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Umpires

  • 08-02-2019 11:28am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,990 ✭✭✭ Xenophile


    I think that umpires should stay with the same players throughout the game so as to keep an eye on offending players.


    Umpires flags should be fixed in the same position, i.e. green to left of goalkeeper all times all games all venues.


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 43 ✭✭✭ centralchill


    Why?
    Senior intercounty football, or all games?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,990 ✭✭✭ Xenophile


    Why?
    Senior intercounty football, or all games?


    All games.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 547 Duffryman


    What difference does it make what side of the goal the green flag and white flag are at? So long as the correct one is raised after each score?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,968 ✭✭✭ KevRossi


    Xenophile wrote: »
    I think that umpires should stay with the same players throughout the game so as to keep an eye on offending players.


    Umpires flags should be fixed in the same position, i.e. green to left of goalkeeper all times all games all venues.

    Umpires should stay at the same end to reduce allegations of bias on scores and decisions.

    They can mention it to their colleagues at half time if a player is consistently offending.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,877 ✭✭✭ flasher0030


    KevRossi wrote: »
    Umpires should stay at the same end to reduce allegations of bias on scores and decisions.

    They can mention it to their colleagues at half time if a player is consistently offending.

    Does it make much difference. They just stand there with their hands behind their backs looking at the likes of Johnny Cooper trying to tear the jersey of his opponents back, but they are too gutless to intervene and bring it to refs attention. I don't understand why they are not encouraged to play a more active role in implementing the rules of the game. It could be a proper use of 4 extra bodies.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,930 jr86


    Duffryman wrote: »
    What difference does it make what side of the goal the green flag and white flag are at? So long as the correct one is raised after each score?

    Very confused by this one also!


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,596 ✭✭✭✭ PTH2009


    Only in GAA are one of the most important roles on the pitch are taking up by fellas the ref knows (sometimes family members)

    They get a bit of grub out of it I suppose

    Prob not possible to have trainee refs as umpires for championship games


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 547 Duffryman


    Have to say I’ve always found it odd myself that that’s the way it works, all the way up to All-Ireland Finals.

    Often wondered if after a certain stage at inter-county (maybe for provincial finals and All-Ireland quarter finals onwards), should the umpires be appointed in the same way as referee and linesmen, instead of just being invited along by the ref?

    They could be retired inter-county referees themselves – lots of experience of the big day, unlikely to be fazed by the crowd or player pressure, and well used to needing eyes in the back of their head.

    I know the argument against the idea might be that a referee should be able to bring the same umpires as always, because they’ve an important job to do, it’s crucial they work well together, etc.

    But it’s equally important for a referee to work well with the linesmen, yet the ref doesn’t get to pick them too. I don’t know why umpires should be different.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭ The Lost Sheep


    Xenophile wrote: »
    I think that umpires should stay with the same players throughout the game so as to keep an eye on offending players.

    Umpires flags should be fixed in the same position, i.e. green to left of goalkeeper all times all games all venues.
    I dont think it should matter too much about flags being same side of goals each game in each venue.
    And i wouldnt have umpires changing ends. If you have umpires and another set of eyes looking at something you can with the correct procedures for penalising players see more than if you dont change ends at half time.
    Duffryman wrote: »
    What difference does it make what side of the goal the green flag and white flag are at? So long as the correct one is raised after each score?
    exactly.
    Does it make much difference. They just stand there with their hands behind their backs looking at the likes of Johnny Cooper trying to tear the jersey of his opponents back, but they are too gutless to intervene and bring it to refs attention. I don't understand why they are not encouraged to play a more active role in implementing the rules of the game. It could be a proper use of 4 extra bodies.
    It should make a difference if they took a better role. I wouldnt say they are gutless more there isnt better procedures in place and acceptance of their decisions for them to make stronger calls
    PTH2009 wrote: »
    Only in GAA are one of the most important roles on the pitch are taking up by fellas the ref knows (sometimes family members)

    They get a bit of grub out of it I suppose

    Prob not possible to have trainee refs as umpires for championship games
    Why wouldnt it be possible? And you could have qualified refs in place as well.
    Duffryman wrote: »
    Have to say I’ve always found it odd myself that that’s the way it works, all the way up to All-Ireland Finals.

