Cycling Ireland Leisure membership query

secman · 10-02-2019 04:44PM #1

I have looked at the site, but FAQ doesn't cover my query.
I am a CI member, have a current leisure licence, and am a member of a club in Dublin, is it possible to also be a member of another club in a different county, also with a leisure licence ?
Have been riding out with a club for the last 3 Sunday's down in Wexford but they have a 3 spin rule, then you have to sign up to ride with them , unfortunately they don't accommodate "associated membership"

ED E · 10-02-2019 05:41PM

Your CI licence covers you for insurance for all non competitive events and even your commute to/from work if you consider it training.

As a club are we covered to take out non-Cycling Ireland members with us?

Non-members are allowed to take part in up to 3 club spins and they will be covered for insurance provided they sign in officially before each spin. After 3 spins the non-member will need to take out membership or they will not be covered for insurance.

As above the three try rule is from CI nationally not a club rule when it comes to insurance. My understanding is if you pay their membership fee you should be golden. What club you enter on the CI portal is just a convenience for leisure riders, again as I understand it. Maybe post GDPR you'll have to OK CI to disclose your status to the Wexford club.

Eamonnator · 10-02-2019 05:54PM

From my reading of the Technical Rules, a person can only have one licence.

Rule G1/4

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 06:17PM

It was my understanding that you can't be a member of two clubs if racing competitively but it was different if leisure.

secman · 10-02-2019 06:24PM

Eamonnator wrote: »

From my reading of the Technical Rules, a person can only have one licence.

Rule G1/4

But can the one license allow me to be a leisure member of 2 clubs?

Eamonnator · 10-02-2019 06:31PM

secman wrote: »

But can the one license allow me to be a leisure member of 2 clubs?

No, your licence only allows you to be a member of one club.

Your problem is with the Wexford club.
If they allow you to cycle with them, your C.I. membership gives you the same insurance as everybody else in the group.

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 06:35PM

Strange. I know at least 3 leisure cyclists who are (openly) members of two different clubs.

OleRodrigo · 10-02-2019 06:41PM

I would have thought it doesn't matter. Once you have a CI license and its affiliated with a club, then anything you do after that doesn't really matter.

You could in theory join every other leisure club in the country, but you would still receive the entitlements from the CI license as well as any additional local club member benefits. You would have to join the extra clubs directly, outside of the CI portal.

Just speculating though..

Eamonnator · 10-02-2019 06:46PM

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Strange. I know at least 3 leisure cyclists who are (openly) members of two different clubs.

Have they two licences?

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 06:51PM

Eamonnator wrote: »

Have they two licences?

I don't know but I doubt it.

Just thinking also aren't there members of Audax Ireland who are also members of their 'local' club?

(I'm assuming Audax Ireland is a club in its own right?)

OleRodrigo · 10-02-2019 06:55PM

Yeah, lots of AI members are also local club members.

Not sure which is their 'parent' club though, or if that matters.

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 06:58PM

Strava even have a feature where you can list your 'primary' club.

I realise that's irrelevant to Ireland but it must be common in other larger populated areas.

Eamonnator · 10-02-2019 06:59PM

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I don't know but I doubt it.

Just thinking also aren't there members of Audax Ireland who are also members of their 'local' club?

(I'm assuming Audax Ireland is a club in its own right?)

As I read the OP, the problem is that the Wexford club won't accept "associated membership"

jamesd · 10-02-2019 07:05PM

Our club have 4 members that are CI members and their main club is another club, all we do is ask to see their CI license and ask them to pay our club fee directly to us.
They then can buy our club kit, join our WhatsApp, and so on.

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 07:06PM

Eamonnator wrote: »

As I read the OP, the problem is that the Wexford club won't accept "associated membership"

....but perhaps will accept full membership?

RobertFoster · 10-02-2019 07:06PM

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

It was my understanding that you can't be a member of two clubs if racing competitively but it was different if leisure.

I know of one who races MTB with one club and road with another. Since his CI licence is with with the MTB club first, he has to race under their colours even when road racing.

