Cities around the world that are reducing car access

Sam Russell

I wonder if Philip Boucher Hayes has heard of the train, the bus, or the bike. Perhaps the e-scooter might solve most of the problems he cites.

Why do journalists go with the needs of the little old person with a wooden leg that must be accommodated in any solution to any problem? Most people are not little or old, and do not have a wooden leg. The few who fall into that category can be treated as an exception and get special treatment - the rest of us can just get on with life and live with the minor deprivations that result from the restrictions that having a car in a city mandates for the good of life in that city. We will walk the last km, we will get the train or bus as appropriate, and we will luxuriate in drinking that latte or cappuccino at the café table sited just where there used to be a car parked all day, and watch the world go by.

There used to be two way traffic jams in Grafton St, and two way traffic on the Quays. We appear to manage OK with one way, and soon just buses.

There used to be parking in the centre of O'Connell St where the tram now runs. How do we manage at all without that parking?

PBH - get on your bike.

magicbastarder

where does he mention old people in that thread?

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118882967#Comment_118882967

Poetic licence on my part.

He may not have, but most journalists take the worst edge case that could apply and extrapolate it as if it applies to everyone. It is a basic trick of both journalists and politicians to exaggerate a story and try to give that story extra gravitas and hopefully give it legs. It used to sell papers - now it generates clicks.

magicbastarder

i think you picked up the ball and ran with it there, onto a completely different pitch!

gjim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118883110#Comment_118883110

To be fair, I think you should be allowed a little leeway when responding to the special amount of stupid demonstrated by this Philip Boucher Hayes clown - reducing carbon emissions implies that "All of our cities are going to have to be rebuilt to allow people to live near their work and become essentially "non-motorised" 🙄

Peregrine

Philip is one of the good ones. He's very well informed on climate change.

Most of the tweet is a quote from the report:

Strategies for established cities to achieve large GHG emissions savings include efficiently improving, repurposing or retrofitting the building stock, targeted infilling, and supporting non-motorised (e.g., walking, bicycling) and public transport. Rapidly growing cities can avoid future emissions by co-locating jobs and housing to achieve compact urban form, and by leapfrogging or transitioning to low-emissions technologies.

gjim

How is he a good one? I quoted him verbatim - here is what he takes from the report:

'All of our cities are going to have to be rebuilt to allow people to live near their work and become essentially "non-motorised"'

That's a complete strawman he has constructed himself - there is no such "conclusion" presented in the report.

"Reality check - that's western governments saying on principle that there shouldn't be private cars in cities."

Here he comes - heroically demolishing the strawman. Implying the report is some sort of conspiracy to deprive motorists of the right to drive in cities.

These issues are completely unrelated. Cities are moving away from accommodating large amounts of private traffic in cities centres - because heavy traffic makes city life miserable for everyone else. This has been going on for decades at least - years before anyone cared about climate change. Grafton St wasn't pedestrianised to slow "climate change".

Sorry, he's clearly either stupid or disingenuous.

buffalo

Direct quote from the report:

Strategies for established cities to achieve large GHG emissions savings include efficiently improving, repurposing or retrofitting the building stock, targeted infilling, and supporting nonmotorised (e.g., walking, bicycling) and public transport. Rapidly growing cities can avoid future emissions by co-locating jobs and housing to achieve compact urban form, and by leapfrogging or transitioning to low-emissions technologies.

I don't think it's a strawman to phrase it as PBH has above.

Sam Russell

OK, lets look at cars in cities.

Why are buses so slow traversing the city? Because of cars blocking the road.

So how do we prioritise buses full of passengers over cars? We take some of the road and make it a bus lane.

Why does that not work? Because cars park in the bus lane or drive in the bus lane stopping the buses passing freely in their own space.

So why do the AGS not penalise those drivers/cars? They don't because they say its not their job.

So why don't Dublin Bus help enforce the bus lanes? Because AGS says its their job to enforce the law, not DB's.

Etc. etc. etc.

And that is before we look at parking. By the way, why are private cars allowed to park on the public road, or worse, on the footpath?

magicbastarder

i think you're preaching to the choir there!

gjim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118884279#Comment_118884279

We'll just have to disagree then. I don't think it is reasonable to summarize these suggestions as "All of our cities are going to have to be rebuilt".

p_haugh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118875293#Comment_118875293

Said update has been provided - the National Sustainable Mobility Policy released today mentions Camera enforcement (some other highlights mentioned within this thread too):

https://twitter.com/DublinCommuters/status/1512064601482883074?t=-qt4VXTvIMaAE2RP_g4v4w&s=19

cgcsb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118894427#Comment_118894427

Good that it's still on the radar but that's a vague enough 'update'. What exactly will be delivered in Q4 2022

Seth Brundle

To be honest, with Irish governments, you really need to treat these announccements with a large bag of salt. I'll believe the changes once I see them in place and actively enforced.

magicbastarder

yep, look at the latest announcement - legislation on e-scooters delayed till 2023.

cgcsb

Dublin Commuter Alliance seem to think that means that we'll see actual enforcement in Q4. I myself think it reads very ambiguous, it could be Q4 to send a few emails between the various state agencies involved. Hopefully they are right, if we had camera enforcement using bus mounted cameras, journey times could be slashed dramatically for nearly no investment. I do really hope it's true but won't hold my breath.

