Doctored mileage/Clocked odometer on car I sold

crae

Hi,

I just sold my car that I have owned for three years.
The buyer discovered the odometer has been doctored, it's probably gone tens of thousands more miles then listed. (which would explain all issues I've had)

Guy now threatening to sue me (which from his point of view I get, I would be pissed too)

From my perspective though, I bought the car from a large dealer in good faith. The mileage is on the contract from when I bought it. And I sold it in good faith. I had no idea during the entire time I owned car that it was doctored. I trusted the dealer and never confirmed the mileage (didn't know how to)


Can buyer successfully sue me?
I've acted in good faith selling car with the information I had.
I did nothing wrong (not intentionally anyway) and had no idea odometer was clocked.

Should I contact Dealer or get solicitor of my own and sue Dealer?
Can I do that when I'm not in possession or own the car anymore?

I'm not from around here and not used to this 'suing culture' or solicitors.
Please, any advice would be helpful.

Private sale?
Dont think he can do anything ,its buyer beware.
should have checked before handing over the cash.

MetzgerMeister

Since it was a private sale, caveat emptor (buyer beware) applies. The person who bought the car from you has absolutely no come back once the deal has been done.

With regard to your course of action with the dealer, I don't think anyone here can tell you what to do. If you want to go ahead with something, discuss it with your solicitor but since the car is out of your possession and is no longer a problem for you my advice would be to forget about it. You needn't worry about anything the buyer says about suing you and they will learn the same in time.

DBB

Having been in a slightly similar position op, except I was the buyer of a clocked car from what turned out to be a dodgy dealer, the guards advised me that there must be reasonable evidence that the seller knowingly sells a car which has had it's odometer tampered with.
Even then, despite the guards and us collecting pretty conclusive evidence that this guy was routinely selling clocked cars, his defence was that his mechanic must have done it, he himself knew nothing of it... He was never prosecuted.
So, I'd imagine you're safe enough op.

Alkers

You haven't done anything wrong as you weren't aware of the issue when you sold the car.
You have no obligation to the new buyer but I would reply to them showing proof of the mileage on the contract when you bought it and offer to be a witness if they want to pursue the matter with the Garda or the previous seller?

bazz26

Something doesn't add up here.

OP, have you done a car history check on the car yourself to verify the claim that it has been clocked? I'd do that first in the event the buyer is telling lies and just changed their mind after buying it.

Regarding suing you, I'm not a solicitor but I'd doubt any half decent solicitor would take on such a case as they know it's a private sale where the buyer is not protected by the sales of goods act and the owness is on the buyer to have the car checked before buying. Plus I'd think the burden of proof would have to be with the buyer to prove that you knowly sold the car with altered mileage.

While I have sympathy with the buyer for getting stung like this, it really is up to them to do proper background checks before buying rather than afterwards especially when buying private. The cynic in me thinks that the buyer has had second thoughts about the car and now wants their money back so is blowing wind up your behind hoping that you will panic, give them their money back and be done with them. The threat of suing you just sounds like more of the same, getting you to panic and take the car back.

Unfortunately this is the downside of dealing with Joe Public, some want the advantages of buying privately to save money but still expect the same benefits and safety of being able to return it as if buying from a retailer.

crae

Never did a history check myself when I bought it, since I purchased from a major dealer and was given warranty on purchase.
I just trusted them. Also not from around here, so all of this works very differently in Sweden. Didn't really know what Motorcheck and so on was.

Car is a UK import, which I didn't know and car dealer didn't inform me on. (I found that out first time I did the NCT, the staff there told me)
I had no idea about UK imports and possible issues with this (as said, being from Sweden where we really don't see such issues)

But buyer found the old UK reg (don't know how, can this be done through vin/chassi number?) and if you check that reg. with the UK vehicle registration site it clearly shows that car has gone much further then the odometer says.

Feel sorry for the guy too. And feel bad, although I did nothing wrong. I'm an honest guy so it doesn't sit well with me.

I'm thinking either provide buyer with all details and scans of contract so he can take it further if he wants.
Or possible do a small claims complaint myself and if it gives me any money, reimburse the buyer somewhat.

But I guess I would be in same situation, I would need to prove that the Car Dealer knew it was clocked when they sold it to me.
Which would be impossible.

One would think it would be required for a Car Dealer to verify all this before selling a car?

bazz26

The old UK reg is listed on the vehicle registration certificate. It is also available on the report if you run a history check on the Irish registration.

I think the laws are different for car dealers. They are deemed experts in their field and cannot use the reason they didn't know as a defense. Again I'm not a legal expert so my opinion is not fact.

I'd seek some legal advice maybe via free advice through the Citizens Advice Bureau initially to see what your rights are. I'd imagine you may have recourse with the dealer you bought it from.

Zubeneschamali

bazz26 wrote: »

I'd imagine you may have recourse with the dealer you bought it from.

I wouldn't worry about it.

Tell the new owner that you bought it with the miles as shown, not your problem.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Don't waste your time doing anything, you have done nothing wrong and its up to the buyer to do whatever checks on the car before buying not afterwards.

Explain the story and that you have documents showing the mileage on the car when you bought it from a dealer. After that tell him to go away and that if he persists in calling or threatening legal action you will contact the Gardaí and report him for harassment.

Don't waste time or your money doing anything else, this is going no where.

ba_barabus

There's nothing for you to worry about.

Do you know the reg? Maybe someobe here can find out the UK reg for you. If so you can then check the old MOT certs to see what mileage was recorded.

I wouldn't worry about this at all.

Lantus

i wonder if the discrepancy is due to being a UK import and km mile mix up.

crae

Lantus wrote: »

i wonder if the discrepancy is due to being a UK import and km mile mix up.

Doubt that. Km is not used anywhere.
MOT was apparently recorded at 100000 miles in UK in 2013.
When I bought the car from Bill Griffin Motors in 2016 the odometer was at 80000 miles.
And contract also lists this, in miles.

So pretty sure guy that bought it from me is right. It was doctored/clocked.

Wish I knew how to check MOT before I bought it, would never have bought it otherwise.
I spent a lot of money fixing this car the last 2 years...
No wonder, when the car probably had gone 150000+, not the 80000 I was lead to believe...

Notch000

you have done nothing wrong and have enough evident to support that, i woudnet loose any sleep over it

ewj1978

So, Someone bought a car off you and then did the check when they owned the car and now wants recourse?
As has been said ignore the person. Yes you feel like a berk but you didn't clock it.


Number one rule of buying a car (unless its for 500-1000) do a history check.
If spending thousands on a vehicle don't cheap out and not check it for €30.