New House build - TV/Sat distribution

dots104

This may or may not be the correct location for this (mod please move if not). I've a query in relation to distribution of tv around a house.

Im in the middle of the long slog of building a new house and looking for some ideas/advice on how best to fit out the house for tv distribution. I think ok with network(internet) distribution as i intend to wire back most rooms to to a central location and where a switch and panel will be located.

With Tv distribution i dont know what is best practice. What id like is the following but not sure how to go about

Main living area - probably $ky
All other rooms kitchen/bedrooms/ snug etc freesat or saorview


Would i require two satellites to have sky and freesat?
Do i centralise tv also or separate it out?
Sky connected directly to living room, freesat connected to splitter in attic and then to other rooms?
Sky Q is different again and doesn't require a separate connection for muiti room?

Any help would be much appreciated to the questions above or advice on anything else i should consider

tsue921i8wljb3

One option is two coaxial cables or one twin cable to each point where you want a TV. All these would be brought back to a central location where you would have a multiswitch. The multiswitch would take four cables from a quattro (perhaps quad) LNB and one cable from an aerial for Saorview. You would likely need to purchase and organise the dish installation yourself. Sky Q would need another piece of equipment connected to the multiswitch to function in this scenario.

If you want to get Sky to install a dish you can ask for a Hybrid LNB which gives Sky Q and 4 legacy outputs (Freesat) from the same LNB. You could run the Sky Q cabling direct to the dish and the Freesat cabling could go direct to the dish or to a suitable multiswitch for distribution.

The multiswitch reduces the amount of cabling needed to each point. You could get away with one cable to each point if you don't need recording on satellite. It also reduces the amount of cables that need to go to the dish (4). It does require special faceplates to separate the satellite and terrestrial signal though.

There are other options involving Ethernet distribution however I've never used them so can't comment on their ease of use.

Johnboy1951

Another option is to distribute the TV signals as IPTV via ethernet cable and even WIFI so that all devices, not only TVs (phones, laptops, tablets etc) can receive the channels.
This would not be suitable for Sky systems, which have their own proprietary distribution for multiroom or whatever they call it now.

The whole Saorview & FTA Satellite channels can be distributed from one central location ..... bring in the coax cables from aerial and sat dish to the media press where the tuners would be located and channels distributed everywhere from there on the network.

Arrange for a duct from outside in to the media press so that coax is easily replaced or augmented, or you might wish to add outside cameras or other devices later.
With a distribution system in place just about all input devices can be accommodated.

The Cush

dots104 wrote: »

Main living area - probably $ky
All other rooms kitchen/bedrooms/ snug etc freesat or saorview


Would i require two satellites to have sky and freesat?
Do i centralise tv also or separate it out?
Sky connected directly to living room, freesat connected to splitter in attic and then to other rooms?
Sky Q is different again and doesn't require a separate connection for muiti room?

Any help would be much appreciated to the questions above or advice on anything else i should consider

Future proofing I would run a minimum of 2 co-ax cables to each TV point and a third to the main TV point where a SkyQ receiver may be located at some point, the new generation Sky box requires 2 separate cables from the dish in a standard domestic setup and Saorview must be carried separately.

navi mentioned a multiswitch, a SkyQ compatible dSCR multiswitch would be recommended, they are compatible with all Sky boxes, Freesat, FTA and Saorview and can feed all TV points from a central location, power point required nearby. A single dish with 4 cables from the LNB and a separate feed from an aerial for Saorview outside.

Suggested wall plate for 2 feeds to a point with 2 satellite feeds combined with Saorview from a multiswitch - http://vision-products.co.uk/product/v33-23plus/

tsue921i8wljb3

The Cush wrote: »

Future proofing I would run a minimum of 2 co-ax cables to each TV point and a third to the main TV point where a SkyQ receiver may be located at some point, the new generation Sky box requires 2 separate cables from the dish in a standard domestic setup and Saorview must be carried separately.

navi mentioned a multiswitch, a SkyQ compatible dSCR multiswitch would be recommended, they are compatible with all Sky boxes, Freesat, FTA and Saorview and can feed all TV points from a central location, power point required nearby. A single dish with 4 cables from the LNB and a separate feed from an aerial for Saorview outside.

Suggested wall plate for 2 feeds to a point with 2 satellite feeds combined with Saorview from a multiswitch - http://vision-products.co.uk/product/v33-23plus/

I was thinking more of a traditional multiswitch combined with something like the TMDS 42C from a cost point of view. You could probably get both for less than €200 where a TdSCR 512 would cost over €500.

The Cush

Leland Better Pediatrics wrote: »

I was thinking more of a traditional multiswitch combined with something like the TMDS 42C from a cost point of view. You could probably get both for less than €200 where a TdSCR 512 would cost over €500.

