GolfNow - Contacting them!

the lawman

Booked a 4 ball in Carton on this site and it was frosted off. Trying to get a refund from them is driving me demented. The phone numbers on their site don't seem to work from here.

Anyone have any advice on what to do here?

davegilly

the lawman wrote: »

Booked a 4 ball in Carton on this site and it was frosted off. Trying to get a refund from them is driving me demented. The phone numbers on their site don't seem to work from here.

Anyone have any advice on what to do here?

Happened me twice before - rang the club in question and they allowed me to reschedule again for another day if that’s any use to you? Both clubs didn’t mind when I rescheduled either once there was a time free on the day.

the lawman

davegilly wrote: »

Happened me twice before - rang the club in question and they allowed me to reschedule again for another day if that’s any use to you? Both clubs didn’t mind when I rescheduled either once there was a time free on the day.

Carton offered that but I dont think it suits us.

I kinda want to get my money off them in principle. They purposely make it impossible to get a refund. Scam.

Downtime

the lawman wrote: »

Carton offered that but I dont think it suits us.

I kinda want to get my money off them in principle. They purposely make it impossible to get a refund. Scam.

Under their own Terms and Conditions you agree that all transactions made by you on the Site cannot be exchanged and are non-refundable.

the lawman

Downtime wrote: »

Under their own Terms and Conditions you agree that all transactions made by you on the Site cannot be exchanged and are non-refundable.

Based on the fact there is no weather cancellations. There was in this case.

ShivasIrons

Golfnow are really a blight on golf clubs and should be avoided at all costs.

newindublin

I use golfnow fairly often, never had an issue. Usually when a round is cancelled due to weather I have rescheduled, but if that won't work then I would try emailing golfersupport@golfnow.com, they have contacted me from that email whenever a booking had to be changed from the course.

davegilly

ShivasIrons wrote: »

Golfnow are really a blight on golf clubs and should be avoided at all costs.

Why do you think this? I wouldn’t have played a lot of courses if it wasn’t for them due to some saucy rack rates. Anytime I’ve used GolfNow the course has been pretty much empty too so surely it’s bringing people into courses who otherwise wouldn’t be there at all?

You must remember that not everyone is a member of a course so this is a great way for someone to enjoy a few rounds at a reasonable cost.

callaway92

ShivasIrons wrote: »

Golfnow are really a blight on golf clubs and should be avoided at all costs.

I've been lucky enough to play so many clubs I wouldn't have bothered playing (and at great prices) thanks to it.

What's your problem?

slave1

I agree, nothing better than planning a day off and scouting through GolfNow for a bargain green fee at a course you don't play that often or indeed have never played

HighLine

Quite the opposite to "blight". Golfnow in conjunction with MyGolfSociety can bring huge revenue to clubs. Those "Hot Deals" which are offered at quiet times of the day are a small trade off compared to the financial gain the club gets overall.

slave1

Exactly, we got a 2ball for Carne last year at €30 a pop, headed down and had grub there beforehand and then out onto empty course, played the new 9 for a fiver a head also but that was less value as the greens were brutal, so that was €70 in green fees plus whatever restaurant margin, some money to GN and some to Carne

ShivasIrons

callaway92 wrote: »

I've been lucky enough to play so many clubs I wouldn't have bothered playing (and at great prices) thanks to it.

What's your problem?

The issue with Golfnow is that they are the embodiment of the race to the bottom. Their business model is to give the ability to clubs to have an online booking engine in exchange for two tee times a day.


Seems a good deal, doesn't it? Also seems like a great service for golfers to get hot deals at courses they wouldn't normally have played. And looks like clubs get money they wouldn't normally get.


However on more in depth investigation, this is a short term view and has dire consequences for the long term health of clubs.


How so? What happens is that golf now will sell the tee times for anything, so the golf club price is set at an unsustainable low, a quick look for tomorrow has Donabate at €10, so now Donabate becomes a €10 golf club. Membership in Donabate is €1300. With golf now you can play Donabate once a week for a year for €520. The average member plays around this much golf, so now why become a member? Save €800 by using golf now.


So what do Donabate do, they introduce an introductory membership offer for €750. A golfer who has been a member for 30 years plays 1300 and someone walking in off the street pays 550 less then them! A nice way to antagonise your loyal members.



€10 green fees are not sustainable to run a golf course, so less money means poorer conditions and poorer services which in turns leads to less reasons to play and become a member and a further drop in revenue and members leaving.


If price was the sole reason why golfers play somewhere then the cheapest clubs would be the most successful and desirable ones to play. Yet the cheapest ones aren't successful at all and are the ones that close the most.


Unfortunately for golf in Ireland, the majority of golf clubs are run very poorly, the main reason why clubs struggle are themselves but they can't see it at all.


This is why Golf Now is a disaster

davegilly

ShivasIrons wrote: »

The issue with Golfnow is that they are the embodiment of the race to the bottom.