I note that the roll out of Bus Connects routes has completely stopped. At this rate the network review won't be done for 2025.

p_haugh

"I note that the roll out of Bus Connects routes has completely stopped. At this rate the network review won't be done for 2025."

Just to point out the updated rollout of bus connects, as posted by one of the mods in the Bus Connects thread in the Commuting & transport forum:

N4 & N6: January 2022 29 May

G spine, W4 & W6: June 2022 August 2022

Southside Orbitals: September 2022 November 2022

Luckily the latter two of this year's phases aren't delayed by that long, hopefully they don't get delayed further

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118897965#Comment_118897965

I'd agree with this.

The reason for the delay was insufficient drivers, and the covid outbreak over the past quarter has not helped in that regard.

But the ongoing recruitment drives by both companies should mean that we get back on track with the three phases this year.

I wouldn't be too concerned about it.

Zebra3

Only seeing this now.

Laughable if it wasn’t so funny.

Thousands upon thousands of people losing it over the removal of a tiny percentage of storage area for private cars.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/more-than-7-000-objections-to-shameful-revamp-of-lucan-village-1.4849430

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118918674#Comment_118918674

long may the pro car lobby continue to shoot themselves in the foot by being so extreme in their objections that it makes it easy for councillors to ignore them. I’d be much more worried if they were smarter, had any kind of strategy, and played the long game in a ‘lose the battle but win the war’ kind of way

but they don’t, so happy days

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118918883#Comment_118918883

Not so much a pro car lobby…

as a stop blocking use of cars until you have a fully working, efficient and effective public transport network…to replace the need for widespread car use.

a city in Germany, Karslruhe was mentioned by a poster a couple of pages back…

Population : 308,000

Size : 66.97 square miles

Public Transport -

7 tram lines

Intercity train lines ( multiple )

Funicular

Multiple bus routes.

how come Karlsruhe can have an efficient, effective, well run, wide reaching, cost effective and environmentally friendly solution to commuters needs yet here WE are, overpopulated, feck all in the way of wide reaching public transport to cater for us, a metro that’s taken over 15 years to plan and talk about yet not a shovel has broken soil yet…30 years (currently) from planning to working.

and people say in a city like Dublin, 117.8 km squared, shîte public transport.. “ here be leaving the cars at home !”

for many of us, use of cars every day is an absolute necessity. Not a comfort of luxury, or convenience..

provide me a way to get to x, y & z, effectively, efficiently and comfortably, I wont use a car.

I’ve lived in a city, Paris where the only car I was in was a taxi, 14 metro lines, 5 regional train lines, tram line(s) and buses..

305 metro stations…

Dublin… nada, but sure, give up your cars.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919079#Comment_118919079

Are you really trying to suggest that Lucan village does not have good public transport links?

Peregrine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919079#Comment_118919079

What are you saying? That we shouldn't remove 10 parking spaces from Lucan until we build seven tram lines?

Ben D Bus

What an absolutely bonkers rant over the removal of a handful of parking spaces for an improved public realm.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919306#Comment_118919306

not a bonkers rant, or any degree of ranting:) simply information and a view, if it doesn’t subscribe or correspond to your way of thinking, ok but maybe tone down the vitriol as well as the hyperbole just a tad as it won’t be all that helpful to the discussion…

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919079#Comment_118919079

A great display of whataboutery

Peregrine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919365#Comment_118919365

Sorry but you can't reply to the removal of 10 car parking spaces with this and ask others to tone down the hyperbole.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919079#Comment_118919079

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919079#Comment_118919079

That’s quite a jump you’re making there to “give up your cars”

cgcsb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118919079#Comment_118919079

If a new bus service was put in and it made lucan village bus only, the same lobby of people would also have kittens

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118920423#Comment_118920423

But it doesn't need really another route. Lucan Rd is served by the following routes: C3, C4, C5, C6, L54 (to Red Cow), X30, X31, X32.

The L52 travels between Adamstown & Blanch SC crossing the Liffey in Lucan village.

Plus there are other busses that pass close by e.g. Bus Eireann & private operators.

Adamstown train station is close by; Leixlip Confey is about 4km away