My hard line stance causing issues?

LegacyUser

This has been swishing around my head for weeks and I need to get it out somewhere and I suppose see if I am being unreasonable to be so unwavering in my stance.

A relative of my other half has autism and has twice(that we know of) touched a child inappropriately. The relative is an adult but not by much. This relative forged a relationship with my child due to a common interest(my child isn't a teen yet) and spent time alone with them(this was obviously before I knew what happened). I asked my child if anything inappropriate happened and my child insists not. I should mention that my child also has ASD and is very easily influenced and looked up to this person because of their skill in the above mentioned shared hobby. I feel sick that I let this person have access to my child and have made it very clear to my husband that this is never going to happen again. That all contact between them is over and that is that.

Due to my own experiences for me, there are no excuses, there are no more chances, I am done with this person.

My husband is not happy with this, he feels that it will effect our childs relationship with the rest of his family if we stick to no contact. His family are going down the as he has autism he needs help and support route and that is fine if they want to do that but I feel like my childs safety comes first to me. The whole thing turns my stomach, the thought that he could even look at a child that way. I just can't be around him or let my child be around him again. I know for a fact that the person knows when he did it the first time that it was wrong, yet they did it again.

I feel like I am normally a compassionate person but I just can't 'do' this situation. I can't support the person in getting help and I can't allow my child be near them. Am I in the wrong? Should I be more understanding because of this persons disability? I'm angry and confused and I don't want to be the one to drive a wedge in my partners family relationships but I don't feel I can get past this.

I suppose I am just looking for impartial views on this because I feel like I am too close and too protective of my child to see the wood for the trees. Thanks.

sReq | uTeK

There is not a hope in hell i would allow any adult be it with a disability or not near my child without my supervision if said person has already sexually assaulted twice before.

You mention he’s getting support for his disability, has it been reported what he’s done and is he getting help for that?

December2012

Your job is to protect your child.

End of.

I would do the exact same on.yoir situation.

A disability is not an excuse for sexual.assault.

Flippyfloppy

Can I recommend a great kids book for this kind of thing, you may have it already, it’s called ‘my underpants rule!’ It’s a really great way of explaining what’s appropriate and what’s not.

And no, you’re dead right!! Abuse can happen in the blink of an eye.

LegacyUser

sReq | uTeK wrote: »

There is not a hope in hell i would allow any adult be it with a disability or not near my child without my supervision if said person has already sexually assaulted twice before.

You mention he’s getting support for his disability, has it been reported what he’s done and is he getting help for that?

He is seeing an organisation about what he's done in an attempt to 'rehabilitate' him.

Thanks for the replies. I am glad others agree with me. I wasn't sure because I feel so angry and disgusted if I was being too dramatic. Just the thought of them looking at my child turns my stomach right now and I can't do it.

I feel so guilty for giving them access to my child in the first place, I thought it was nice for my kid to have someone they look up to and share an interest with esp because my child finds it hard to fit in with their peers because of their asd. I felt like my guilt might be colouring my view of the situation.

It's unfortunate that it will impact my child relationship with the rest of the wider family(for reasons that are too long to into it would be difficult to see grandparents etc and not the abuser too) but I feel like my childs safety has to come first.

The abuser knew that what they did the first time was wrong and either they didn't care and did it again or they couldn't help them self and did it again, either way it doesn't feel safe for my child to be in contact with them.

LegacyUser

OP, you absolutely need to take a hard line stance. This is your child's physical safety you're talking about, not to mention his/her emotional and mental health. I think most people would do as you've done. Don't bow to pressure from your husband or other family members. This is far too serious an issue.

I would say that you should also report the incident to Tusla or some agency. This relative is a risk for other children and he needs someone to intervene. Other children need to be protected as they might not have a vigilant mother like you.

Disability is not an excuse to sexually abuse others.

khaldrogo

OP, just imagine for a second that you let your husband convince you to allow contact and then an assault happens. It's too late then. You would be so angry at yourself and him. You are 100% in the right imo and I would do the same thing.

tcif

SensitiveTopic wrote: »

Am I in the wrong? Should I be more understanding because of this persons disability?

No and no. This is gone beyond a question of being understanding of the other persons disability, you know there's a danger here now and you can't ignore that. Your priority is to protect your child and the best way to do that is to ensure there is no contact so there is no opportunity. I'd do exactly the same in your shoes.