That would be for a 12 output switch, 4 output dSCR switches start at less than €200.

tsue921i8wljb3

The Cush wrote: »

That would be for a 12 output switch, 4 output dSCR switches start at less than €200.

I am assuming that the OP would need more than four outputs but it is up to themselves to decide on what they may or may not need. Plenty of options anyway.

dots104

Thanks guys for all the responses. Learning alot. Ye probably would need more than four tv in the future (seems like a lot) but you never know.

By the sounds of it i go Hybrid LNB. Sky connection will go direct to main room and then other two will go to a centralised multi switch. From ever other tv point wire 2no co-ax cables back to a central multiswitch.

If above is wrong please set me straight. Also more hints and tips welcome.

tsue921i8wljb3

dots104 wrote: »

Thanks guys for all the responses. Learning alot. Ye probably would need more than four tv in the future (seems like a lot) but you never know.

By the sounds of it i go Hybrid LNB. Sky connection will go direct to main room and then other two will go to a centralised multi switch. From ever other tv point wire 2no co-ax cables back to a central multiswitch.

If above is wrong please set me straight. Also more hints and tips welcome.

If you're going the hybrid LNB route there is no point getting a dSCR multiswitch. Therefore you'll need four cables from the dish to the multiswitch (which must be quad LNB compatible) plus two cables for Sky Q from the dish to main Q box location.

The only issue with this is that a lot of installers would recommend an 80cm dish for multiswitch installations. The Sky dish is a good bit smaller I think so you could run into signal problems.

The Cush

Also if you go this route and require Saorview at the main TV point a third co-ax cable will be required.

basill

Or save yourself all the hassle and centralise all of your AV gear in a closet/room somewhere and run to each TV point HDMI over cat 6. In basic terms all your sat and soarview feeds run into the room and connect into their respective sat boxes. Then you connect the sat boxes via their HDMI cable into an AV receiver along with apple tvs, fire tvs, dvd players etc. From the receiver HDMI output you connect the sender unit with two cat 6 cables that go up through the walls and end up connecting into a receiver unit that can slot in behind your tv in whichever room you want. This is how you get over the cable run limitations and keep cost down versus using long HDMI cables which cost a bomb. You will end up with just a tv up on a wall in your room and you can control it via a wireless all in one remote. Its a very clean installation and what you see in most modern homes these days. If you want surround sound then wire that all back to the receiver as well. The only limit on the amount of devices which you will be able to watch on your tv will be dictated by the number of HDMI connections on your receiver. Personally I would run another cat 6 cable to the tv from your home network and connect this into the ethernet port on your TV to ensure the highest quality internet connection and avoid wireless which is susceptible to interference.

Johnboy1951

basill wrote: »

Or save yourself all the hassle and centralise all of your AV gear in a closet/room somewhere and run to each TV point HDMI over cat 6. In basic terms all your sat and soarview feeds run into the room and connect into their respective sat boxes. Then you connect the sat boxes via their HDMI cable into an AV receiver along with apple tvs, fire tvs, dvd players etc. From the receiver HDMI output you connect the sender unit with two cat 6 cables that go up through the walls and end up connecting into a receiver unit that can slot in behind your tv in whichever room you want. This is how you get over the cable run limitations and keep cost down versus using long HDMI cables which cost a bomb. You will end up with just a tv up on a wall in your room and you can control it via a wireless all in one remote. Its a very clean installation and what you see in most modern homes these days. If you want surround sound then wire that all back to the receiver as well. The only limit on the amount of devices which you will be able to watch on your tv will be dictated by the number of HDMI connections on your receiver. Personally I would run another cat 6 cable to the tv from your home network and connect this into the ethernet port on your TV to ensure the highest quality internet connection and avoid wireless which is susceptible to interference.

I absolutely agree with the centralisation of receivers/tuners etc and the distribution of the TV signals throughout the house.

Whether to use HDMI over Cat6 or IP over the LAN is a matter of personal preference I guess.
I much prefer having the data available to all devices in the house, even if that means requiring a small device at each TV to receive the data and display it on the TV. Although I expect some smart TVs should be capable of receiving and displaying the data.
Mobile devices can receive the info over wireless connection to the LAN.

To each his own.

tsue921i8wljb3

basill wrote: »

Or save yourself all the hassle and centralise all of your AV gear in a closet/room somewhere and run to each TV point HDMI over cat 6. In basic terms all your sat and soarview feeds run into the room and connect into their respective sat boxes. Then you connect the sat boxes via their HDMI cable into an AV receiver along with apple tvs, fire tvs, dvd players etc. From the receiver HDMI output you connect the sender unit with two cat 6 cables that go up through the walls and end up connecting into a receiver unit that can slot in behind your tv in whichever room you want. This is how you get over the cable run limitations and keep cost down versus using long HDMI cables which cost a bomb. You will end up with just a tv up on a wall in your room and you can control it via a wireless all in one remote. Its a very clean installation and what you see in most modern homes these days. If you want surround sound then wire that all back to the receiver as well. The only limit on the amount of devices which you will be able to watch on your tv will be dictated by the number of HDMI connections on your receiver. Personally I would run another cat 6 cable to the tv from your home network and connect this into the ethernet port on your TV to ensure the highest quality internet connection and avoid wireless which is susceptible to interference.

