landlord charging flat fee for utility bills

goochy

maybe it was that I was desperate to find a place to rent , but agreed to let landlord ( who lives in house also ) charge me a flat fee for bills going by the average . She wants me to pay rent and a fixed fee for bills each month into her account . However i am not happy with the cost of the bills - would prefer lower bills in say summer and higher in winter . Bearing in mind theres only x2 of us in the house - surely it wouldnt be that hard to just divide the bills by x2 and let me pay half ?

what is the normal procedure in what is a house share basically ?

I'd get a look at the bills.

godtabh

Maybe it’s a level pay bill?

darragh o meara

Depends on what he/she is charging. I know one place I rented years ago and the landlady charged me 40 a month for bills and it worked out cheaper than if I paid them myself. Suited me at the time and I didn’t need to worry about bins,elec,gas,tv,phone etc

Are they charging huge amounts that would be more than what you would expect to pay on your own or does it seem reasonable?

Samuel T. Cogley

You can ask but if you're sharing with the LL then you've practically no rights.

jimmycrackcorm

godtabh wrote:

Maybe it’s a level pay bill?

Yes. Mine are that.

.......

goochy wrote: »

what is the normal procedure in what is a house share basically ?

Its not a house share. You are a licencee. Youve no rights. Its the landlords rules and if you dont like it - tough. Sounds harsh but thats how it is.

vectorvictor

Tell us what she is charging and the property type and posters here will be able to tell you if you have an issue.

Preferring higher winter and lower summer bills is bizzare

the_syco

goochy wrote: »

who lives in house also

So you are a licensee. Thus, no rights, and if you piss her off, you could be given a week to GTFO.

To me, "flat fee" bills is basically someone who wants the yearly total to fall under the "rent a room" max, which variable bills may cause.

1874

goochy wrote: »

maybe it was that I was desperate to find a place to rent , but agreed to let landlord ( who lives in house also ) charge me a flat fee for bills going by the average . She wants me to pay rent and a fixed fee for bills each month into her account . However i am not happy with the cost of the bills - would prefer lower bills in say summer and higher in winter . Bearing in mind theres only x2 of us in the house - surely it wouldnt be that hard to just divide the bills by x2 and let me pay half ?

what is the normal procedure in what is a house share basically ?

As you said, it is a house share, you cannot be in a house share with an owner occupier and say they are a landlord, you are a licencee and they are the owner. I used to let rooms in my home and I used to divy up the bills, but it was an awful hassle, aside from the fact it was in arrears and chasing it up, what the owner in this case is doing is making it easier and less hassle for themselves and thats how it should be, minimum hassle, plus you get to pay a level amount summer or winter, in hindsight I should have done the same.

BrownFinger wrote: »

I'd get a look at the bills.

If its a fair amount, they probably shouldnt or couldnt complain, they have no right and thats just the way of it, if the owner is doing it fairly, they could say, its x per month and if its more I'll carry it over or less, I'll come looking for any extra, that said, the bill is in the owners name and the licenscee can agree to it or go if the owner doesnt want to show them, its a bill and contract between the owner and the gas/elec supplier, So the licensee/OP has no more rights to see it than they have to see the owners credit card bill or a bank statement.

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

You can ask but if you're sharing with the LL then you've practically no rights.

You cant be in a situation where you share with a landlord, it assumes you are renting off them in the sense of part 4, the person in this case is the owner, the OP is a licensee, they have very limited rights but none in the sense of part 4 at all as its not relevant, that said, it can be a better situation than house sharing with a group of unknowns or any other scenario as an owner occupied house is likely to be kept in better condition with up to date mod cons and problems most likely dealt with promptly

the_syco wrote: »

So you are a licensee. Thus, no rights, and if you piss her off, you could be given a week to GTFO.

To me, "flat fee" bills is basically someone who wants the yearly total to fall under the "rent a room" max, which variable bills may cause.

An owner could ask/tell you to move out in an hour or less if they so decided, I wouldnt say thats usual, but I moved someone out in 24hours when they threatened me, hindsight being better, I should have told them to pack what they could carry and go on the spot and collect their stuff at an agreed time, while the OPs enquiry sounds reasonable, its quite possible the owner is being fair but just doesnt want the hassle of monthly calculating what is likely to be 2 variable bills or chasing people for money owned in arrears while paying the bills themselves. Having a flat amount sorts that out easier and its a good way for all to know what the known amount is, rather than suprise increases.

Masala

That's sounds good to me..... I would be 24 hr on the internet including streaming as well as have an electric heater in my room. And leave the auld electric blanket plugged in as well. And if I left tge odd light on.... I wouldn't have to rush home to turn it off

... and then there the immersion!!! No more 'did I or didn't I??'

endacl

^^

All very well taking the pi55, but you’d be living with the person you’d be taking the pii55 out of. The same one with the power to turf you out in the same moment they decided to turf you out.

1874

Masala wrote: »

That's sounds good to me..... I would be 24 hr on the internet including streaming as well as have an electric heater in my room. And leave the auld electric blanket plugged in as well. And if I left tge odd light on.... I wouldn't have to rush home to turn it off

... and then there the immersion!!! No more 'did I or didn't I??'