ManOfMystery

I totally agree with and support your stance.

Your first responsibility - that takes priority over all else - is to protect your child's safety. This means not allowing them to be in the vicinity (alone or otherwise) of an adult who has touched a child inappropriately before - not just once, but at least twice.

All other concerns such as maintaining a family relationship or allowing your child to explore this hobby, etc - they are all secondary to their safety. And to be frank, the idea of determining if their abnormal sexual urges are down to a perverted mind or are caused by a disability is really irrelevant to you - you hold no responsibility to that person, only to your child. 

I can fully understand that your partner's family will have emotional ties to this person and will make more allowances for their behaviour, but they are going to have to accept that others will not share that viewpoint and the person's toxic behaviour cannot be accepted by everyone because of their disability. They will have to get over that.

ManOfMystery

duplicate sorry

Neyite

His family are going down the as he has autism he needs help and support route and that is fine if they want to do that but I feel like my childs safety comes first to me.

I'm not understanding your husband's stance here at all. It's not an either/or situation. Both of these things can happen, and the adult does not need unsupervised access to your child in order to feel "supported". What help and support is your husband thinking will apply here? Professional help from experts or Tusla, or is it more of a "ah, shure he doesn't know what he's doing" type of a fob off. Ask your husband if his relative does this to someone's child who would be willing to go to Gardai, how that relative will fare in jail or with a custodial sentence. So yes he needs help, but there's no logic in continuing with situations where he may succumb to temptation - for either the vulnerable adult or the vulnerable child. You have two vulnerable people. For a very valid reason, it's necessary that the contact be minimised and if then well supervised at all times.



I'm on your side, but tbh, I'll admit that I am biased. I was abused as a child by a disabled relative and he was treated differently than an able bodied abuser would have been - no action was taken, no Gardai report. What happened to me, his disability made no odds to that, but the aftermath actually did more damage because it was like the adults around me all saying that what I experienced wasn't as important as pandering to someone who used his disability as an excuse. That's what I had to address in counselling as an adult, not the actual abuse incidents themselves. I'll be honest and say that I don't think I'll ever fully forgive my parents & GP for deciding it wasn't worth pursuing and for not acknowledging my trauma, and I'm in my forties now. Abuse can't be undone, it becomes part of you that you learn to live with. Like a childhood incident that leaves a permanent scar. so I hope you get through to your husband on this.

LegacyUser

Neyite wrote: »

I'm not understanding your husband's stance here at all. It's not an either/or situation. Both of these things can happen, and the adult does not need unsupervised access to your child in order to feel "supported". What help and support is your husband thinking will apply here? Professional help from experts or Tusla, or is it more of a "ah, shure he doesn't know what he's doing" type of a fob off. Ask your husband if his relative does this to someone's child who would be willing to go to Gardai, how that relative will fare in jail or with a custodial sentence. So yes he needs help, but there's no logic in continuing with situations where he may succumb to temptation - for either the vulnerable adult or the vulnerable child. You have two vulnerable people. For a very valid reason, it's necessary that the contact be minimised and if then well supervised at all times.



I'm on your side, but tbh, I'll admit that I am biased. I was abused as a child by a disabled relative and he was treated differently than an able bodied abuser would have been - no action was taken, no Gardai report. What happened to me, his disability made no odds to that, but the aftermath actually did more damage because it was like the adults around me all saying that what I experienced wasn't as important as pandering to someone who used his disability as an excuse. That's what I had to address in counselling as an adult, not the actual abuse incidents themselves. I'll be honest and say that I don't think I'll ever fully forgive my parents & GP for deciding it wasn't worth pursuing and for not acknowledging my trauma, and I'm in my forties now. Abuse can't be undone, it becomes part of you that you learn to live with. Like a childhood incident that leaves a permanent scar. so I hope you get through to your husband on this.

I'm sorry to hear of your experience and the scars it has left you with.

He is receiving professional help from experts but honestly I am dubious about how successful it will be. He has a habit of agreeing with everything said but ultimately ignoring everything. He lied to cover up what he did the first time to gain sympathy and support from dhs family to the point everyone thought he was a victim and were bending over backwards to help him. I feel angry and betrayed, that I was lied to and allowed him access to my son without the full knowledge of what he did.