Could you link to such a device(s) that would enable this please? I don't think you're referring to HDBaseT which I looked into for a build I did. It was extremely expensive.

basill

Type HDMI over cat 6 or 5 into ebay/Amazon (some refer to them as baluns others call them extenders). Check the reviews and remember you pay for what you get. Powered ones are the way to go. I have an expensive set made by Gefen in the lounge but the kids play room is an el cheapo no name generic and I have had no issues with either. Some people tend to forget that their tv is just one big monitor/display unit. Your AV receiver will do all the heavy lifting and a decent logitech remote will mean you can dump all the remotes in a box.

The following is 4K and has IR which would be handy as many sat boxes don't have wireless control. Any decent AV receiver has wireless and bluetooth so won't have any issues being remotely controlled by a late model all in one remote such as a logitech harmony elite.

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/NEW-Technomate-TM-55-4K-UHD-PoE-With-IR-HDMI-2-0-Over-Single-CAT-5-Extender-70m/372510174302?hash=item56bb562c5e:g:5LkAAOSwcapb9pYV:rk:1:pf:0

dots104

basill wrote: »

Or save yourself all the hassle and centralise all of your AV gear in a closet/room somewhere and run to each TV point HDMI over cat 6. In basic terms all your sat and soarview feeds run into the room and connect into their respective sat boxes. Then you connect the sat boxes via their HDMI cable into an AV receiver along with apple tvs, fire tvs, dvd players etc. From the receiver HDMI output you connect the sender unit with two cat 6 cables that go up through the walls and end up connecting into a receiver unit that can slot in behind your tv in whichever room you want. This is how you get over the cable run limitations and keep cost down versus using long HDMI cables which cost a bomb. You will end up with just a tv up on a wall in your room and you can control it via a wireless all in one remote. Its a very clean installation and what you see in most modern homes these days. If you want surround sound then wire that all back to the receiver as well. The only limit on the amount of devices which you will be able to watch on your tv will be dictated by the number of HDMI connections on your receiver. Personally I would run another cat 6 cable to the tv from your home network and connect this into the ethernet port on your TV to ensure the highest quality internet connection and avoid wireless which is susceptible to interference.

Thats sounds like a good option alright. I've attached a very rough schematic of how i interpreted above. Please forgive if i've got it completed wrong. New to satellite (only ever had simple cable). Can a couple of tv's watch a different channel in this setup (assume it can but cant see how).

tsue921i8wljb3

dots104 wrote: »

Thats sounds like a good option alright. I've attached a very rough schematic of how i interpreted above. Please forgive if i've got it completed wrong. New to satellite (only ever had simple cable). Can a couple of tv's watch a different channel in this setup (assume it can but cant see how).

And what happens if two different rooms want to watch say two separate channels on Sky or Freesat simultaneously? You're limited to one channel from each source. It's up to yourself but I don't think it's a particularly great solution for your case.

dots104

Leland Better Pediatrics wrote: »

And what happens if two different rooms want to watch say two separate channels on Sky or Freesat simultaneously? You're limited to one channel from each source. It's up to yourself but I don't think it's a particularly great solution for your case.

Ye thats what i was thinking. Seems like it just mirroring the picture to another display. Dont think thats a runner as you mentioned. Thats why i drew up a diagram to see how it would work.

Eric Cartman

dots104 wrote: »

Thats sounds like a good option alright. I've attached a very rough schematic of how i interpreted above. Please forgive if i've got it completed wrong. New to satellite (only ever had simple cable). Can a couple of tv's watch a different channel in this setup (assume it can but cant see how).

http://www.satworld.ie/4-x-4-hdbaset-4k.html this box completes that setup (you can drop the receiver)

4 inputs and each tv can pick any of the 4 inputs , added to that it has IR control to change the channel on the sky box etc from each room.

if your house is coax wired you can achieve similar results with this : http://www.labgear.co.uk/product-categories/other-products/modulators/new-hdmi-to-dvb-t-encoder-modulator/ plus it allows every tv to have saorview and can be combined with a distribution amp that sends a satellite signal down the cable for independent freesat boxes too.

tsue921i8wljb3

Eric Cartman wrote: »

http://www.satworld.ie/4-x-4-hdbaset-4k.html this box completes that setup (you can drop the receiver)

4 inputs and each tv can pick any of the 4 inputs , added to that it has IR control to change the channel on the sky box etc from each room.

if your house is coax wired you can achieve similar results with this : http://www.labgear.co.uk/product-categories/other-products/modulators/new-hdmi-to-dvb-t-encoder-modulator/ plus it allows every tv to have saorview and can be combined with a distribution amp that sends a satellite signal down the cable for independent freesat boxes too.

