Buying a comercial for cash (no vat)

fergus1001

well lads just wondering would people generally be open to selling a jeep for cash as in leave the Vat out of it and let johnny cash look after it ?

SEPT 23 1989

No point if you run a proper business

aaakev

If your buying from a business they are gonna have to pay the vat.

What ya after? Are you vat registered?

fergus1001

aaakev wrote:

If your buying from a business they are gonna have to pay the vat.

SEPT 23 1989 wrote:

No point if you run a proper business

no I'm not buying for a business I just want a pickup (vw amarok) for my own use so I don't need to do vat returns ect

fergus1001

thanks for the input btw

fergus1001

any input would be Appreciated in case this one has gone down off the radar Bump ! :pac:

elperello

New or secondhand?

Do you have a business?

Kristopherus

Put a Wanted advert on Done Deal or Adverts

fergus1001

I'm buying second hand and just wondering are there any real issues with buying for cash ?

and no I don't have a business

SEPT 23 1989

fergus1001 wrote: »

I'm buying second hand and just wondering are there any real issues with buying for cash ?

and no I don't have a business

No

But get some sort of signed dated receipt to say you handed over the money

No point in you paying vat when you can't claim it back

rugbyman

fergus1001 wrote: »

I'm buying second hand and just wondering are there any real issues with buying for cash ?

and no I don't have a business

If a car registered trader sells to you for cash, HE has to account for VAT on the sale.thats his affair. If you mean van is on sale for ten K Euro plus VAT,its unlikely he could help you, other than say he sold it for less

Sleeper12

SEPT 23 1989 wrote:

No point in you paying vat when you can't claim it back

I had a commercial jeep. I bought it 2nd hand through my business and claimed the vat back. It was mentioned in my accounts every year. I sold it to my friend & I then had to say what I did with it in my accounts. I had show the sale & therefore I had to pay revenue VAT on the sale.

I don't understand how you think a VAT registered business can not charge you the VAT when they will have to pay the VAT to revenue. They can't just tell revenue that they gave a business assist away without being paid.

I think what you want is a non VAT registered business selling a commercial vehicle.

SEPT 23 1989

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

No

But get some sort of signed dated receipt to say you handed over the money

No point in you paying vat when you can't claim it back

I think you'll find you pay VAT on the vast majority of your purchases.

SEPT 23 1989

Augeo wrote: »

I think you'll find you pay VAT on the vast majority of your purchases.

You do

But larger purchases like a van what's the point paying it when you can claim it back

Op is not a business

SEPT 23 1989

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I had a commercial jeep. I bought it 2nd hand through my business and claimed the vat back. It was mentioned in my accounts every year. I sold it to my friend & I then had to say what I did with it in my accounts. I had show the sale & therefore I had to pay revenue VAT on the sale.

I don't understand how you think a VAT registered business can not charge you the VAT when they will have to pay the VAT to revenue. They can't just tell revenue that they gave a business assist away without being paid.

I think what you want is a non VAT registered business selling a commercial vehicle.

As was said that's the sellers issue

Man wants to pay cash

Sleeper12

It's not the sellers issue though because no one is selling VAT free. It's actually OP's issue. He came up with the idea but no one can explain how a business owner can do what he wants



Man can pay cash but he'll have to pay the VAT in cash too

My point is no business owner will sell VAT free purely because they will have to pay the VAT themselves.

I don't think OP realises how a business has to keep track of everything. I bought a Galaxy s8 sim free at the time of launch. I paid around 700 plus VAT and claimed the VAT back. It's an asset of the business. It will be listed in my accounts each year until I depose of it. If I sell it I will have to charge VAT even though its now 2nd hand.

If it were possible to sell a jeep VAT free do you not think everyone else would be doing it?

fergus1001

Sleeper12 wrote:

If it were possible to sell a jeep VAT free do you not think everyone else would be doing it?

well that's fair enough, I don't know how business's do their accounts so I'm just putting it out there to see if anyone else on here has any experience with that sort of thing

my issue as stated is that I cannot claim the Vat back as I'm not a sole trader or have a business/farm account to run it through

SEPT 23 1989

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

You do

But larger purchases like a van what's the point paying it when you can claim it back

Op is not a business

op is indeed not a business so he'll pay VAT & not be able to claim it back.

fergus1001

fergus1001 wrote: »

well that's fair enough, I don't know how business's do their accounts so I'm just putting it out there to see if anyone else on here has any experience with that sort of thing

my issue as stated is that I cannot claim the Vat back as I'm not a sole trader or have a business/farm account to run it through

Such is life unfortunately.

