffic" for investigation.

Overall, to UCD bar the sections I mentioned I don't find it too bad. But like the bit after Foxrock Church southbound, it probably doesn't seem as bad since I switched to 32mm tyres (and away from Marathon Plus'!).

For me, it's still a less stressful option than the alternative of Lamb's Cross/ Dundrum/ Clonskeagh Road, and I never really liked Deansgrange Road/ Stradbrook Road heading home via the Rock Road.

jive

jive wrote: »

Also the 'cycle lane' in Donnybrook is such a waste of paint, I can't for the life of me understand why they bother throwing down the broken line for a cycle lane when the lane is barely wide enough for a car. I'd genuinely like to know what the reason for that is if anyone knows?

It's so a local council department can pat themselves on the back and brag about the miles of cycles lanes they've "built".

monkeyslayer

Cycled it regularly over 20 years but it's been getting worse and worse somehow, don't go no near it at all anymore unless I'm out at night and need the lighting. Chopped up broken surfaces and crisscrossing lines and kerbs and debris is dangerous enoygh, what makes it worse is it's a suburban road that people drive like a motorway.

Macy0161

loyatemu wrote: »

BusConnects plan for the Stillorgan Road was released today. You can view it here.

Actually seems ok from a cyclist point of view? I wouldn't be convinced the new layout will do much around the Old Dublin Road/ Trees Road - issues are behavioural rather than layout there, imo. I'll still be taking the Loughlinstown Roundabout and in by Jim Rock though, not the 4 traffic light cycling route...

Most of it won't be too contentious from Loughlinstown Roundabout in as far as Donnybrook. Issues are going to be Donnybrook, and it doesn't appear that different to existing Loughlinstown Roundabout to Bray, bar the roundabouts going.

Is the bit in Map 37 where they've started work this week - where I and maxamillius mentioned above with the cycle lane closing?

C3PO

I generally take the Rock Road option rather than the N11 but rode out from Donnybrook to Shankill the other evening - it really is a mess!

loyatemu

Macy0161 wrote: »

Actually seems ok from a cyclist point of view? I wouldn't be convinced the new layout will do much around the Old Dublin Road/ Trees Road - issues are behavioural rather than layout there, imo. I'll still be taking the Loughlinstown Roundabout and in by Jim Rock though, not the 4 traffic light cycling route...

Most of it won't be too contentious from Loughlinstown Roundabout in as far as Donnybrook. Issues are going to be Donnybrook, and it doesn't appear that different to existing Loughlinstown Roundabout to Bray, bar the roundabouts going.

Is the bit in Map 37 where they've started work this week - where I and maxamillius mentioned above with the cycle lane closing?

no work has started yet - this is a consultation process.

Macy0161

loyatemu wrote: »

no work has started yet - this is a consultation process.

Yes, I know. But it's not the mess Bus Connects has proposed for cyclists on other corridors.

On Section 37, they say it's covered by an alternative development (or something along those lines) and is greyed out. I think that's the point where they've closed the cycle and bus lanes.

C3PO

PaulieC wrote:

I use it most days from Donnybrook to Brewery and find it fine. Could be better but certainly not as bad as some of the hyperbole above suggests.

What sort of a bike are you riding ... a mountain bike? The surface is in bits along most of that section.

Lewotsil

work wrote: »

The route from RTE TO UCD is insane:
Never cleaned, collects rain so potholes lethal with heavy rain, Drains in the cycle lane all the way and change side all the time like dodgums, Busses beep and intimidate you (only some), Cars park in lane, Busses pull in in front of you forcing you out, Surface quality lethal. It's an embarrassment and the Ross minister of muppetry should be shot (not literally).

Worst section of bike lane in the city in terms of state of repair and design(potholes in the middle). I mailed council 5 years ago about it - got canned response, posted issue to fixmystreet.ie last year nothing. Tweeted couple of weeks ago and got favourable response from Cllr Dermot Lacey and Cllr Claire Byrne who said they had raised it with council. I noticed yesterday that it has been cleaned - the median moraine is gone now - small win #ibikeivote.

Regarding the cars parked - they relate to the renovation of the house - go to Donnybrook Garda Stn and insist on getting a pulse number ??

is_that_so

magicbastarder wrote: »

re which council to call - the flyover at UCD and south of that is DLR, north of it is DCC.

Both, I would have thought, cycling friendly ones first. Hit local TDs with letters as well. They love that type of thing. And don't leave Shane out of it! You should also try a letter to local free paper as well. and don't forget a Facebook page!

monkeybutter

The bus lane is lovely though, so just use that, problem solved

You can get up some daycent speed on the n11 inbound with the right wind, it's great really

PaulieC

C3PO wrote: »

What sort of a bike are you riding ... a mountain bike? The surface is in bits along most of that section.

I have a road bike with 32mm tyres. That short section requires a bit more concentration than the other parts but it's not an assault course...

Plastik

loyatemu wrote: »

BusConnects plan for the Stillorgan Road was released today. You can view it here.

Some interesting bits on that.

Roundabout at Bray North to replaced by a signalled junction with southbound free flow bus and cycle routes. That will also stop traffic trying to get in and out of the N11 as a rat run during evening rush hour.

Roundabouts at Shankill North and South to be replaced by signalled junctions, and the first concrete proposal for the route of the cycling quietway around the west of the village. I can see myself using it inbound, it'll depend on how the outbound works.

Loughlinstown roundabout to be signalled and no longer be free flow.

Johnny Jukebox

Rode it outbound on the MTB today... best bit of urban singletrack I know of.

loyatemu

Plastik wrote: »

Some interesting bits on that.