It's still mirroring one source to four screens. It's suitable for a pub where four or more screens may be showing the same programme.

Eric Cartman

Leland Better Pediatrics wrote: »

It's still mirroring one source to four screens. It's suitable for a pub where four or more screens may be showing the same programme.

https://www.triax.com/media/com_redshopb/documents/originals/products/207801-207900/en-tdx-be-tdh800-combined-2018-207813.pdf

suppose it depends how much choice you really want , 16 tuners/inputs that one has,

I think most residential homes would get away with one primary sky box and one sky 'multiroom' box without there being a problem with a 4x4 multiplexer or dvb encoder. could go mad and have a stack of 10 sky boxes like some installs.

tsue921i8wljb3

Eric Cartman wrote: »

https://www.triax.com/media/com_redshopb/documents/originals/products/207801-207900/en-tdx-be-tdh800-combined-2018-207813.pdf

suppose it depends how much choice you really want , 16 tuners/inputs that one has,

I think most residential homes would get away with one primary sky box and one sky 'multiroom' box without there being a problem with a 4x4 multiplexer or dvb encoder. could go mad and have a stack of 10 sky boxes like some installs.

He'd probably need a new mortgage to get that up and running! Even €800 is too much for an inferior, IMO, solution in comparison to the multiswitch option.

basill

basill wrote: »

Or save yourself all the hassle and centralise all of your AV gear in a closet/room somewhere and run to each TV point HDMI over cat 6. In basic terms all your sat and soarview feeds run into the room and connect into their respective sat boxes. Then you connect the sat boxes via their HDMI cable into an AV receiver along with apple tvs, fire tvs, dvd players etc. From the receiver HDMI output you connect the sender unit with two cat 6 cables that go up through the walls and end up connecting into a receiver unit that can slot in behind your tv in whichever room you want. This is how you get over the cable run limitations and keep cost down versus using long HDMI cables which cost a bomb. You will end up with just a tv up on a wall in your room and you can control it via a wireless all in one remote. Its a very clean installation and what you see in most modern homes these days. If you want surround sound then wire that all back to the receiver as well. The only limit on the amount of devices which you will be able to watch on your tv will be dictated by the number of HDMI connections on your receiver. Personally I would run another cat 6 cable to the tv from your home network and connect this into the ethernet port on your TV to ensure the highest quality internet connection and avoid wireless which is susceptible to interference.

I fully agree with this, I’ll be building myself in the next year and plan to have a dedicated “server room” where everything internet, tv and home entertainment terminates. From what I’ve read though you are better using ip over LAN than hdmi over LAN as you can run much longer distances and don’t need point to point (for some systems anyway) either.

I’d plan a set up something like this: I would intend to have a dedicated sat receiver from every room in a rack and all distributed to each tv by LAN (whether one or more of these would be a sky box with a sub will depend on if full iptv “subs” have been cracked down on or not), a dedicated raspberry pi or similar for each room in the rack and distributed by lan to a tv each (these can all feed of a shared HDD for tv shows and movies), one Blu-ray player is probably enough shared amoung all as they are nearly obselete now a days, possibly chromecasts and apple tv or two all set up in the rack and distributed by lan also. All sat cables would be terminating in this room also but I’d either still install sat cable to all the rooms (and leave it hidden) or make it easy to do so.

My intention would be to have nothing but a tv hanging in every room with a small ip over lan receiver connected and nothing else. The only thing I need to figure is the surround sound for main living room and my sport watching/games room/bar (all one room). I’m not sure if the av units can be centrally located though as both these room shouldn’t be too far from the “server room” it may be possible.

Eric Cartman

Leland Better Pediatrics wrote: »

He'd probably need a new mortgage to get that up and running! Even €800 is too much for an inferior, IMO, solution in comparison to the multiswitch option.

multiswitch with freesat boxes and saorview is a great option for variety, could top it up with one or two sky boxes in the attic and a single or double channel dvb encoder, youd be well under 800 sheets for it and it gives a hd sky feed plus all the choice to the other tv's.

Johnboy1951

dots104 wrote: »

Thats sounds like a good option alright. I've attached a very rough schematic of how i interpreted above. Please forgive if i've got it completed wrong. New to satellite (only ever had simple cable). Can a couple of tv's watch a different channel in this setup (assume it can but cant see how).

