TBC problem

Dakota Dan

Tbc went mad high last week and the co-ops machine for testing was out of action for the last week. I thought I had it sorted but it's still high. Milking machine spotless, vacuum line cleaned, bulk tank brush cleaned as well as auto wash and it's still at 51k. The only thing left are the long milk tubes that are overdue a change, could it be anything else? Cows also outside day and night on dry ground.

whelan2

Do you have an in plate cooler?

3 the square

Are u useing a milk can to milk fresh calves cows or cows that were injected at the moment.

whelan2

Descale wash followed by an alkasan wash and plant rinsed out well after. Works here

Dakota Dan

whelan2 wrote: »

Do you have an in plate cooler?

No plate cooler and tank is cooling to 3 degrees.

Dakota Dan

whelan2 wrote: »

Descale wash followed by an alkasan wash and plant rinsed out well after. Works here

I did that last night and took a sample this morning first milking into tank as it was collected before am milking.

Dakota Dan

3 the square wrote: »

Are u useing a milk can to milk fresh calves cows or cows that were injected at the moment.

I was using a quarter milker on 2 cows with high scc in those quarters but stopped after the first high test. SCC is low around 120k.

Mooooo

Any rubber bends in the milkline on the way to tank starting to perish? Are you sure the detergent is getting into the tank for wash cycle.? Avalkasan can sometimes crystallize a bit and block lines from drawing it in.

Injuryprone

Are you saying that you took a milk sample from the pipe going into the tank and it tested 51k?

Buford T. Justice XIX

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Tbc went mad high last week and the co-ops machine for testing was out of action for the last week. I thought I had it sorted but it's still high. Milking machine spotless, vacuum line cleaned, bulk tank brush cleaned as well as auto wash and it's still at 51k. The only thing left are the long milk tubes that are overdue a change, could it be anything else? Cows also outside day and night on dry ground.

A few days of hot descaler followed by hot caustic and well rinsed out after with clean water with a small amount of peracetic acid added as well wouldn't do any harm.


How are the liners, near enough to need changing?


What water supply have you? If mains, has there been a fix of a leak nearby in the last few days? How's the well supply?

whelan2

What about a 3 spin cow? Could one with a bad quarter be being milked?

Dakota Dan

Dakota Dan wrote: »

I was using a quarter milker on 2 cows with high scc in those quarters but stopped after the first high test. SCC is low around 120k.

Injuryprone wrote: »

Are you saying that you took a milk sample from the pipe going into the tank and it tested 51k?

No, straight from the tank after am milking.

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

A few days of hot descaler followed by hot caustic and well rinsed out after with clean water with a small amount of peracetic acid added as well wouldn't do any harm.


How are the liners, near enough to need changing?


What water supply have you? If mains, has there been a fix of a leak nearby in the last few days? How's the well supply?

Great water pressure, liners changed start of august. I'll try the descaler.

whelan2 wrote: »

What about a 3 spin cow? Could one with a bad quarter be being milked?

No, I always keep out the right quarter.

whelan2

Is your hot water hot enough?

Dakota Dan

Mooooo wrote: »

Any rubber bends in the milkline on the way to tank starting to perish? Are you sure the detergent is getting into the tank for wash cycle.? Avalkasan can sometimes crystallize a bit and block lines from drawing it in.

There is one bend near the tank that I must change tomorrow and the long milk tubes, hopefully that will sort it.

Dakota Dan

whelan2 wrote: »

Is your hot water hot enough?

80 degrees.

K.G.

check your water for bugs.in the meantime use 20 to 30 cc s of paracetic acid inthe final rinse

babybrian

Had a similar issue 2 years ago, take a look inside the bulk tank and at the agitator blade... mine had build up of milk scale, got in and scrubbed it and TBC dropped from 50's to below 10.

_Brian

I serviced machines for years.

The vacuum line from the receiving jar to the sanitary jar can be a shocking problem for TBC.

Plate cooler mentioned earlier.

Amy change in plumbing, is the water definitely clean ?

Dakota Dan

_Brian wrote: »

I serviced machines for years.

The vacuum line from the receiving jar to the sanitary jar can be a shocking problem for TBC.

Plate cooler mentioned earlier.

Amy change in plumbing, is the water definitely clean ?