Roundabout at Bray North to replaced by a signalled junction with southbound free flow bus and cycle routes. That will also stop traffic trying to get in and out of the N11 as a rat run during evening rush hour.

Roundabouts at Shankill North and South to be replaced by signalled junctions, and the first concrete proposal for the route of the cycling quietway around the west of the village. I can see myself using it inbound, it'll depend on how the outbound works.

Loughlinstown roundabout to be signalled and no longer be free flow.

there isn't a hope in hell I'll use that Shankill "quietway" - it'll be far quicker to go through the village.

Plastik

loyatemu wrote: »

there isn't a hope in hell I'll use that Shankill "quietway" - it'll be far quicker to go through the village.

I think it'll depend on what sort of effect the signaling of the roundabout at the bottom of the bridge will have on traffic backing up there. In the grand scheme of the inbound commute the most preferable option might end up being Ballybride-Tassie. The quietway has the potential to be a nice option though.

C3PO

Plastik wrote: »

In the grand scheme of the inbound commute the most preferable option might end up being Ballybride-Tassie. The quietway has the potential to be a nice option though.

Always use Cherrywood Road - Tassie on my inbound commute! Even at 5.40am the Loughlinstown r'about is not a pleasant place on a bike! I'd be coming on from the Shankill exit and would have to ride across the inbound N11!

Macy0161

C3PO wrote: »

I'd be coming on from the Shankill exit and would have to ride across the inbound N11!

It's actually been alright in my experience, and that's after 7.30 usually. Having said that, sometimes earlier brings out the worse/ less attentive driving.

Gandorf

work wrote: »

I think you could just call the council and ask?
The route from RTE TO UCD is insane: Never cleaned, collects rain so potholes lethal with heavy rain, Drains in the cycle lane all the way and change side all the time like dodgums, Busses beep and intimidate you (only some), Cars park in lane, Busses pull in in front of you forcing you out, Surface quality lethal. It's an embarrassment and the Ross minister of muppetry should be shot (not literally).

Bloody stupid and dangerous "cycle track", I always ignore it. Have got some grief from bus drivers (beeping, skimming too close to teach me a lesson), motorists (beeping, shouting out windows), and even other cyclists (one knob shouted at me to use the cycle lane as I rode by in the bus lane )

The rest of the route from Stillorgan to Dublin I find not too bad to be honest, guess I'm just used to it after 10 years+ commuting

Thinkingaboutit

I used to use a bit of it heading to work in Deansgrange, turning right from Foster's Ave, going left at Foxrock church (good uphill and downhill), maybe eight years ago or so. It was alright on my hardtail mountainbike, which avoids the RTÉ bit. There is worse. Now there is better too (cycle track along the Dodder and others), but going on some of the Bus Gate proposals, it could be made even worse.

Macy0161

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

Now there is better too (cycle track along the Dodder and others), but going on some of the Bus Gate proposals, it could be made even worse.

The bus connects proposals seem ok for the N11 imo.

Duckjob

jive wrote: »

The biggest pain in the hole is you get so much aggro from motorists for not using the extremely ****e bits (e.g. nutley lane to UCD with all the drains).

Its one of the things that really grinds my gears when the whole cyclist/motorist debate/mud slinging starts - motorists who never cycle themselves pontificating and complaining from behind the wheel of their cars about cyclists not using the "perfect" cycle paths provided. Get yourself on a bike and go cycle them yourself for a couple of weeks and come back to report on how "perfect" they are!

AndrewJRenko

Duckjob wrote: »

Its one of the things that really grinds my gears when the whole cyclist/motorist debate/mud slinging starts - motorists who never cycle themselves pontificating and complaining from behind the wheel of their cars about cyclists not using the "perfect" cycle paths provided. Get yourself on a bike and go cycle them yourself for a couple of weeks and come back to report on how "perfect" they are!

If you really want your gears grinded, have a think about all the motorists complaining from behind the wheels of their cars with four empty seats about the space being taken up by cyclists.

Thinkingaboutit

Macy0161 wrote: »

The bus connects proposals seem ok for the N11 imo.

Actually, yes, I was more thinking of other places where the bus connect proposals are ill judged. What's for the N11 seems good enough.

Muller_1

https://www.dlrcoco.ie/en/news/public-notices/work-commence-new-signalised-junction-n11

No planning for cyclists while working on the new junction in Cabinteely

"Restrictions to cycle lanes will require 'Cyclist dismount' notices at the site."

Duckjob

Muller_1 wrote: »

https://www.dlrcoco.ie/en/news/public-notices/work-commence-new-signalised-junction-n11

No planning for cyclists while working on the new junction in Cabinteely

"Restrictions to cycle lanes will require 'Cyclist dismount' notices at the site."

If you want to be one of those weirdo's not travelling in a car, then tough t*tty, on your own head be it. We'll just continue to cater for folks that prefer to sit in lines behind each other for hours like normal people.

Pretty typical of the ludicrous car-culture we have here.

Macy0161

Muller_1 wrote: »

https://www.dlrcoco.ie/en/news/public-notices/work-commence-new-signalised-junction-n11

No planning for cyclists while working on the new junction in Cabinteely

"Restrictions to cycle lanes will require 'Cyclist dismount' notices at the site."

Haven't heard back from my case yet, but that's the spot I complained about. Zero reason that if the footpath can be maintained, the cycle path can't, imo.

Plastik

Each morning I pass I'm tempted to hop off and see if I can pull out the barrier, but inevitably I lash up on to the detour for a bit of faux-cx.