NCPS Parking Fine

Pigtownlad

Hi

So I was parked in my college car park, it is a park by text app facility or pay and display. I've been using the car park and using park by text app for 3 years now. Unfortunately, I returned to my car Tuesday evening and had a ticket under my window wiper.

The ticket with a fixed charged fine was a for not paying for parking, which shocked me as I pay a week at a time every Monday on the app. Then it hit me, I bought a new car that weekend and the car I paid for on my app had my old cars registration number.

I emailed NCPS explained what had happened, that I had paid for parking but under a different registration and I've now changed the registration on the application, apologized and sent them screenshots from the app for proof of that.

Unfortunately, they emailed back saying the onus was on me and said I've 21 days to pay the fine or my car may be clamped and fine increased.

Just wondering where I stand when it comes to having to pay a fixed fine on a private car park like that? I have googled but I can't seem to find much on fines, just about clamping.

ELM327

NCPS have no jurisdiction to issue fines. They are a private company, and any fine they issue you has the same legal standing as if I was to fine you now €150 per post on boards.

We can't give legal advice on boards, but I'd not pay them a cent.

I've binned at least 2 (tesco car park) and never heard a thing.

Tomw86

<SNIP>

I can't advise what to do on the fine - I'd not pay it if they have no jurisdiction and know people who have done the same with NCPS.

Just make sure that you are fully up to date with paying next time, as they won't hesitate to clamp you next time if they realise who you are (unlikely with a new car tho).

coylemj

Pigtownlad wrote: »

Unfortunately, they emailed back saying the onus was on me and said I've 21 days to pay the fine or my car may be clamped and fine increased.

It's standard practice to reject the first line of appeal. Ask how you take it to the next level where I'd predict you have a reasonably good chance of success based on the fact that you paid for a service that you did not receive. Because you didn't park the car which you paid for.

Get the college and the students' union involved, ask them for details of the appeal process. Make lots of noise and you'll get the fine waived.

Johnny Red Cab

They cannot access the vehicle database to get your name and address. Appealing to them gives them the info for free.

I would ignore them.

BTW it is not a fine, it is a speculative invoice.

P2C

Got a few on a hospital site from these before and never paid. Never heard anything

C3PO

But the OP intends to continue to use the college carpark? If he ignores the ticket, as has been suggested, I would have thought that there is a good chance that he return some evening to find his car clamped and he'll have to pay a release fee as well as the original fine!

Former Former

Johnny Red Cab wrote: »

They cannot access the vehicle database to get your name and address. Appealing to them gives them the info for free.

I would ignore them.

BTW it is not a fine, it is a speculative invoice.

He has probably already provided this information by registering for the app.

As noted above, there is very little comeback if the OP ignores it... Until the next time he parks there

italodisco

Don't pay it.

Don't respond.

Continue to park there <SNIP> and also ripped up 5 'fines

Private clampers lol

endacl

C3PO wrote: »

But the OP intends to continue to use the college carpark? If he ignores the ticket, as has been suggested, I would have thought that there is a good chance that he return some evening to find his car clamped and he'll have to pay a release fee as well as the original fine!

Not if he was to invest in a cheap angle grinder to keep in the boot. Would be cheaper than a release fee, and he wouldn’t have to wait around for the numpty with the padlock key to show up.

L1011

Private clampers have legal basis and regulation now, so reliance on the old possibilities relating to Road Traffic Acts isn't possible - and as such suggesting criminal damage is not in any way acceptable

coylemj

It's all very well telling the OP (who, after 24 hours has chosen to not contribute after his first (ever) post) to ignore the fine and I agree with the advice that it is not legally enforceable.

But.... this is the OP's college where he needs to park regularly and the college has given over management of the car park over to NCPS so like it or not, the OP will have to deal with this situation. And my advice is to appeal the ticket and get it quashed.

Pigtownlad

coylemj wrote: »

It's all very well telling the OP (who, after 24 hours has chosen to not contribute after his first (ever) post) to ignore the fine and I agree with the advice that it is not legally enforceable.

But.... this is the OP's college where he needs to park regularly and the college has given over management of the car park over to NCPS so like it or not, the OP will have to deal with this situation. And my advice is to appeal the ticket and get it quashed.

Yes, I need to park there for the foreseeable future. That's why I am worried, I would rather pay the fine then find I have to pay the fine and pay to have a clamp removed.

So I've taken your advice and will appeal it and see what comes of it.

my3cents

L1011 wrote: »

Private clampers have legal basis and regulation now, so reliance on the old possibilities relating to Road Traffic Acts isn't possible - and as such suggesting criminal damage is not in any way acceptable

But I doubt holding a car hostage to get payment of a speculative bill is included in the regulation.