AFAIK, you only have one licence with Cycling Ireland but you can be in as many clubs as you wish. Perhaps contact the Wexford club secretary to see if the rule is in place from an insurance or club perspective.

Eamonnator · 10-02-2019 07:18PM

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

....but perhaps will accept full membership?

That would solve the problem, but then OP would have to transfer clubs.
Can you do that, if you have already taken out a licence with another club?

edit:
Answering my own question. Technical Rules G2, if both clubs agree, a member may transfer.

rayman1 · 10-02-2019 07:21PM

My club in Waterford have about 6 dual members who for various reasons are registered with another club through Cycling Ireland. They are also members of our club and pay the annual membership fee.
Their CI License covers insurance on club spins so their is no issue.

wirelessdude01 · 10-02-2019 07:23PM

Wishbone Ash wrote:

Strange. I know at least 3 leisure cyclists who are (openly) members of two different clubs.

I was a racing member of one club but also just a member of another club who I cycled with mid week. No issue at all. In the case with the OP it looks like the Wexford club just don't want non club members in their spins.

secman · 10-02-2019 08:13PM

jamesd wrote: »

Our club have 4 members that are CI members and their main club is another club, all we do is ask to see their CI license and ask them to pay our club fee directly to us.
They then can buy our club kit, join our WhatsApp, and so on.

That's exactly what I am looking to do, pay the club fee, buy the club gear and spin with them when I'm down, which is every Sunday at he least.

secman · 10-02-2019 08:17PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

I was a racing member of one club but also just a member of another club who I cycled with mid week. No issue at all. In the case with the OP it looks like the Wexford club just don't want non club members in their spins.

They say i have to join the club, ive no issue with that, so long as CI don't have any issues with it. They don't want someone riding with them without membership and club colours.
I will gladly sign up, use my wexford address but will the one license allow this?

secman · 10-02-2019 08:28PM

Eamonnator wrote: »

That would solve the problem, but then OP would have to transfer clubs.
Can you do that, if you have already taken out a licence with another club?

edit:
Answering my own question. Technical Rules G2, if both clubs agree, a member may transfer.

Not looking to transfer, I'm in Dublin mid week, a member of a club, have a leisure licence, I'm in Wexford at the weekends, it makes sense to ride with local club touring group , take out club membership, buy the club gear, and have the 1 leisure licence.
As well as the Audax example, are some riders members of a local club and IVCA ?

rayman1 · 10-02-2019 08:28PM

Yes, one CI Licence covers membership of more than one club.

C3PO · 10-02-2019 08:31PM

RobertFoster wrote: »

I know of one who races MTB with one club and road with another. Since his CI licence is with with the MTB club first, he has to race under their colours even when road racing.

AFAIK, you only have one licence with Cycling Ireland but you can be in as many clubs as you wish. Perhaps contact the Wexford club secretary to see if the rule is in place from an insurance or club perspective.

I know a number of guys in this position - in fact I am about to join a road club but will still remain a member of a MTB club! Can't see why there would be an issue - your CI licence is not dependant on being a member of a club!

rayman1 · 10-02-2019 08:38PM

C3PO wrote: »

I know a number of guys in this position - in fact I am about to join a road club but will still remain a member of a MTB club! Can't see why there would be an issue - your CI licence is not dependant on being a member of a club!

That's true. You can be a member of CI and be unattached (not a club member).

eeeee · 10-02-2019 09:11PM

You can only be a member of one cycling club through CI. You can only race in your club kit. You can be an associate member of as many clubs as you like.

Beasty · 10-02-2019 09:22PM

You are allowed to be a member of as many clubs as you like, subject to the rules of the clubs in question, but the leisure (or racing) licence can only be issued in connection with one club

So, for example, I know of people (and indeed posters around here) who are "CI" members of one club, and "affiliate" members of our club. We know they have racing licences that allow them to race our league, and they can join our spins if they wish. Their CI insurance is via their CI club though. Club membership and who they allow in is down to the club itself (and we also have members that do not cycle and are therefore not CI members, as well as IVCA members)

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 09:23PM

secman wrote: »

...As well as the Audax example, are some riders members of a local club and IVCA ?