This is what my set up looks like for comparison.
I use distribution over Cat5e/Cat6 ethernet cable.
I do not have any 'smart' TVs so a small cheap client box is used at each TV.
Laptops, phones, tablets etc can also receive all the media, via wireless connection to router.

All the devices except client devices are centralised, and expanding with extra tuners or other network connected devices is simple.




NOTE:

What I forgot to include in this pic is that I have the output of the Sky box going to a HDMI>DVB-T Edision device which is fed to the HDHomerun tuner box and becomes just another channel on the TV.
Changing the actual channel the Sky box is tuned to is done in the usual way, or can also be done by a software control over the LAN.


This pic shows that connection. Someday I must alamgamate the two pics

Eric Cartman

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

This is what my set up looks like for comparison.
I use distribution over Cat5e/Cat6 ethernet cable.
I do not have any 'smart' TVs so a small cheap client box is used at each TV.
Laptops, phones, tablets etc can also receive all the media, via wireless connection to router.

All the devices except client devices are centralised, and expanding with extra tuners or other network connected devices is simple.

what model receivers and tuners are you using ?

Johnboy1951

HDHomerun for DVB-T tuners
Digibit R1 for DVB-S tuners
Edision HDMI>DVB-T for Sky

Software is is LibreElec and CoreElec.
Tvheadend manages the backend ... access to Live TV/Radio, recording management and access to stored media.
It also manages 7 day EPG and other such things.

Kodi is the user GUI used.

basill

To the OP.....I only have two zones. Each zone has its own sat box fed from an octo LNB off the original sky dish. Soarview dish is a separate feed which I have split to each of the sat boxes. They are Tiviars so have three feeds (two sky dish for watch now and record and the soarview). I don't bother with any HDMI switching as its cheaper for my setup to just buy dedicated devices for each zone. On the fire tvs I have sideloaded kodi and use that to access my NAS.

Johnboy1951

basill wrote: »

To the OP.....I only have two zones. Each zone has its own sat box fed from an octo LNB off the original sky dish. Soarview dish is a separate feed which I have split to each of the sat boxes. They are Tiviars so have three feeds (two sky dish for watch now and record and the soarview). I don't bother with any HDMI switching as its cheaper for my setup to just buy dedicated devices for each zone. On the fire tvs I have sideloaded kodi and use that to access my NAS.

I believe the Tiviar is quite capable of making its tuners available on the LAN also if you ever wish to view content elsewhere ..... I don't have this STB so my understanding would need to be checked.

Darando

Slight diversion - whats the best way to bring multiple coax cables (from LNB and Aeriel) into a house? (not run through interior walls/attic). Media location is downstairs and wasn't wired for coax/cables to the roof...it just has coax/5e back from each room to the hub.

dots104

basill wrote: »

To the OP.....I only have two zones. Each zone has its own sat box fed from an octo LNB off the original sky dish. Soarview dish is a separate feed which I have split to each of the sat boxes. They are Tiviars so have three feeds (two sky dish for watch now and record and the soarview). I don't bother with any HDMI switching as its cheaper for my setup to just buy dedicated devices for each zone. On the fire tvs I have sideloaded kodi and use that to access my NAS.

What do you mean by two zones (only 2 tv's). Does an octo LNB allow for combination of 8 standard freesat connections , 4 Sky+ boxes, two sky+ boxes and 4 freesat connects etc.

Think i read somewhere that sky Q messes up the above configuration and that the signal from freesat and sky q cant be combined from a single LNB?. Could be and more than likely wrong on that one.

The Cush

dots104 wrote: »

Think i read somewhere that sky Q messes up the above configuration and that the signal from freesat and sky q cant be combined from a single LNB?. Could be and more than likely wrong on that one.

SkyQ uses new technology, either 2 wideband feeds from a wideband LNB or a single cable from a dSCR multiswitch.

A dSCR multiswitch can be used with Freesat as any output will be dSCR for SkyQ or legacy for any other satellite receiver, auto selectable.

In a standard SkyQ install a 2 output wideband LNB is fitted to the dish and can only be used with a SkyQ box. They can also fit a hybrid LNB if requested to provided 2 wideband outputs and 4 legacy outputs for legacy receiver or multiswitch connections.

m8

Can you give an example of an AV Receiver that would work like this please?

At the TV end how would say get SAT on one TV and maybe RTE on the other?

Nelbert

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

HDHomerun for DVB-T tuners
Digibit R1 for DVB-S tuners
Edision HDMI>DVB-T for Sky

Software is is LibreElec and CoreElec.
Tvheadend manages the backend ... access to Live TV/Radio, recording management and access to stored media.
It also manages 7 day EPG and other such things.

Kodi is the user GUI used.