Edit: you post in farming and forestry - are you a farmer?

elperello

OP
You just need to find the right vehicle at the right price and do a deal.
Whether VAT is considered by the seller in his price won't matter to you.

What will matter is how you will manage insurance and motor tax.

Sleeper12

fergus1001 wrote:

well that's fair enough, I don't know how business's do their accounts so I'm just putting it out there to see if anyone else on here has any experience with that sort of thing

This is why I have replied to the thread. I do know how business accounts are done. If I have to account for a smartphone 4 years after I buy while selling it for 150 or 200 euro I can assure you that Revenue will will be on me like a ton of bricks if a jeep worth thousands just vanishes from my accounts. It could result in me getting a full audit.

Remember unlike most goods revenue knows who owns every vehicle in the county. They know when one is sold. They know the mileage because its on the annual DOE. They even have a good idea of the condition of the vehicle by looking at the last few DOEs & they also know what the market value should be. If I had a jeep worth 10k & sold it for 1k they'd know that I am trying to rip them off.

There are businesses where the turnover is below the VAT registration threshold and these wont charge you VAT however they will still want the market value so I can't see them taking 23 percent off VAT or no VAT


There is a slim chance that you might find someone going out of business & leaving the country who might be willing to do what you want. Anyone planning on staying in Ireland can't sell it without VAT as they will end up paying the VAT out of their own pocket.

As I said before if it was possible to do what you want wouldn't everyone be buying without the VAT?

fergus1001

Deleted User wrote:

Edit: you post in farming and forestry - are you a farmer?

no I'm a forester and on paye unfortunately

Rows Grower

It's not easy to tax a commercial vehicle unless you are registered, you might end up having to tax it privately but it could depend on what county you live in.

Sleeper12

fergus1001 wrote:

no I'm a forester and on paye unfortunately

Have you looked at importing from the UK? You'll still pay duty but a jeep might be cheaper there

fergus1001

Sleeper12 wrote:

As I said before if it was possible to do what you want wouldn't everyone be buying without the VAT?

I get what your saying but from my point of view I have no assurances that person x actually does account for vat and then just runs off with 23% extra free

fergus1001

Rows Grower wrote:

It's not easy to tax a commercial vehicle unless you are registered, you might end up having to tax it privately but it could depend on what county you live in.

ive checked it out even if i cant get the comercial rate of €333 it's only €710 to tax the vw amarok privately so it not as bad as someone trying to get a 3 litre jeep or something

fergus1001

Sleeper12 wrote:

Have you looked at importing from the UK? You'll still pay duty but a jeep might be cheaper there

fcukers want vat over there too :pac:

elperello

Rows Grower wrote: »

It's not easy to tax a commercial vehicle unless you are registered, you might end up having to tax it privately but it could depend on what county you live in.

This plus look up the requirements of your local authority to tax a commercial in your name for the first time.

Also go to an insurance broker and check up on insurance before you buy.

Turbohymac

Just buy your amorak from a private seller but make sure theres no finance outstanding from seller and also get written receipt for the amount of cash paid... personally I wouldn't bother with an amorak they look ok but unless it's very new with v6 engine the 2 liter is fairly weak and likes diesel.

Wildly Boaring

fergus1001 wrote: »

fcukers want vat over there too :pac:

Surprising amount non-VAT pickups in UK.

Lot of people drive Rangers or less so Amoraks for personal use.
The English like to have them for the dogs or camping or whatever.
Tax and insurance are responsible over there in them privately

Sleeper12

elperello wrote:

Also go to an insurance broker and check up on insurance before you buy.

Also a commercial policy is different to a private policy. When I changed from private to commercial you couldn't transfer your no claims bonus to commercial. I had to build up my full NCB again. Not sure if they still do it this way

Wildly Boaring

Wildly Boaring wrote: »

Surprising amount non-VAT pickups in UK.

Lot of people drive Rangers or less so Amoraks for personal use.
The English like to have them for the dogs or camping or whatever.
Tax and insurance are responsible over there in them privately

eg after 30 seconds......
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201810121429631?advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2012&maximum-mileage=125000&postcode=ox100dd&model=RANGER&page=1&make=FORD&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=Used

NI not England

Rows Grower

fergus1001 wrote: »

ive checked it out even if i cant get the comercial rate of €333 it's only €710 to tax the vw amarok privately so it not as bad as someone trying to get a 3 litre jeep or something

I can't see why you don't just buy one off donedeal or adverts.ie so.

fergus1001

Rows Grower wrote:

I can't see why you don't just buy one off donedeal or adverts.ie so.

well I am but I just wanted to sound out the Vat issue that's all