This is why Golf Now is a disaster

Donabate is €10 for a Thursday in February when nobody else is on the course. Check it again in June when it's either not available or multiples of €10.

The reason people join clubs is to play in competition's, be in a club and get an official handicap. Golfnow provides none of this. Nobody is paying €10 a week, 52 weeks of the year playing golf on Golfnow.

callaway92

ShivasIrons wrote: »

The issue with Golfnow is that they are the embodiment of the race to the bottom. Their business model is to give the ability to clubs to have an online booking engine in exchange for two tee times a day.


Seems a good deal, doesn't it? Also seems like a great service for golfers to get hot deals at courses they wouldn't normally have played. And looks like clubs get money they wouldn't normally get.


However on more in depth investigation, this is a short term view and has dire consequences for the long term health of clubs.


How so? What happens is that golf now will sell the tee times for anything, so the golf club price is set at an unsustainable low, a quick look for tomorrow has Donabate at €10, so now Donabate becomes a €10 golf club. Membership in Donabate is €1300. With golf now you can play Donabate once a week for a year for €520. The average member plays around this much golf, so now why become a member? Save €800 by using golf now.


So what do Donabate do, they introduce an introductory membership offer for €750. A golfer who has been a member for 30 years plays 1300 and someone walking in off the street pays 550 less then them! A nice way to antagonise your loyal members.



€10 green fees are not sustainable to run a golf course, so less money means poorer conditions and poorer services which in turns leads to less reasons to play and become a member and a further drop in revenue and members leaving.


If price was the sole reason why golfers play somewhere then the cheapest clubs would be the most successful and desirable ones to play. Yet the cheapest ones aren't successful at all and are the ones that close the most.


Unfortunately for golf in Ireland, the majority of golf clubs are run very poorly, the main reason why clubs struggle are themselves but they can't see it at all.


This is why Golf Now is a disaster

I honestly can't believe as a golfer that you're finding a way to complain about it.

slave1

And if a golfer or club do not want to use it then they simply don't have to

ShivasIrons wrote: »

Unfortunately for golf in Ireland, the majority of golf clubs are run very poorly, the main reason why clubs struggle are themselves but they can't see it at all.

There you go, said it yourself, clubs struggle through poor management and I'd agree with you, I see it time and time again, clubs milking members for all they're worth through lack of management.
Golf Now/BRS etc has nothing to do with it

thewobbler

I’d agree with the last few comments.

All too many golf clubs are controlled by golf club diehards (which is natural). Problem is that the club concept they wish to uphold - one that attracts a community of people with copious free time to fulfil active membership, and will pay accordingly - is not sustainable in less-populated areas. A lack of free time, and a lack of obligations, is a societal change that will eventually see the current golf club model turned on its head. For most clubs, fighting against it is a pointless exercise. It will happen eventually, once the receivers get involved.

Their ultimate conundrum is that with fewer members, there will be a gap in finances, and simultaneously there will be more room on the timesheet for visitors. It doesn’t take a big shot accountant to work out that A can be offset by B. Nor does it take a marketing wizard to work out that the ability to attract B on a wintery weekday, will often be determined by price. €300 in casual green fees at a tenner a pop will pay for a greenkeeper or two for the day. €100 in casual green fees at €25 will not.

Of course they can add in a few extra opens, but let’s be honest, these are also cut price green fees, except GUI requirements then exclude a hefty percentage of potential visitors to fill a timesheet.

Ironically these steps which help keep a club sustainable, also make membership of a club less attractive. Hence the need for a revised membership model.

Anyhow what I’m getting at is that GolfNow is NOT the problem, described above. It has not created this situation of “race to the bottom”. The golf clubs have done this to themselves by not revising their membership models.

GolfNow is in fact little more than a process improvement tool, one which alleviates the need to phone a dozen courses seeing what tee times are available and the cost of green fees on any given day . This is as advantageous to the clubs as the visitors, as it reduces time spent each week on correspondence. Crucially it also serves as a straight-to-target-audience marketing tool for their quieter days.

gypsy79

His argument his word for word nearly the rhetoric of PETER lawrie so not even original thought.

GolfNow gives people chances try new courses and in fact get started in the game cheaply. It is great for golf

GreeBo

gypsy79 wrote: »

His argument his word for word nearly the rhetoric of PETER lawrie so not even original thought.

GolfNow gives people chances try new courses and in fact get started in the game cheaply. It is great for golf

It is great for people, remains to be seen if its great for golf I guess was the point.

ShivasIrons

gypsy79 wrote: »

His argument his word for word nearly the rhetoric of PETER lawrie so not even original thought.

GolfNow gives people chances try new courses and in fact get started in the game cheaply. It is great for golf

The counter argument being given is that low green fees are good for the customer and as a result are a great idea.