Thats not very good advice for the OP so either you're taking the mick or winding the OP up, if youre an adult and serious, well thats on you.
For all we know the OP is paying a very reasonable rate.

byronbay2

Masala wrote: »

That's sounds good to me..... I would be 24 hr on the internet including streaming as well as have an electric heater in my room. And leave the auld electric blanket plugged in as well. And if I left tge odd light on.... I wouldn't have to rush home to turn it off

... and then there the immersion!!! No more 'did I or didn't I??'

That's always the danger with tenants! Some di*khead will deliberately do the dog on it, just because they can!

I used to include the bills as part of the rent in a house I rented out about 10 years ago. Was getting these huge gas/electricity bills, especially in winter. Separated the rent from the bills and (amazingly!) the bills suddenly dropped by over 50%. Valuable lesson for a rookie LL!

1874

byronbay2 wrote: »

That's always the danger with tenants! Some di*khead will deliberately do the dog on it, just because they can!

I used to include the bills as part of the rent in a house I rented out about 10 years ago. Was getting these huge gas/electricity bills, especially in winter. Separated the rent from the bills and (amazingly!) the bills suddenly dropped by over 50%. Valuable lesson for a rookie LL!

See where youre coming from, but this is a different scenario, owner occupier/licensee, and its not included, they seem to be paying a flat amount up front, this doesnt mean its included, just that the owner isnt footing the bill in advance, cranking up the heat might find them paying extra. If the owner is reasonably on the ball this would be a foolish move by any licensee to follow the advice a few posts back, if the owner is a nice person and the place is clean then it would really be a dick move and if discovered could get the OP shown the front door on the spot out of concern of anything else they may try if they got the chance. If the OP still doesnt like it, they can always try for somewhere else.

I learned a bit about people when letting rooms in my house, some people will always try push things and eke out whatever small advantage they can, Im not saying this is the OPs case, but I had people quibble small amounts of bills and drag them out paying piecemeal, I may let rooms again, but bills would be a flat amount per month, I would not be chasing after people looking for someones share of any bill, too much hassle, share of gas,electric,broadbandtv.
I would outright ban candles/electric heater/electric blankets, none are needed in a centrally heated house and all are a fire hazard.

goochy

Mad , i never knew about this owner / occupier thing - thought it was the same as renting a whole house .

Masala

endacl wrote: »

^^

All very well taking the pi55, but you’d be living with the person you’d be taking the pii55 out of. The same one with the power to turf you out in the same moment they decided to turf you out.

Am just highlighting what can happen when a situation is 'loose'!! Been there and done that.

Irish_peppa

1874 wrote: »

I learned a bit about people when letting rooms in my house, some people will always try push things and eke out whatever small advantage they can
I may let rooms again, but bills would be a flat amount per month, I would not be chasing after people looking for someones share of any bill, too much hassle, share of gas,electric,broadbandtv.
I would outright ban candles/electric heater/electric blankets, none are needed in a centrally heated house and all are a fire hazard.

I tried that before with 2 lads, Leccy Bills shot up... They snuck in 2 electric fan heaters despite me telling them not to use them you would hear them coming on even when they were out automatically switchin on and off through the ceiling. Immersion (despite having a boost button) they would as habit just click the water boost button anytime they walked by it.. even if the tank was full of hot water allready
Bins EVERYTHING to the black bin.... recycle? Nahh sure thats too much hassle turf everything into black sure we paid for it wether we recycle or not (including glass bottles):mad:
When I put foot down about fan heaters they wanted the central heating on for 9 hours a day place was never warm enough. Yes thats because your opening all the windows and leaving the patio doors open to watch the tv while smoking
I used to supply wood for the stove and it was just abused filling the thing constantly while standing at the back door with it wide open smoking and chatting.
The attitude was if im paying xx amount per week by god ill ride it as hard as i can lol.
Its not so much the riding of it i hated it was more so just the waste of it all.

I prefer dividing the bills evenly between the occupants every two months.

The_Conductor

godtabh wrote: »

Maybe it’s a level pay bill?

+1 if its based on average usage- very probably this is the case.

OP- you've gotten some good advice- and some, frankly, appalling advice in this thread. Personally- I'd suggest leave good enough alone, you're paying a share based on an average bill- that, believe it or not, is the basis on which over 70% of the population pay their bills- with an average spread out over the year- so no nightmares in the winter time- offset by bonanzas in the summer..........

Most suppliers now insist on these type bills- you can opt out of them- but they make it difficult and cumbersome.

pillphil

the_syco wrote: »

So you are a licensee. Thus, no rights, and if you piss her off, you could be given a week to GTFO.

To me, "flat fee" bills is basically someone who wants the yearly total to fall under the "rent a room" max, which variable bills may cause.

Do bills count towards the rent a room cap?

Irish_peppa

pillphil wrote: »

Do bills count towards the rent a room cap?

Yup !


Hmmm so in that case it would make sense so the LL wont go over the 14K Rent a Room Allowance tax free limit.
Makes perfect sense if thats the case i guess