There was grit in water last week, there’s a quarry nearby and I had a lot of problems with grit in the water every time they were blasting around 20 years ago. A new crowd took it over since and are blasting once every 2 weeks and the grit problem is back.

_Brian

Dakota Dan wrote: »

There was grit in water last week, there’s a quarry nearby and I had a lot of problems with grit in the water every time they were blasting around 20 years ago. A new crowd took it over since and are blasting once every 2 weeks and the grit problem is back.

I’d definitely have it tested, although grit is no guarantee of a bacteria problem.

Mortelaro

Any crack in a liner will send milk back up through the vaacum line
The damage is done and stays long after you change liners if not sorted
As this isn't washed but connected to your milk line it could be dirty
In deleval systems it's piped into an overflow metal hanging jar
If you've one of those,you may take it off and spray hot water up the vacuum pipe and clean with a chimney sweep
If it's manky,chunks will be making their way to the milk line

whelan2

If it is going on a while get farm services lad out or lad who services milking machine

farisfat

The outlet where the milk Lorrie connects was a problem here.....always washed now on collection day.

alps

Mortelaro wrote: »

Any crack in a liner will send milk back up through the vaacum line
The damage is done and stays long after you change liners if not sorted
As this isn't washed but connected to your milk line it could be dirty
In deleval systems it's piped into an overflow metal hanging jar
If you've one of those,you may take it off and spray hot water up the vacuum pipe and clean with a chimney sweep
If it's manky,chunks will be making their way to the milk line

Can you suck hot water and detergent into and through your vacuum line with the machine running? Make sure you leave electronic pulsators turned off. You'll see some amount of dirt make it to the sanitary trap or vessel.

Wildsurfer

whelan2 wrote: »

What about a 3 spin cow? Could one with a bad quarter be being milked?

But that won't affect TBC, only SCC.

whelan2

Wildsurfer wrote: »

But that won't affect TBC, only SCC.

If it's crap in the spin it will affect tbc. Been there.

Injuryprone

Check the milk going into the tank. That'll tell you if you're problem is in the tank or the milking plant.

As said above, the piping above the receiving jar is a place to look.

mahoney_j

Problem could be outside your controll and could be a truck issue ,chat to neighbours on your run and see if any of them are having issues very possible there is an issue with the truck or testing within coop

Dakota Dan

mahoney_j wrote: »

Problem could be outside your controll and could be a truck issue ,chat to neighbours on your run and see if any of them are having issues very possible there is an issue with the truck or testing within coop

No, I took a sample from the tank first milking as soon as the milk was cooled and it was 51k so that eliminates lorry.

whelan2

Dakota Dan wrote: »

No, I took a sample from the tank first milking as soon as the milk was cooled and it was 51k so that eliminates lorry.

How often is your milk collected?

Dakota Dan

whelan2 wrote: »

How often is your milk collected?

Every 3 days.

_Brian

alps wrote: »

Can you suck hot water and detergent into and through your vacuum line with the machine running? Make sure you leave electronic pulsators turned off. You'll see some amount of dirt make it to the sanitary trap or vessel.

Easy does it, I’ve seen plenty of vacuum pumps knackered letting too much water into the system and flooding the pump.

Mortelaro

alps wrote: »

Can you suck hot water and detergent into and through your vacuum line with the machine running? Make sure you leave electronic pulsators turned off. You'll see some amount of dirt make it to the sanitary trap or vessel.

Yes
Service man will do this
More than worth getting them out by the sounds of things

whelan2

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Every 3 days.

The only plus side of every day collection is you get results everyday too. Handy if there's an issue

Dakota Dan

_Brian wrote: »

Easy does it, I’ve seen plenty of vacuum pumps knackered letting too much water into the system and flooding the pump.

The trick is not to suck up more than the sanitary trap can take even though all sanitary traps have an anti flooding rubber like the sanitary trap in the milk line.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Any news on this yet, Dan?


I was thinking about this last night, did you check that all the clusters are getting rinse water and detergent circulating properly during the wash cycle? One or both of the air inlet holes, one in the bottom of the cluster itself and the other on the 4 way joiner from the jeters to the wash line, might be blocked and stop or slow down the wash circulating.



It happened here when we put in the parlour many years ago so we check each unit at the start of the wash cycle. We had to give a good scrub to the affected units and clean the air inlets and it washed away grand after.