IVCA is more of a governing body than a club. For example, if doing a sportive you need to be a member of CI or IVCA.

Wishbone Ash · 10-02-2019 09:26PM

RobertFoster wrote: »

I know of one who races MTB with one club and road with another...

Would that not be a bit like playing hurling with one club and football with another? Would the GAA allow that?

wirelessdude01 · 10-02-2019 09:29PM

Wishbone Ash wrote:

Would that not be a bit like playing hurling with one club and football with another? Would the GAA allow that?

Often happens in my home county(Mayo) where there are only a handful of hurling clubs. I played football with my village team but played hurling with the club in the nearest town. Was kinda strange where you could be boxing the head off a lad on a Tuesday night in a big ball game and fight for each other on a Wednesday. Happened where two lads were sent off for fighting each other in a football game and played midfield together in the hurling the following night.

Eamonnator · 10-02-2019 09:46PM

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Would that not be a bit like playing hurling with one club and football with another? Would the GAA allow that?

Yes, but he races both MTB and road in the same colours(his mtb club)

Quigs Snr · 11-02-2019 08:45AM

Surely its just their own club fee they want you to pay (and fair enough if so)? There is no reason for them to care who is on your leisure licence.

secman · 11-02-2019 09:10AM

Quigs Snr wrote: »

Surely its just their own club fee they want you to pay (and fair enough if so)? There is no reason for them to care who is on your leisure licence.

Absolutely no problem with the club fee and buying club gear, that's what I want to do, just wasn't sure if it was possible to be in 2 clubs using the one license, a leisure one.

secman · 11-02-2019 12:17PM

Just an update;

I 've completed the Wexford club membership application form, sent it off to the club secretary with a copy of my current CI leisure license, which incidentally doesn't mention any club name, and a cheque for club fee. Used my wexford address on the application form.

See how it sails

Eamonnator · 11-02-2019 12:52PM

secman wrote: »

Just an update;

I 've completed the Wexford club membership application form, sent it off to the club secretary with a copy of my current CI leisure license, which incidentally doesn't mention any club name, and a cheque for club fee. Used my wexford address on the application form.

See how it sails

You're golden

eeeee · 11-02-2019 08:36PM

secman wrote: »

Just an update;

I 've completed the Wexford club membership application form, sent it off to the club secretary with a copy of my current CI leisure license, which incidentally doesn't mention any club name, and a cheque for club fee. Used my wexford address on the application form.

See how it sails

You will still be in your regular club. What the new sec might do is think you are looking for a transfer (when they try to add you they will see your other club membership) and transfer you on the system.
Or they could just think you're looking for associate membership so it doesn't matter either way but you're still gonna be reg'd with your original club.

secman · 11-02-2019 08:54PM

nee wrote: »

You will still be in your regular club. What the new sec might do is think you are looking for a transfer (when they try to add you they will see your other club membership) and transfer you on the system.
Or they could just think you're looking for associate membership so it doesn't matter either way but you're still gonna be reg'd with your original club.

I'm not trying to be deceitful, i am trying to be a non racing member of both clubs using my CI leisure licence, so i can ride with one mid week and the other on weekends and be covered, not really that complicated !

eeeee · 11-02-2019 08:59PM

secman wrote: »

I'm not trying to be deceitful, i am trying to be a non racing member of both clubs using my CI leisure licence, so i can ride with one mid week and the other on weekends and be covered, not really that complicated !

Ah yeah, but you could just be a regular member of one and an associate of another, no need to omit details or not tell one about the other! It'll settle itself out anyway.

secman · 11-02-2019 09:08PM

nee wrote: »

Ah yeah, but you could just be a regular member of one and an associate of another, no need to omit details or not tell one about the other! It'll settle itself out anyway.

The wexford club don't do associate membership, have to be a full member, which I don't have a problem with.