    Often wondered if after a certain stage at inter-county (maybe for provincial finals and All-Ireland quarter finals onwards), should the umpires be appointed in the same way as referee and linesmen, instead of just being invited along by the ref?

    They could be retired inter-county referees themselves – lots of experience of the big day, unlikely to be fazed by the crowd or player pressure, and well used to needing eyes in the back of their head.

    I know the argument against the idea might be that a referee should be able to bring the same umpires as always, because they’ve an important job to do, it’s crucial they work well together, etc.

    But it’s equally important for a referee to work well with the linesmen, yet the ref doesn’t get to pick them too. I don’t know why umpires should be different.
    Why retired refs? Why not current refs?


  • Registered Users Posts: 667 ✭✭✭ DiscoStew


    I don't understand why they are not encouraged to play a more active role in implementing the rules of the game. It could be a proper use of 4 extra bodies.

    Probably because the umpires aren’t required to know the rules in the same detail as the refs.
    I do agree that they should be given specifics to look out for and actively calling the ref to highlight fouls on and off the ball. The amount they let away off the ball is amazing.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 547 Duffryman



    Why retired refs? Why not current refs?


    No reason at all why it couldn't be current refs. I just suggested retired refs because I thought that might give a bit more of a panel to work from.


    It's already the case that linesmen on the big occasion are current inter-county referees. So that means there's three on duty each day. Extending that to seven might be too much of a stretch on any day other than the All-Ireland finals themselves, when there's likely to be club matches going on in those referees' home counties, where they'd be needed themselves.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,990 ✭✭✭ Xenophile


    Duffryman wrote: »
    What difference does it make what side of the goal the green flag and white flag are at?

    Organisation, structure and discipline, it would be a little more professional.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭ The Lost Sheep


    DiscoStew wrote: »
    Probably because the umpires aren’t required to know the rules in the same detail as the refs.
    I do agree that they should be given specifics to look out for and actively calling the ref to highlight fouls on and off the ball. The amount they let away off the ball is amazing.
    They should at the higher levels at least. They should have powers to make calls, be able to contact refs more about infringements
    Duffryman wrote: »
    No reason at all why it couldn't be current refs. I just suggested retired refs because I thought that might give a bit more of a panel to work from.

    It's already the case that linesmen on the big occasion are current inter-county referees. So that means there's three on duty each day. Extending that to seven might be too much of a stretch on any day other than the All-Ireland finals themselves, when there's likely to be club matches going on in those referees' home counties, where they'd be needed themselves.
    I just think you are far better off with current refs as keeps current refs seeing things from different perspective. Like you will never see retired refs involved as secondary officials in other sports.
    Xenophile wrote: »
    Organisation, structure and discipline, it would be a little more professional.
    Its far from top of priorities for me. Its just looks and appearances


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,724 ✭✭✭ nice_guy80


    They are volunteers


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭ The Lost Sheep


    nice_guy80 wrote: »
    They are volunteers
    and?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,724 ✭✭✭ nice_guy80


    If they weren't giving their time we wouldn't have umpires
    It's not the premier league. Not everyone is paid to do their role


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    nice_guy80 wrote: »
    If they weren't giving their time we wouldn't have umpires
    It's not the premier league. Not everyone is paid to do their role


    They should have some training, however. Presumably they do have experience although I don't have any idea to be honest. Do the same refs use the same chaps all the time?


    Hawkeye has exposed fact that calls are often wrong. But outside of CP and Thurles that is not there. Lots of games have glaring errors, even big ones. Off top of my head I can think of a miss call on a point in a minor hurling final that directly affected the outcome. More recently an obvious point in the Dublin/Galway Walsh Cup game was waved wide. Sometimes refs seem reluctant to over-rule the umpire.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,351 ✭✭✭ threeball


    They spend too much time watching the game. They should be assigned roles with one watching the ball and the other watching everything happening off the ball inside the 45. Then swap the roles at half time to keep them fresh. The guy watching the ball would alert the second umpire that the ball was coming in and a score was possible.


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