ELM327

Criminal damage is not to be condoned of course.
But you can remove a clamp without causing damage.

It is also illegal to detain or obstruct the movement of a motor vehicle.

L1011

ELM327 wrote: »

.

It is also illegal to detain or obstruct the movement of a motor vehicle.

Private clamping is explicitly legal since Ross commenced Varadkars legislation so this angle no longer applies

my3cents

L1011 wrote: »

Private clamping is explicitly legal since Ross commenced Varadkars legislation so this angle no longer applies

Clampers clamping a legally parked vehicle or even threatening to do so just shows what illegal scum they are so I don't see how any law can defend them or prevent the removal of a clamp.

ELM327

L1011 wrote: »

Private clamping is explicitly legal since Ross commenced Varadkars legislation so this angle no longer applies

I will admit I had not read the SI until now
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2017/si/421/made/en/pdf


I'd still remove the clamp without causing any damage, unless it was a council clamp (which it wouldnt be as I always park legally and pay for parking through the app).

L1011

my3cents wrote: »

Clampers clamping a legally parked vehicle or even threatening to do so just shows what illegal scum they are so I don't see how any law can defend them or prevent the removal of a clamp.

Read the actual legislation. Petition the Minister who commenced it (and then tried to intervene in an appeal for a friend!) about it.

Effects

ELM327 wrote: »

I'd still remove the clamp without causing any damage

How?

Credit Checker Moose

Effects wrote: »

How?

Usually involves dismantling the suspension.

Renegade Mechanic

Credit Checker Moose wrote: »

Usually involves dismantling the suspension.

And steel wheels. Alloys not so much.. Make **** of your hubcaps if they're in the way, get the spanner at the exposed nuts/studs then undo the ball joint, allowing you to remove the chain around the wishbone, then then remove the wheel/clamp and work it out on the ground.

Take a timestamped picture of the UNDAMAGED clamp at your parking space for future "handbags" and drive off.
Of course if that sort of thing is illegal now then I absolutely don't condone it.

<SNIP - do not suggest in any way how to damage property>

boege

OP,
I work in a college and have a staff parking permit. Twice in the last few years I borrowed the wife's car forgetting I had no staff permit.

I tried all I could but the security guys were under instruction that they had no discretion. If you want to plead your case go behind the clampers and speak to the college Buildings department or whoever issues the security/clamping contract. They may issue you a refund but only after you have paid the clampers.

endacl

L1011 wrote: »

Private clamping is explicitly legal since Ross commenced Varadkars legislation so this angle no longer applies

I’m sure that angle can still be ground...

dudara

Any further mention, no matter how sideways, of damage to property of another will result in immediate mod action.

dudara

judeboy101

Plenty of lockpicking tutorials online and a decent lockpicking set is only a tenner. Zero damage done takes about 10mins to pick clamp lock, less if not raining or you get lucky.

Pigtownlad

I spoke to someone who works for NCPS on Friday, he has told me as long as I've my parking paid for from now on I will not be clamped for owning a fine but because there is an outstanding fine (if I don't pay it) I will be clamped if I haven't paid for parking next time and I will have to pay both for the clamp to be taken off and the fine if clamped.

So it looks like I know where I stand now, thanks for the advice and comments.

daheff

judeboy101 wrote: »

Plenty of lockpicking tutorials online and a decent lockpicking set is only a tenner. Zero damage done takes about 10mins to pick clamp lock, less if not raining or you get lucky.

also if you have a wheel pump I have heard (cannot confirm though) that you can let the air out of your tire and simple take the clamp off.


For peace of mind, I'd still write a letter of appeal to the clamping company (with college on cc) and let them know of the oversight on your side. Advise that you have now changed your reg on the app. You might get lucky and have the fine quashed. Otherwise you will forever be wondering if they decided to clamp you that day.

FanadMan

judeboy101 wrote: »

Plenty of lockpicking tutorials online and a decent lockpicking set is only a tenner. Zero damage done takes about 10mins to pick clamp lock, less if not raining or you get lucky.

Have you ever picked a clamp lock? They aren't cheap pound shop stuff that can be picked with a bobby pin like you see on TV or yt. Most of them are shim-proof and have security pins. I've done a few but they were done at home sitting at a desk. And they've taken more than 10 minutes.

But if YOU are James Bond then....... :rolleyes:

UrbanVixen

They received contractual consideration from OP for parking.
They are acting as if no such payment was made or received when it was.
That sounds like unjust enrichment aka having it both ways.

I would ask them to nullify the penalty as it was nothing more than a simple administrative error which any reasonable company would appreciate.

I would also tell them that you will be keeping the college's administration people up to date on the matter. These parking contracts come up for renewal periodically and it would be nice for the college to know how the parking control company treats people on campus.