ED E · 11-02-2019 09:28PM

Club sec just needs to stop being awkward.

secman · 11-02-2019 09:33PM

ED E wrote: »

Club sec just needs to stop being awkward.

I spoke to the club touring group captain this evening , whom I know well enough, and explained it to him, hopefully this will help.

secman · 12-02-2019 02:29PM

Further update, CI confirmed in writing this morning , you can only be a full member of one club but can be associate member of any amount of clubs. Unfortunately both clubs involved are only offering full membership, and wont do associate membership

Real pity as it would be ideal to ride with one midweek and the other on weekends .
aaaaaaaaaaaah

Miklos · 12-02-2019 02:57PM

It's crazy that you're willing to pay the club in question a full membership fee and they're going to throw it back in your face. Surely they should be taking every opportunity to help grow the sport and their own numbers, we're well past the peak at this stage in terms of participation.

Chips Lovell · 12-02-2019 03:11PM

secman wrote: »

Further update, CI confirmed in writing this morning , you can only be a full member of one club but can be associate member of any amount of clubs. Unfortunately both clubs involved are only offering full membership, and wont do associate membership
Real pity as it would be ideal to ride with one midweek and the other on weekends .
aaaaaaaaaaaah

I think this might be a case of misunderstood wording. I've never heard of any club offering "associate membership". You can join as many clubs as you like, as a full member, but CI will only list one club on your licence and you're only allowed race for that club. I think what CI might mean by "associate" membership is being a regular member of that club, but it not being the club on your licence, if you get what I mean.

I was secretary of my own club for several years and we had a few people whose primary registration was with other clubs. They just joined our club as regular members, like everyone else.

secman · 12-02-2019 03:51PM

Exact wording received by email this morning from CI , sports administrator :
You can only be a member of one club at a time, but you can be an associate member of as many clubs as you like. So we would recommend getting onto the club in question , NAME in this case and become an associate member. If they don't do associate membership then you can join the Wexford club and be an associate of Dublin club NAME. That is the only way to do it. The club secretaries should be able to help you.
All the best
Signed
Sports Administrator

secman · 12-02-2019 04:51PM

I had a look at the CI rules and it really is geared utterly for competition riders. It mentions membership and transfers. But it doesn't appear to really cater for non competition riders and I could not find any mention of associate membership anywhere in the document.
I have sent a query back to CI querying the associate membership.
By the way I have No problem with the rule document being predominantly geared towards racing, as by it's nature it requires a lot of rules.

secman · 12-02-2019 05:29PM

Update No. I've lost count.

Just received another email from CI after my last query
Exact wording as received:

I would say you could just ask the club you don't want to transfer to (Name) and tell them you will pay them membership to ride with them ? It seems strange they don't want to take your money. Unfortunately you can only be a member of one club with Cycling ireland .
I would just ask the (Name) club if you can ride with them if you give them the money. You are covered by your Cycling Ireland licence for anything that might happen irrespective of what club you are in, so it won't adversely affect them in the event of something going wrong.
Try and appeal to the secretary or chairperson, that's all the advice I can give you I'm afraid.

All the best
Signed
Sports Administrator

saccades · 12-02-2019 10:41PM

CI are useless, club wants full members to give them more votes (is that still a thing?)/bigger numbers.

Maybe see if the dublin club are happy to have associate members and go full with wexford crowd.

I'm in two clubs, mtb and road, one full and one associate.

Ive been in two mtb clubs before to give ci members to a struggling club who needed ci members for funding.

Who cares at that level of leisure cycling, red tape clowns.

secman · 12-02-2019 11:44PM

Update eile

Got a text from a friend in the Wexford club, who I sent a copy of the last email from CI to. He had a conversation with the Wexford club chairman tonight, and he doesn't see a problem with me joining the club based on the insurance clarification from CI, happy days. So common sense prevails, I'll be a member of both clubs, covered by CI licence wherever i ride but only listed in CI as a member of the Dublin club.
Chuffed.
2 sound groups to cycle with

Cycling Ireland Leisure membership query

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