Leaf Battery Degradation & 2nd Hand Prices

RM Ernest

Hi, new to the forum and doing lots of reading prior to the purchase of a 2nd hand EV as a 2nd car for the household, a mine of information here.

Research has narrowed the focus to 2nd hand 2016 30 kWh acenta / SV leafs that would seem to fit the bill for what we want. The extra range over the 24 kWh would suit and give a bit more flexibility.

Looking in the last 2 weeks on donedeal etc. there are some "higher" (70 - 100K km) mileage cars for sale under €15.5k that are down to 11 bars capacity. Have been reading up on the battery management issues and the firmware updates so not sure if these cars have had it done. Don't give exact SOH % figures either.

If indeed the capacity is down below 86% (11 bars) is there a rule of thumb price wise against similar spec cars with full capacity? Prices seem strong here and across the water.

Is it much of a concern if nissan provide an 8 year / 160k km battery warranty?

Generally we wouldn't be pushing the range limit but if it is already degraded is it more liable to further degradation?

It will be a 1st EV and the plan would be to keep it until the wheels fall off as we have with our current cars.

Thanks!

KCross

Very unlikely a 30kWh Leaf is down to 11 bars in reality, so almost certainly just needs the firmware update.

tedpan

KCross wrote:

Very unlikely a 30kWh Leaf is down to 11 bars in reality, so almost certainly just needs the firmware update.

Not really, my mate's 30kWh leaf was down to 95% after 12 months/24k kms. My 24kWh is down to 94% after 4 years/120k kms.

The 30 obviously isn't as well made.

RM Ernest

tedpan wrote: »

Not really, my mate's 30kWh leaf was down to 95% after 12 months/24k kms. My 24kWh is down to 94% after 4 years/120k kms.

The 30 obviously isn't as well made.

Would that be pre-firmware update?

RM Ernest

KCross wrote: »

Very unlikely a 30kWh Leaf is down to 11 bars in reality, so almost certainly just needs the firmware update.

One I have been looking at is due the firmware update next week so will be interesting to see the difference if any.

Zenith74

tedpan wrote: »

Not really, my mate's 30kWh leaf was down to 95% after 12 months/24k kms. My 24kWh is down to 94% after 4 years/120k kms.

The 30 obviously isn't as well made.

FWIW the degradation does not appear to be entirely linear for Leaf batteries. Seems to be very common for them to lose a good proportion of the first 10% in the initial few years and then slow down. If your mate gets the firmware update it's quite likely he'll stay above 90% for a few more years.

tedpan

RM Ernest wrote:

Would that be pre-firmware update?

Zenith74 wrote:

FWIW the degradation does not appear to be entirely linear for Leaf batteries. Seems to be very common for them to lose a good proportion of the first 10% in the initial few years and then slow down. If your mate gets the firmware update it's quite likely he'll stay above 90% for a few more years.

I know it was up to date this time last year. Has there been a firmware update since then. I've never had a firmware update on my 2015 24kWh

KCross

tedpan wrote: »

Not really, my mate's 30kWh leaf was down to 95% after 12 months/24k kms. My 24kWh is down to 94% after 4 years/120k kms.

The 30 obviously isn't as well made.

Firmware update has been made available for the 30kWh only a few weeks ago. It will push the 30kWh up between 2-7%.

A 30kWh that has lost a bar just needs the update.

KCross

tedpan wrote: »

I know it was up to date this time last year. Has there been a firmware update since then. I've never had a firmware update on my 2015 24kWh

Only on the 30kWh. Wont apply to your 24kWh.

macnab

As far as I know Nissan have not contacted L30 owners about this issue. In my case I made 3 attempts to speak to them about the firmware update before I finally got an answer. So if you have an early L30 get on the blower to Nissan and get it sorted.

creedp

Zenith74 wrote: »

FWIW the degradation does not appear to be entirely linear for Leaf batteries. Seems to be very common for them to lose a good proportion of the first 10% in the initial few years and then slow down. If your mate gets the firmware update it's quite likely he'll stay above 90% for a few more years.

FWIW - The details of my L30 Firmware update
Prior to Update.
Leafspy reporting SOC 83.2%, SOH 83.2%, Gids 263, AH 55.01
Car Reporting SOC 87%, GOM 141

After Update
Leafspy reporting SOC 82.8, SOH 91.22, Gids 286, Ah 60
Car Reporting SOC 87%, GOM 163

Garage had no issue with firmware update and was done under warranty

Yo creedp, that Ah and GID pretty much confirms you have a 24 kWh battery installed there. Almost exactly the same as my last reading from a 152 L24 from April 2018 before I traded it in for a L40:

AHr=62.26, SOH=95.20, Hx=93.62.

That car typically reported a full GOM of 140-170 depending on previous drive and weather.

The L40 reports AHr of 110ish and I would expect L30 to have about 80-90 Ah instead of 60. Your car wouldn't be the first L30 to have a L24 battery even in this country ;-)

KCross

samih wrote: »

Yo creedp, that Ah and GID pretty much confirms you have a 24 kWh battery installed there. Almost exactly the same as my last reading from a 152 L24 from April 2018 before I traded it in for a L40:

AHr=62.26, SOH=95.20, Hx=93.62.

That car typically reported a full GOM of 140-170 depending on previous drive and weather.

His figures are not at 100% SoC so the GIDs represents current charge level not max.
286 GIDs @ 83% SoC is an L30.


The Ahr figure looks wrong alright though... my guess is that is a typo or else its the AHr figure from the wrong screen in Leafspy.... it should be read from screen 1

KCross, possibly didn't pay enough attention to the SOC. The numbers looked close enough to GIDs on L24 at high SOC. If my memory serves me right I had about 270 GIDs when fully charged (SOC about 96-97) but at 82% SOC 28X is too high for a 24 kWh battery alright.

creedp

KCross wrote: »

His figures are not at 100% SoC so the GIDs represents current charge level not max.
286 GIDs @ 83% SoC is an L30.


The Ahr figure looks wrong alright though... my guess is that is a typo or else its the AHr figure from the wrong screen in Leafspy.... it should be read from screen 1

You are right I was reading AHr from Screen 3. The figure in Screen 1 is 72.5