I'm not Peter Lawrie, I don't know what he has been saying so maybe he has been copying my thoughts. Even still it doesn't matter if the thoughts are original are not, there is very few original thoughts in the world.


Going back to why 10 euro green fees being peddled by Golf Now are terrible and why Golf Now are bad for golf here and around the world is very simple. A business can't be run selling a product for less then it costs to deliver the product. The business will close down eventually.


Golf Now didn't start the race to the bottom but they've brought it to a new low. Somebody mentioned earlier getting 30 golfers paying 10 euro is better then 4 golfers giving 25. There is no evidence to show that this happens, there is no evidence to show that dropping the price leads to more golfers playing the course. More often then not the cheapest golf courses are the empty ones and the ones that are in financial trouble.


Also the revenue from the Golf Now hot deal doesn't go to the clubs it goes to Golf Now. The golfer that gets the hot deal doesn't go back to the club and pay the full price. This is the result of the race to the bottom.


As for needing cheap golf to allow golfers to enter the game, turn the unsustainable courses into 6, 9 or 12 hole courses.

newindublin

ShivasIrons wrote: »

Going back to why 10 euro green fees being peddled by Golf Now are terrible and why Golf Now are bad for golf here and around the world is very simple. A business can't be run selling a product for less then it costs to deliver the product. The business will close down eventually.

10 euro green fees are a gross misrepresentation of golfnow. Yes they exist, but only in the winter and only on courses that are either crap or just looking for any extra buck in a competitive market. I use golf now often enough and mostly I pay 30-50 a round for a average to good course.

As many other posters have stated, clubs are reluctant to change their long time annual membership approach. I find that approach unattractive, and until the clubs themselves offer something else I am happy to book via online services.

I do applaud courses like Castleknock and Rathsallagh who have branched out and offered something different.

Also, Donabate is not worth 1300, golf now has nothing to do with that.

GreeBo

newindublin wrote: »

As many other posters have stated, clubs are reluctant to change their long time annual membership approach. I find that approach unattractive, and until the clubs themselves offer something else I am happy to book via online services.

In the majority of cases is what's needed financially to keep the club in the condition its in.

Members clubs aren't in it for a profit, no-one is bringing home more or less money based on how the club performs financially. Any money made goes back into the club, so why would a club change the model that allows them to run their club with the income they need to do it?

Seve OB

newindublin wrote: »

Also, Donabate is not worth 1300, golf now has nothing to do with that.

I would disagree with you there. I haven't played it in a good few years but it was always a pretty decent track kept in decent nic. 27 holes, lovely new clubhouse, close to city in a busy enough suburb.... 1,300 is actually a pretty decent price

eoghan104

newindublin wrote: »

I do applaud courses like Castleknock and Rathsallagh who have branched out and offered something different.

This.

Castleknock for me is by far and away the best value membership in Dublin. I am talking about the 1450 flexible membership. It is a lot more in tune with modern needs IMO. You pay for what you play and doesn’t tie you in to a big commitment to play the course week in week out to get value for money. It costs 35 euro to play a qualifying comp on a Sunday morning close to the city centre on a lovely track that is impeccably maintained.

There are trade offs necessary. We have society's out on Saturday and Sunday afternoons and it can be difficult to get on the timesheet. I am worried if they keep taking members in at this rate they will be a victim of their own success but we’ll see. I will be a member for as long as the offer is available. I wish more clubs would follow suit.

GreeBo

eoghan104 wrote: »

This.

Castleknock for me is by far and away the best value membership in Dublin. I am talking about the 1450 flexible membership. It is a lot more in tune with modern needs IMO. You pay for what you play and doesn’t tie you in to a big commitment to play the course week in week out to get value for money. It costs 35 euro to play a qualifying comp on a Sunday morning close to the city centre on a lovely track that is impeccably maintained.

There are trade offs necessary. We have society's out on Saturday and Sunday afternoons and it can be difficult to get on the timesheet. I am worried if they keep taking members in at this rate they will be a victim of their own success but we’ll see. I will be a member for as long as the offer is available. I wish more clubs would follow suit.

That would cost me considerably more than i pay today... so each to their own.

eoghan104

Yeah there is some cases where people would be better off paying the 1700 unlimited membership but I would argue they are the minority.

There are a lot of people who think they are better off unlimited but the are not. ( I was one of them until i crunched the numbers.)

newindublin

Seve OB wrote: »

I would disagree with you there. I haven't played it in a good few years but it was always a pretty decent track kept in decent nic. 27 holes, lovely new clubhouse, close to city in a busy enough suburb.... 1,300 is actually a pretty decent price

I am not trying to run Donabate down, just being honest with my opinion. I have only played there once for 9 holes, but it was a very average/bland 9 holes. I left not wanting more. There is a lot of competition in the Dublin area, but also a lot more people. I think the sheer population density allows Donabate to survive.

I am playing there in a few weeks for an event, maybe it will change my mind.