I think that is where the problem lies, I am angry at the abuser, I see the lies he told, all for his own gain and I struggle to see him as a vulnerable one in this situation. I don't agree with the tiptoeing around him so as not to hurt his feelings that his family seem to be doing. Without going into years of backstory I feel like this tiptoeing which has been going on for years in various guises is partly what has led to this situation in the first place. Basically I don't agree with any of it and I know of I am around them I will say this, when I feel strongly about something like this I speak up and that will cause problems for my husband so I am avoiding them.

To complicate the situation further and maybe it is something I should have mentioned in my OP but I didn't really want to, my husband also has ASD and finds these situations incredibly difficult to deal with so I am usually the one who when the going gets tough takes the lead and guides him. This has never in the past had to go against his family(who in the main I really like) but now he feels like he is torn between me and our family and his family and he can't deal with it properly and I can't be the one who takes the lead on this. My feelings are too strong against the abuser for me to be able to mediate the situation properly.

Ugh that was a brain dump and I am not even sure it makes sense but I feel like this is all on me, if my husband falls out with his family it is on me because I usually help him through these things but can't with this. At the same time I can't let my child anywhere near this person, I don't trust him, I ignored my instincts in the first place based off my dhs family and I'm not doing it again. I see no other way than to fall out with his family because they will think that by refusing to have my kid around the abuser I am insinuating that he is some kind of monster and hurting the abusers feeling making me some kind of monster.

LegacyUser

I just wanted to add thanks for all the replies. Being able to talk about it is helping, I feel like it isn't something I can talk about in real life so even just getting what I am feeling about it all down in words makes me feel more able to handle it.

TheBoyConor

You are 100% right.

The relation is a pedophile and is a danger to children.

Also have you reported this to Garda and Tusla? If not why not?

While you might keep your child safe, what about other children that the relation might come into contact with?
How would you feel if in a years time you heard that the guy went on to abuse other children because you failed to act and report?

Also, you are aware that child sex abuse has taken place - you are now legally obliged to report it to authorities so they can take action to prevent future occurrences. If you fail to report it you a breaking the law.

Don't fall into the trap of Ireland's past culture of silence and smother and brush this abuse under the carpet so long as your child isn't affected.

This abuser deserves what may come to him from the force of law, as do his parents and anyone else who enables him through their flippancy, excuse making and lack of action.

LegacyUser

TheBoyConor wrote: »

You are 100% right.

The relation is a pedophile and is a danger to children.

Also have you reported this to Garda and Tusla? If not why not?

While you might keep your child safe, what about other children that the relation might come into contact with?
How would you feel if in a years time you heard that the guy went on to abuse other children because you failed to act and report?

Also, you are aware that child sex abuse has taken place - you are now legally obliged to report it to authorities so they can take action to prevent future occurrences. If you fail to report it you a breaking the law.

Don't fall into the trap of Ireland's past culture of silence and smother and brush this abuse under the carpet so long as your child isn't affected.

This abuser deserves what may come to him from the force of law, as do his parents and anyone else who enables him through their flippancy, excuse making and lack of action.

It has been reported to Tusla and a decision was being made about whether or not there would be Garda involvement by the professionals. I only have hazy info on that as I am not part of these meetings but people have been notified and like I said he is getting help from a professional service that deals with abusers, I believe he was referred there by Tusla but am not 100% on this.

tcif

If your husbands family are in the habit of rallying around this relative to protect him from the consequences of his actions (to the detriment of the children he hurts) then I don't see what choice you have but to keep your child away from him. If it was me, I wouldn't even consider any kind of supervised meeting (in a family group etc.) because any kind of friendship involves a bond and trust and that is not something I'd want any child of mine to have with someone capable of hurting them. If it's already there I'd be looking to sever it completely and as quickly as possible.

I'm sorry you don't have more support from your husband on this (though I understand you say he has his own issues here) because it's all the harder to take on the wider family by yourself but stay strong. You're doing right by your child.

RhubarbCrumble

OP, you are absolutely 100% correct in what you are doing. Not a hope in hell should that person be allowed near your child.

December2012

Basically I don't agree with any of it and I know of I am around them I will say this, when I feel strongly about something like this I speak up and that will cause problems for my husband so I am avoiding them.

You have not caused any problem. The abuser caused the problem.

Not you. No way. Not ever

shesty

No keep your child away from them. If your husband has ASD I can see how he has difficulty dealing, but no - they should not be near your child. A disability is not an excuse. Have kids myself - if it was me, no I would be doing everything to keep the child away from this person. You are doing nothing wrong.