How do you find the HDhomerun? Have similar setup with triax quad sat-ip and a technomate dvb-t mod. Tvheadend combines it all and kodi displays it. It works really well.
Been thinking of switching the two dvb-t tuners for a HDhomerun Quattro for both soarview muxes and the sky box simultaneously.

The fire tv stick is a great device for the front end, amazon video, Netflix and kodi.
One cat5/6 to each tv point and it’s all sorted.

Johnboy1951

Nelbert wrote: »

How do you find the HDhomerun? Have similar setup with triax quad sat-ip and a technomate dvb-t mod. Tvheadend combines it all and kodi displays it. It works really well.
Been thinking of switching the two dvb-t tuners for a HDhomerun Quattro for both soarview muxes and the sky box simultaneously.

The fire tv stick is a great device for the front end, amazon video, Netflix and kodi.
One cat5/6 to each tv point and it’s all sorted.

Yes just about duplicate setups.
What might be different is the devices I use for tvheadend server and clients at TV.
I am using ~€40 AMLogic devices (come with Android) for both, and have been pleasantly surprised at how well they do both jobs.

I have the quattro HDHomerun device and I find it a solid stable device with no problems.

One thing I would mention (just in case) is that unless you require three or four distinct tuner locks at one time then what you have is apparently good enough, as the mux for the Skybox can be added to the DVB-T Network muxes (Mux tab - Add mux) without the need for a separate Network for it.

There is also a Dual HDHomerun device if that is sufficient for your needs.
You can always add another if you wish. They will live happily together on the same system as they can be given different IP addresses.

Nelbert

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Yes just about duplicate setups.
What might be different is the devices I use for tvheadend server and clients at TV.
I am using ~€40 AMLogic devices (come with Android) for both, and have been pleasantly surprised at how well they do both jobs.

I have the quattro HDHomerun device and I find it a solid stable device with no problems.

One thing I would mention (just in case) is that unless you require three or four distinct tuner locks at one time then what you have is apparently good enough, as the mux for the Skybox can be added to the DVB-T Network muxes (Mux tab - Add mux) without the need for a separate Network for it.

There is also a Dual HDHomerun device if that is sufficient for your needs.
You can always add another if you wish. They will live happily together on the same system as they can be given different IP addresses.

Yeah I have that at the moment. I just like the idea of no possible tuner conflicts for the sky box mux and 2 soarview muxes. The Quattro goes on special for £100 regularly so it’s simply a matter of lining up special pricing and impulse spend money being available.

It’s all run off my Synology NAS with my tv and movie library shared from there too. As such a single network cable fulfills all my needs.

For the OP: if you wanted to consider this I think a raspberry pi or anything that will run LibreELEC (and ultimately tvheadend) would be sufficient.
My personal preference has always been to avoid relying on the display for “smart” functions as it’s the most expensive item to replace and you’re at the manufacturer’s discretion for support and updates.... hence fire tv sticks (even better aesthetically now that the remote includes power and volume control for your tv).
I also prefer the flexibility of a data point rather than a HDMI extender although I understand why that’s a preference for some people.

Johnboy1951

Nelbert wrote: »

Yeah I have that at the moment. I just like the idea of no possible tuner conflicts for the sky box mux and 2 soarview muxes. The Quattro goes on special for £100 regularly so it’s simply a matter of lining up special pricing and impulse spend money being available.

It’s all run off my Synology NAS with my tv and movie library shared from there too. As such a single network cable fulfills all my needs.

For the OP: if you wanted to consider this I think a raspberry pi or anything that will run LibreELEC (and ultimately tvheadend) would be sufficient.
My personal preference has always been to avoid relying on the display for “smart” functions as it’s the most expensive item to replace and you’re at the manufacturer’s discretion for support and updates.... hence fire tv sticks (even better aesthetically now that the remote includes power and volume control for your tv).
I also prefer the flexibility of a data point rather than a HDMI extender although I understand why that’s a preference for some people.

I put the tuners, server, switch etc etc in a 'media' press in the middle of the house along with the router of the fibre connection, so all rooms which are Cat5e cabled can get TV and internet and most can also get those via wireless, although I have no great faith in wireless for TV use.
(I must get around to tidying up that press and make things permanent. )
I control the Skybox over the same LAN using a small script, so all devices that can run the script can control the Skybox output and settings.
I would of course much prefer to have all six of the eirSports channels available concurrently

m8

Nelbert wrote: »

It’s all run off my Synology NAS with my tv and movie library shared from there too. As such a single network cable fulfills all my needs.

Can you give more details of what you run from your Synology NAS please as I would like to setup something like this.

At the Moment I have a few PI's and a Synology NAS that I use as storage.

Nelbert

m8 wrote: »

Can you give more details of what you run from your Synology NAS please as I would like to setup something like this.