_Brian

Dakota Dan wrote: »

The trick is not to suck up more than the sanitary trap can take even though all sanitary traps have an anti flooding rubber like the sanitary trap in the milk line.

Oh I know.
Still I replaced many vacuum pumps ruined by flooding them

Dakota Dan

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Any news on this yet, Dan?


I was thinking about this last night, did you check that all the clusters are getting rinse water and detergent circulating properly during the wash cycle? One or both of the air inlet holes, one in the bottom of the cluster itself and the other on the 4 way joiner from the jeters to the wash line, might be blocked and stop or slow down the wash circulating.



It happened here when we put in the parlour many years ago so we check each unit at the start of the wash cycle. We had to give a good scrub to the taffected units and clean the air inlets and it washed away grand after.

I changed the long milk tubes washed out the vacuum line with very hot water in two rinses. I hot washed the machine with descaler followed by avalksan two nights in a row. I got the brain wave from some poster here to take a sample from milk line and tank separately, got the results yesterday milk line 9k tank 57k so I got the milk collected today after am milking and gave it a good scrubbing with a brush and detergent for 20 minutes followed by descaler in the auto wash and avalkasan after. The bowl for the auto wash was leaking and no detergent getting to the tank but I managed to get it welded today and it’s stopped leaking.

My milk advisor was saying tasking a sample from the milk line was a hit and miss as you are only taking a sample of a fraction of the milk but surely it’s better than shooting in the dark. I must take in a sample in tomorrow to see if it’s improved.

Dakota Dan

_Brian wrote: »

Oh I know.
Still I replaced many vacuum pumps ruined by flooding them

They wouldn’t be long learning a lesson after that.

Mooooo

The no detergent getting to the tank could be it in thinking.

whelan2

Mooooo wrote: »

The no detergent getting to the tank could be it in thinking.

I bought 2 clear 5 gallon drums last year for the tank detergent and descale. Money well spent

Dakota Dan

Mooooo wrote: »

The no detergent getting to the tank could be it in thinking.

There was only a tiny pin hole in it but as soon as the washer was started it would start to leak even though the tank looked clean after washing there was probably a skin building up in it.

I’ll probably be getting a penalty for November milk even though the lab at the co op had the machine for tbc testing down for a week which delayed remeding the problem.

alps

Collected here by day and it's so convenient for checking tank cleanliness or getting anything serviced on it....hated night collections..

Mooooo

whelan2 wrote: »

I bought 2 clear 5 gallon drums last year for the tank detergent and descale. Money well spent

Cousin did the same. Tank here will text if detergent or acid is low, well when it has coverage anyway

Injuryprone

I wouldn't say you're entirely out of the woods with that 9k result coming out of the milking plant (I get what he's saying about it being only a snapshot, but it still shouldn't be too far off with milk pooling in the receiving jar). Fresh milk should be well under 5k. Doubling the initial level will have a much larger effect after 3 days.
From p26 of link below, milk entering at 5k will only be 10k at 48 hours when stored at 4degs, but will be 30k/100k after a further 24/48 hours. Your milk at 0 hours is at the 48 hour stage on that table.

http://www.greenfielddairy.ie/files/uploads/PDF/Gleeson,%20David%20-%20Producing%20Clean%20Milk.pdf

But having said all that, if you tested 1 milking in the tank after a couple of hours and it came back at 57k, then you're obviously right to start there. But if it was 3 day old milk in the tank it mightn't be that far off.

Dakota Dan

Injuryprone wrote: »

I wouldn't say you're entirely out of the woods with that 9k result coming out of the milking plant (I get what he's saying about it being only a snapshot, but it still shouldn't be too far off with milk pooling in the receiving jar). Fresh milk should be well under 5k. Doubling the initial level will have a much larger effect after 3 days.
From p26 of link below, milk entering at 5k will only be 10k at 48 hours when stored at 4degs, but will be 30k/100k after a further 24/48 hours. Your milk at 0 hours is at the 48 hour stage on that table.

http://www.greenfielddairy.ie/files/uploads/PDF/Gleeson,%20David%20-%20Producing%20Clean%20Milk.pdf

But having said all that, if you tested 1 milking in the tank after a couple of hours and it came back at 57k, then you're obviously right to start there. But if it was 3 day old milk in the tank it mightn't be that far off.

I’ll know this evening, fingers crossed.

Dakota Dan

11k from sample after two milkings.