Rubberchikken

The childs safety is the important thing.
Yes feelings can be hurt. Yes this adult has special needs and is a relation but nothing comes before the kids safety imo.
When or if sonething happens you cant go back and undo it.

LegacyUser

Thanks for your your replies. I've been thinking about it all day and I've decided I'm going with my gut and not allowing my child any contact, supervised or not. As you can imagine with a child and husband with ASD I have a lot on my plate mentally and emotionally and I can't take this on board too. Because when the going gets tough at home I have to fix everything it's kind of my default setting to try and placate everyone and to fix things but this isn't my responsibility to fix, like December said I didn't cause this the abuser did.

I know this will effect my childs relationship with that side of the family, I know it will effect my husbands relationship with his family but I think I am past caring at this stage. All I do is care, for my husband, for my kid and I'm exhausted by it. It's my job to keep my kid safe and this is the best way I know how, I know my husband will understand it eventually I just have to repeat my point of view calmly and make it clear to him that he is more than welcome to maintain a relationship with his family it will just have to be in a different way than before.

LegacyUser

Boards user going anon here. I was sexually abused by my intellectually disabled uncle when I was a child. When my mother found out what was going on, she stopped me spending time alone with him and it never happened again. Nothing ever was done about him because nobody in the family wanted to upset his frail mother. I went to a counselor earlier this year over an unrelated matter and for some reason blurted out that my uncle had abused me. She said "I was waiting for you to tell me that". I'm pleased to see that you are putting your child first. It is 100% the right thing to do. I wish you all the very best. You sound like a great mum.

RhubarbCrumble

Just read your update OP. Please be assured that you're doing exactly the right thing.
Your child comes first above all else.

seamus

I had thought initially from how vague your OP was that perhaps if the relation was quite disabled and incapable of understanding, that supervised interaction could be tolerated without exposing anyone to danger.

But given your later updates, no way. Even if this relative is still incapable of understanding, you describe him as more than clever enough to be a danger to your son.

Unfortunately sometimes a line has to be drawn, things can't be tolerated in the name of family bliss. Given that your husband has ASD himself, is it possible for you to take the lead on it, without damaging the family relationship? If they know he has difficulty dealing with it, then direct communication from you may help ensure that the right message gets across?

Ghekko

Not much to add only that I too agree you are 100% right in the way you are dealing with this awful situation. Your husband can still visit his relatives and if there are larger family gatherings perhaps you may attend if you ever feel the need, but the close contact between your child and this relative needs to stop. You don't need to get into any major discussion with family members over it but if anyone questions why your son isn't visiting let them know its inappropriate from now on. If anyone of them has a go at you, lead them here to see the overwhelming support you have for your decision.

Neyite

Would it be of benefit if your husband heard it from an official source to keep your son away from relative - say a social worker or counsellor who has experience in cases of child sexual abuse?



That might be an avenue worth exploring though I admit I'm not sure how I'd go about that, maybe by ringing Tusla initially?

OscarMIlde

SensitiveTopic wrote: »

He is seeing an organisation about what he's done in an attempt to 'rehabilitate' him.

Thanks for the replies. I am glad others agree with me. I wasn't sure because I feel so angry and disgusted if I was being too dramatic. Just the thought of them looking at my child turns my stomach right now and I can't do it.

I feel so guilty for giving them access to my child in the first place, I thought it was nice for my kid to have someone they look up to and share an interest with esp because my child finds it hard to fit in with their peers because of their asd. I felt like my guilt might be colouring my view of the situation.

It's unfortunate that it will impact my child relationship with the rest of the wider family(for reasons that are too long to into it would be difficult to see grandparents etc and not the abuser too) but I feel like my childs safety has to come first.

The abuser knew that what they did the first time was wrong and either they didn't care and did it again or they couldn't help them self and did it again, either way it doesn't feel safe for my child to be in contact with them.

You are absolutely doing the right thing, if your husbands family don't understand than they are enabling an abuser. They should be the ones acting to keep them from interacting with other children!

Also, not to be paranoid, but I take it the ASD family member is very high functioning. I have yet to meet an autistic person who has the guile to deliberately manipulate others. The fact that the inappropriate touching was done away from prying eyes shows an awareness that is generally lacking in autistic people. I have a lot of experience with autistic people as my brother is autistic and I have been around autism support networks my entire life. I wonder if some other issue has been misdiagnosed as autism.