At the Moment I have a few PI's and a Synology NAS that I use as storage.

Tvheadend for serving out the TV. Two usb DVB-T tuners and a quad Sat-IP tuner.
Essentially my Synology is centralised file, music, tv and music server. Lots of community add ons available too. I use it as a docker hub too for some college stuff.

m8

Nelbert wrote: »

Tvheadend for serving out the TV. Two usb DVB-T tuners and a quad Sat-IP tuner.
Essentially my Synology is centralised file, music, tv and music server. Lots of community add ons available too. I use it as a docker hub too for some college stuff.

Which Synology models does TVHeadend run on?

Can't seem to locate it in Package Manager after adding the community repository.

Nelbert

m8 wrote: »

Which Synology models does TVHeadend run on?

Can't seem to locate it in Package Manager after adding the community repository.

I have the 1813+..... id have thought it runs on pretty much any of them though.

m8

Nelbert wrote: »

I have the 1813+..... id have thought it runs on pretty much any of them though.

Great I found it on a DS411, how do I get it to see my USB DVB-T device?

Plugged in the USB DVB-T device and rebooted the Synology but it does not see it, maybe it's not compatible with Synology?

Nelbert

m8 wrote: »

Great I found it on a DS411, how do I get it to see my USB DVB-T device?

Plugged in the USB DVB-T device and rebooted the Synology but it does not see it, maybe it's not compatible with Synology?

Only seeing this now.... there’s a compatibility list on Synology site.
HDHomerun might be worth the extra for the dual tuner and flexibility. I say that without knowing your budget.

Darando

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

This is what my set up looks like for comparison.
I use distribution over Cat5e/Cat6 ethernet cable.
I do not have any 'smart' TVs so a small cheap client box is used at each TV.
Laptops, phones, tablets etc can also receive all the media, via wireless connection to router.

All the devices except client devices are centralised, and expanding with extra tuners or other network connected devices is simple.




NOTE:

What I forgot to include in this pic is that I have the output of the Sky box going to a HDMI>DVB-T Edision device which is fed to the HDHomerun tuner box and becomes just another channel on the TV.
Changing the actual channel the Sky box is tuned to is done in the usual way, or can also be done by a software control over the LAN.


This pic shows that connection. Someday I must alamgamate the two pics

Just getting my head around this...how many tvs can watch different channels at the same time? Does the Sky box, sat tuner and aerial tuners mean plenty of options for multichannel rather than simple mirroring?

Johnboy1951

Darando wrote: »

Just getting my head around this...how many tvs can watch different channels at the same time? Does the Sky box, sat tuner and aerial tuners mean plenty of options for multichannel rather than simple mirroring?

Not sure what you mean by mirroring .... presuming you mean one user chooses a channel and other users get to view that only.
This is completely different, each user selects what they want to view up to the limits of the available hardware.

I never tried to calculate the number of individual viewing points available (viewing point being a display of channel or maybe recording of a channel) ..... but if you were to take 4 sat tuners and multiply by the number of channels per mux, you get the number of Sat channels.
In addition, add the Saorview channels plus one for whatever is tuned in on the Skybox. So maybe 50? No idea really

On the other hand maybe what should be considered for Satellite reception is the number of muxes that can be tuned .... in this case 4, plus the Sky box ..... as a lot of popular channels are on different muxes.

Two DVB-T tuners covers all the Saorview channels for all users.

From whatever the total that gives, each viewing point (not just TVs, but phones, laptops, desktops, tablets etc) can select any one channel.
When a tuner is free, a new channel (on any mux) can be requested by any user to view and/or record, control of which is also centralised so the best use is made of tuners.

The only real limits are the number of tuners, and possibly the bandwidth of the LAN in very extreme cases.

Of course access can also be shared over internet if required.

Hopefully I have not confused things further

.

Darando

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Not sure what you mean by mirroring .... presuming you mean one user chooses a channel and other users get to view that only.
This is completely different, each user selects what they want to view up to the limits of the available hardware.

I never tried to calculate the number of individual viewing points available (viewing point being a display of channel or maybe recording of a channel) ..... but if you were to take 4 sat tuners and multiply by the number of channels per mux, you get the number of Sat channels.
In addition, add the Saorview channels plus one for whatever is tuned in on the Skybox. So maybe 50? No idea really

On the other hand maybe what should be considered for Satellite reception is the number of muxes that can be tuned .... in this case 4, plus the Sky box ..... as a lot of popular channels are on different muxes.

Two DVB-T tuners covers all the Saorview channels for all users.

From whatever the total that gives, each viewing point (not just TVs, but phones, laptops, desktops, tablets etc) can select any one channel.
When a tuner is free, a new channel (on any mux) can be requested by any user to view and/or record, control of which is also centralised so the best use is made of tuners.

