Dampness issue on new driveway paving

Akas

Last week I had the front driveway of my house brick paved; the job was finished on Friday.
The builder used the following layers:

Gravel --> Plastic (not membrane) --> 2 inch black sand --> 50mm brick
After laying all the bricks they were grouted with dry sand using a sweeping brush

There was heavy rain the following day (Saturday), followed by 3+ days of dry weather.
The bricks are still damp.

The builder says it will take time for things to settle and that, after a week, it should start drying quickly. He didn't give an explanation of how this might happen, so I'm obviously skeptical.

My best guess is that the problem is due to him not having used a proper permeable membrane, so there is nowhere for the water to go and just sits under the bricks, saturating the sand.

What are the simplest solutions to resolving the drying issue? I don't want to have to dig everything up and start again.

Lumen

What is the slope of the paving?

standardg60

The simplest option is to use something akin to a knitting needle that you can fit down between the blocks to puncture the membrane.
It definitely should have been permeable, the purpose of a plastic membrane is to stop moisture penetrating from underneath indoors but using it outdoors it simply acts as a sump. He clearly didn't understand this, or didn't care.

looksee

The builder is talking rubbish. What is going to happen in 'a week' that will alter the fact of the plastic holding water like a sump, as standard 60 has said. He did a cheapo, uninformed job and is now going to make excuses till you go away and stop annoying him.

Akas

Many thanks you guys all for the quick reply.

Moreover, slope of the paving looks OK which is towards the drain, but i did not see water flowing towards drain during rain, as the water was going down.

Also he used black sand under the brick without mixing cement as well the grout with only sand, no cement used at all other than edges of the paving.



Now the question is, since he is not welling to do it properly, is there any paving sealer we can use to seal upper surface?
If yes then how reliable it is?

It may be better if we puncture the plastic as standardg60 suggested and then apply paving sealer ?

Thanks again for all of your help.

Doop

I really dont think you will be able to seal the upper surface as you put it. I presume this is cobblelock? You wont be able to 'seal' the sand joints.

I would ask him for the product spec of the 'plastic' sheeting and review its application. I would also be asking him to come back and rectify or else head down small claims court. If you want to check the issue is still present get the hose out.

Personally I cant see any decent corrective action other than taking it up and replacing the membrane depending of course how bad the 'symptoms' are.

bizidea

Was there a reason he used plastic under the paving ive never seen it done.you never use cement with the sand when paving its always laid on compacted dry sand and then kiln dried sand brushed into the joints.

Lumen

bizidea wrote: »

Was there a reason he used plastic under the paving ive never seen it done.

Probably with the idea that it would stop weeds taking root. It's cheaper than proper landscaping fabric.

I have a load of black plastic in my own garden that I've been removing for the past couple of years. I'm sure it was put in with good intentions, the previous owner was very proud of it, but it's done nothing for the soil quality.

bizidea

Ive never seen membrane used under paving either tbh.the weeds will usually take hold between the paving bricks at the joints not from the sand bed underneath was the quality of the finish good bar the plastic underneath

Akas

He used plastic to control weeds, but he should be using proper membrane which let water to pass through.

Akas

.

Akas

Doop wrote: »

I really dont think you will be able to seal the upper surface as you put it. I presume this is cobblelock? You wont be able to 'seal' the sand joints.

I would ask him for the product spec of the 'plastic' sheeting and review its application. I would also be asking him to come back and rectify or else head down small claims court. If you want to check the issue is still present get the hose out.

Personally I cant see any decent corrective action other than taking it up and replacing the membrane depending of course how bad the 'symptoms' are.

Yes, redoing it properly is the long term correct solution only if he agree with me.
No experience with small claims court, however i would like to resolve this issue in friendly manner if possible.

Tefral

Akas wrote: »

Many thanks you guys all for the quick reply.

Moreover, slope of the paving looks OK which is towards the drain, but i did not see water flowing towards drain during rain, as the water was going down.

Also he used black sand under the brick without mixing cement as well the grout with only sand, no cement used at all other than edges of the paving.



Now the question is, since he is not welling to do it properly, is there any paving sealer we can use to seal upper surface?
If yes then how reliable it is?

It may be better if we puncture the plastic as standardg60 suggested and then apply paving sealer ?

Thanks again for all of your help.

The water wont flow towards the drain because the top of the drain is level with the surface finish and not the lower formation level where the water is now pooling.

Builders film / Plastic should not be used in this instance and to be honest will not help with stabilizing the install to the existing surface as it will form a separation layer.

There was no need to lay plastic and no need to lay a terram layer either (a woven layer that is water permeable) as weeds will take hold in the sand layer in the joints anyway.

The quick fix solution is to go around puncturing the layer every 200-300mm.

have you paid the guy in full? If not get him to do it for you before you settle up.

Akas

Tefral wrote: »

The water wont flow towards the drain because the top of the drain is level with the surface finish and not the lower formation level where the water is now pooling.

Builders film / Plastic should not be used in this instance and to be honest will not help with stabilizing the install to the existing surface as it will form a separation layer.

There was no need to lay plastic and no need to lay a terram layer either (a woven layer that is water permeable) as weeds will take hold in the sand layer in the joints anyway.

The quick fix solution is to go around puncturing the layer every 200-300mm.

have you paid the guy in full? If not get him to do it for you before you settle up.

Yes, paid full in cash during the job and got receipts.
Now i need to think what should i use to puncture the plastic layer

Tefral

Akas wrote: »

Yes, paid full in cash during the job and got receipts.
Now i need to think what should i use to puncture the plastic layer

If you have a drill get a long 6mm bit in your local builders merchant like mcmahons or buckleys. you can get a 300mm long bit so your back isnt broken for about 7 euro.

Akas

Just an update, yesterday we replaced plastic with membrane by removing every fourth line of the paving.
Applied grout with cement on repaired lines.
I hope it will fix the issue, if not then i am going to give up as i paid 150e to same builder to fix his created issue.