Gatwick Plan to Operate Second Runway

Jamie2k9

LGW on Thursday will publish its draft master plan which has plans to operate the current second or emergency runway for smaller short haul aircraft potentially delivering 30% capacity increase from 2023 provided CAA give approval.

Would have taught all options would have been explored before now.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gatwick-wings-it-with-new-stealth-runway-2pmjf87rm

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castie

There was an agreement in place that they wouldn't do this for a set period of time and that expires I think.

Previously as well there were safety issues which they think newer technology will get them past so that they can use both runways at the same time.

http://www.airportwatch.org.uk/2018/01/gatwick-cannot-use-its-emergency-runway-too-close-to-main-runway-for-extra-flights-without-new-planning-permission/

Link has alot of the detail on the legal agreement ending in 2019.

goingnowhere

I imagine its a bit like TXL in Berlin.

Aircraft lands, once its visually confirmed to be stopping clear aircraft to depart on the other runways that happens pretty much when the tower sees the spoilers go up

After very brief hold to allow the other aircraft to take off the arriving aircraft crosses the second runway to the gate

jjbrien

goingnowhere wrote: »

I imagine its a bit like TXL in Berlin.

Aircraft lands, once its visually confirmed to be stopping clear aircraft to depart on the other runways that happens pretty much when the tower sees the spoilers go up

After very brief hold to allow the other aircraft to take off the arriving aircraft crosses the second runway to the gate

Same thing has been going on at EWR for years aircraft lands runway 4R then one takes off 4L.

I always wondered why Gatwick never used the 2nd runway now I know now. Its a good move by the Gatwick managers.

castie

goingnowhere wrote: »

I imagine its a bit like TXL in Berlin.

Aircraft lands, once its visually confirmed to be stopping clear aircraft to depart on the other runways that happens pretty much when the tower sees the spoilers go up

After very brief hold to allow the other aircraft to take off the arriving aircraft crosses the second runway to the gate

The sticking point is the distance between them.
TXL has 250m where as LGW has 198m.

In saying that I don't quite understand what the issue is, they use it as a taxiway at the moment.

The only difference I can see is that the runway doesn't have ILS, maybe because of the closeness of the runways they couldn't previously?
Hopefully someone more knowledgeable can shed some light.

Charlie-Bravo

Could there be a wake turbulence issue with the proximity of the parallel runways being so close together?

Chris_5339762

The second runway was used a few months (a year?) ago but I can't remember why. Good if they can pull it off though.

castie

Looks like 210 is the minimum separation and they are going to spend 500 million to expand it to make the centre line distances 210 exactly.

Chris_5339762

A good call, if it works. Get a second runway probably faster than Heathrows third for a fraction of the price.

BeardySi

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

A good call, if it works. Get a second runway probably faster than Heathrows third for a fraction of the price.

Especially considering they already have one...

Chris_5339762

Well yes thats what I mean. Its just functionally useless and may as well not exist until they do this work and its a very very neat solution to the problem if they can pull it off.

castie

The people campaigning against the second runway are very pissed off at this.

They thought they had won with Heathrow winning and then they get slapped in the face.

Will need planning permission so not a sure thing yet.

Davidth88

When I was a spotter in the 80s I remember them building the north terminal . We were all amazed because it was the only obvious place to build a second runway. Of course they have had the taxiway that can operate as a runway . I assume it's this that people are talking about.

kevinandrew

Good luck to them. It makes sense for Gatwick to take advantage of Heathrow's woes but sadly it will always be the second choice option until Heathrow is completely crippled. 

The list of new airlines that originally choose Gatwick only to move into Heathrow once capacity become available grows longer every year, it's the natural hub, it's where the yield is and it's fully integrated into London itself via transport and business links. Gatwick converting a taxiway isn't going to change that anytime soon. 

Gatwick promoted itself as the natural place for new runway capacity in the south east, it used the tagline "Gatwick, Obviously" during the campaign but that couldn't be further from the truth.

HTCOne

astrofluff wrote: »

Could there be a wake turbulence issue with the proximity of the parallel runways being so close together?

Only in the event of a go around, in which case there would be a resulting delay in issuing of takeoff clearance to the departure.

Chris_5339762

Yeah I imagine they won't get 100% of the potential capacity of the second runway, taxiing across the first runway to get to the second which would reduce it further, but even if they got 50 - 60% out of it initially it would be worth the money. And they could probably get that to 75% once they optimise their procedures. Pure conjecture on the numbers, but just an idea.

trellheim

I use LGW wherever possible as a price/ontime performance/number of flights per day/ease of getting through/ease of getting into Central London cheaply ( much cheaper via Thameslink especially if you want to get to Farringdon/City) it beats all the other airports bar LCY hands down and LCY is far too unreliable to be worth it for business

of the six London Airports

LHR - too expensive and too far out but if your destination is reading or west london its OK
LTN - lol
STN - Kip and a shed very crowded and appallingly bad in summer
LCY - overcrowded full of delays and usually expensive
SEN - needs to fix the transport links and stop with the incompetence its a circus out there. When it works it is just about bearable to Liverpool st
LGW - excellent

Chris_5339762

I'd agree.

LHR: May have to become my airport of choice soon, sadly
LTN: Get out of it
STN: Worst airport in the western hemisphere, awful. The absolute definition of an old-skool Ryanair airport
LCY: Wonderfully located but full of delays and the merest whiff of fog closes it completely
SEN: Never flown into it
LGW: 33 minutes from London Bridge with Thameslink, about 30 from Victoria with Southern. Generally very well run, extremely efficient security. My favourite airport probably

deconduo

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I'd agree.

LHR: May have to become my airport of choice soon, sadly
LTN: Get out of it
STN: Worst airport in the western hemisphere, awful. The absolute definition of an old-skool Ryanair airport
LCY: Wonderfully located but full of delays and the merest whiff of fog closes it completely
SEN: Never flown into it
LGW: 33 minutes from London Bridge with Thameslink, about 30 from Victoria with Southern. Generally very well run, extremely efficient security. My favourite airport probably

Yup Gatwick is pretty great for getting into London. I do a lot of work around Blackfriars/Holburn so the Thameslink is perfect. My only complaint is that the flights back from Gatwick to Dublin are almost always delayed by 30-45min (whereas I find LHR a lot more punctual)

Usually no issues on the inbound flights though.

Locker10a

deconduo wrote: »

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I'd agree.

LHR: May have to become my airport of choice soon, sadly
LTN: Get out of it
STN: Worst airport in the western hemisphere, awful. The absolute definition of an old-skool Ryanair airport
LCY: Wonderfully located but full of delays and the merest whiff of fog closes it completely
SEN: Never flown into it
LGW: 33 minutes from London Bridge with Thameslink, about 30 from Victoria with Southern. Generally very well run, extremely efficient security. My favourite airport probably

Yup Gatwick is pretty great for getting into London. I do a lot of work around Blackfriars/Holburn so the Thameslink is perfect. My only complaint is that the flights back from Gatwick to Dublin are almost always delayed by 30-45min (whereas I find LHR a lot more punctual)

Usually no issues on the inbound flights though.

Gatwick has a huge runway congestion issue, The amount of traffic they move it’s very impressive but there is a lot of congestion