The only real limits are the number of tuners, and possibly the bandwidth of the LAN in very extreme cases.

Of course access can also be shared over internet if required.

Hopefully I have not confused things further

.

Cheers, by mirroring I meant another user only stick watchi g the same channel, so you cleared that up!

I must look into the cost of the hardware and see if possible to get my head around it and the IT end of things 🙈 have a 4 lnd feeds and a aerial connection available....(currently just using a sky HD box however) so thinking of upgrading.

Johnboy1951

Darando wrote: »

Cheers, by mirroring I meant another user only stick watchi g the same channel, so you cleared that up!

I must look into the cost of the hardware and see if possible to get my head around it and the IT end of things �� have a 4 lnd feeds and a aerial connection available....(currently just using a sky HD box however) so thinking of upgrading.

You might find some information of interest in the HTPC section of boards

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=643

There are a few boardies who use this type of set up, with various hardware parts and software too.
All my software is open source and free and is stable in use.

neiljung

In the same position as the OP more or less with a new build with a comms cupboard but need to confirm wiring/cabling requirements. At this stage just want to leave my options as open as possible for whenever I have the time and funds to actually look at routers, switches etc. etc.

So from the Satellite/Aerial to the Comms Cupboard;
Are 5No. Ct 100 Coax cables enough (4 for the Satellite Dish and 1 for the aerial) or do I need more again if looking to have both Sky Q and Freesat/Astra and Saorview?
And is using small twin cable coax a reasonably risk free way of running these as opposed to single coax cables only?

From the Comms Cupboard to the TVs/Data Points;
The discussion on purely CAT5/6 distribution looks temptingly simple but....
If I am running coax would I need to run 3 coax cables (2 satellite and 1 for aerial) to each TV point to ensure all options?
And in terms of running CAT5/6 in parallel with this is there any benefit in running twin Ethernet cables to allow for TV and say additional WiFi routers or can a single Ethernet output be split after the socket without major issues?
(Hearing that Wi-Fi distribution around especially concrete new builds is very poor due to insulation levels so looking to have the option for additional Wi-Fi access points in the far flung corners.)

Any guidance much appreciated.

Johnboy1951

@neiljung

If at all possible I would advise routing ducting from the media press to the external wall close to where a Sat dish and aerial will be mounted.
Place pull cords in it so that if extra coax is required in the future you will have the means and space in the ducting to easily accomplish it.

The cost of ethernet cable is low, so running two to each point costs little (same labour near enough).
If you can arrange to have those also in ducting then that would be ideal ..... same applies to the coax to each room.
I was unable to use ducting for the rooms due to mine being a retro fit.
I did manage to duct from media press to outer wall so am well covered for bringing in coax and other wires - such as ethernet/power for external cameras, and also power for external lights.

You could always 'mix & match' ...... use ethernet to distribute the FTA and have Sky on coax. In that way one Unicable LNB will provide Sat signal for up to 32 tuner should you have such a need So the reduction in coax coming in could be appreciable.
I would still duct it though .... you never know when water ingress could force a cable replacement.

I don't have a SkyQ system here so others will have better info than me.
I would expect 2 coax cables to the SkyQ box, and the SkyQ slave units in other rooms can use wifi or ethernet to connect to the main box to use its tuners.

Whatever you do ...... do more than you think you will need now as you will surely have a need in the future when it would be very costly to put it in place.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

The Cush

neiljung wrote: »

So from the Satellite/Aerial to the Comms Cupboard;
Are 5No. Ct 100 Coax cables enough (4 for the Satellite Dish and 1 for the aerial) or do I need more again if looking to have both Sky Q and Freesat/Astra and Saorview?
And is using small twin cable coax a reasonably risk free way of running these as opposed to single coax cables only?

In a normal aerial/satellite dish setup feeding various TV points around the house 4 sat feeds plus an aerial feed into a multiswitch which in turn will feed multiple TV points around the house would be acceptable.

I've never used the small twin type cable, always ran single cables.

The same setup will work for SkyQ with a SkyQ compatible dSCR multiswitch, this will work with both legacy and SkyQ receivers

neiljung wrote: »

From the Comms Cupboard to the TVs/Data Points;
The discussion on purely CAT5/6 distribution looks temptingly simple but....
If I am running coax would I need to run 3 coax cables (2 satellite and 1 for aerial) to each TV point to ensure all options?

For the main TV point I would run at least 3 and maybe 4 cables. 2 satellite and 1 for aerial as you say, plus a spare.
For the other points, 2 cables - 1 sat and 1 aerial.

These Vision Products wallplates will split the combined signal from a multiswitch - https://vision-products.co.uk/slim-n-fast-outlet-plate-sat1-terr-sat2/ . There are a number of different combinations in their product line which can be seen in their catalogue, pages 86-87.