I think I messed up my chances with a girl

LegacyUser

I was had coffee with a girl from work recently and I think I ruined my chances with her. Its not so much anything I said but during the date I think I failed a test. She basically eyeballed the **** out of me and I just couldn't hold my nerve and not look away submissively. The problem is I am quite insecure I used to be very overweight and with very little dating experience so I'm only starting to work on myself now. The other issue is that I really like this girl and if it had been a girl I had just met I wouldn't have had been so submissive or shy. Can anyone offer some advice on how to possibly retrieve the situation. I do realise putting all my eggs in 1 basket with this one girl is not healthy

Big Bag of Chips

??
I don't get it. You went for coffee with a work colleague and she eyeballed you? That in itself is strange behaviour from her. But then for you to feel that it was somehow a test that you failed by being submissive is strange too.

I don't know if you two had a relationship budding or what, but at this point it shouldn't be hard and there certainly shouldn't be any weird mind games going on.

I don't know if you blew it, but if that's the way she goes about things maybe it's better to view it as a lucky escape before the crazy got crazier.

Arrival

You are way overthinking this, like this is honestly wild

K_P

Arrival wrote: »

You are way overthinking this, like this is honestly wild

I agree, this is one of the stranger issues I’ve seen on PI. I have literally never heard of a woman - myself, a friend, even anecdotally - staring down a date as some kind of submission test. It sounds more like training a dog than a date!

Either she’s an absolute head-case in which case you’re well rid. Or (more likely) you misinterpreted the situation. If everything else was fine and you still like her then ask her out again.

Faith

I’m thinking the OP has been reading some Red Pill/PUA nonsense about men dominating women through various techniques and not appearing “beta” or “submissive”. The thing about that is, it’s only men who read it, OP - not women. If your date was maintaining an inappropriate level of eye contact, then that’s all about her and nothing to do with you. Unless you stared at the floor for the whole time, then I’m sure you didn’t mess up.

Equally, if your plan to seduce her was to maintain an inappropriate level of eye contact yourself, then that would have been really weird (if that’s one of the “techniques”, I don’t know much about PUA because it’s in the same camp as homeopathy to me).

If the date went well otherwise, ask her out again! Treat her like a normal person and don’t worry about being “submissive”. You’re her equal and she’s your equal. Unless you’re both into BDSM or other role-playing clearly agreed by both partners, there’s no dominant or submissive in a healthy relationship.

seamus

What Faith says.

OP, don't treat it like a game, don't treat women like simpletons that you think you can manipulate with body language.

The women you meet aren't playing whatever game you think they are. Whatever you have read on the internet about this submissive/test stuff was written by con artists to extract money from men with low self-confidence and poor social skills. It's not real and it doesn't work.

There is no game. Keep reminding yourself of that. Talk to women like you're talking to another man. "Be yourself" is the advice that's as old as time and the only thing that works. Sure, you can pretend to be somebody else, but that'll attract people who like somebody else, not you.

NightStone

You will be fine.
There is a ton of women out there .
You just need more confidence next time .
Don't take anything as a failure but an expierence to learn and grow. You already made up your mind what you think you did wrong with the eye contact I'm not saying your right or wrong and neither should others they were not there . However if you feel that was where it feel down next time ( and there will be lots of next time ) remember this and try and change your tack . Use everything to learn and as hard as it can be always be you.

LegacyUser

It doesn't read like you did anything wrong and if you really liked her why not ask her out again?

We've all put our eggs in the one basket, if it doesn't work out for you this time then there will be a next time.

gossamer

Faith wrote: »

I’m thinking the OP has been reading some Red Pill/PUA nonsense about men dominating women through various techniques and not appearing “beta” or “submissive”. The thing about that is, it’s only men who read it, OP - not women. If your date was maintaining an inappropriate level of eye contact, then that’s all about her and nothing to do with you. Unless you stared at the floor for the whole time, then I’m sure you didn’t mess up.

Equally, if your plan to seduce her was to maintain an inappropriate level of eye contact yourself, then that would have been really weird (if that’s one of the “techniques”, I don’t know much about PUA because it’s in the same camp as homeopathy to me).

If the date went well otherwise, ask her out again! Treat her like a normal person and don’t worry about being “submissive”. You’re her equal and she’s your equal. Unless you’re both into BDSM or other role-playing clearly agreed by both partners, there’s no dominant or submissive in a healthy relationship.

Not so much, there's quite a few dating coaches for women using a similar style and approach nowadays, who are racking up a whole lot of views on YouTube and the likes. I don't necessarily agree with what's being taught, but there's a demand for it and it's a business that makes money.

To the OP - I can't think why she was "eyeballing" you, maybe it was all in your head. Especially if you're quite socially anxious and hyper aware of any signs of prospective rejection. My own advice is to drawback and let her come to you. If she's interested, she will. If not, she won't. In any case, it's no great loss. Relax, she's not the only woman who will take your fancy. Plenty more where that came. It's cliched, but it's true.

Jay Pentatonic

chancesruined2018 wrote: »

I do realise putting all my eggs in 1 basket with this one girl is not healthy

OP, this is a good observation. I can't say for certain, but yes maybe you have put all your eggs in one basket. And if so, who cares if this hasn't worked out. Move on.

Please don't see every 1st date as the potential of a full-on relationship. That approach is just putting too much pressure on yourself, and also leads to silly thoughts (like about eye contact!) determining whether or not this will "work"

Dates are just dates. The 2 of you are basically just sussing out if there's any spark. And if there is, then cool! Arrange a 2nd date. If there's no spark, then there's no panic. You're not the only person in the world who's had a slightly awkward date or 2.

Relax, take the pressure off yourself and just have fun and enjoy the dating scene.

Also, this is just my own opinion now, but dating people from work can be a sketchy idea! Maybe not do that next time!

B0jangles

'Yay, PUA guy is here!' (a thing no-one has ever said with a straight face btw)
(Edit: this first line was in reference to a now deleted post, not any kind of reference to the OP )

OP, honestly ask yourself - the kind of guys who recommend all this alpha/beta stuff with demonstrating dominince via eye contact and passing various tests want to you believe two things:

A.) Women are relentless, lifelong manipulators who are testing you literally all the time and can spot even a flicker of self-doubt.
B.) These same master manipulators can be conned by a few basic psychological tricks that wouldn't fool a budgie.

It makes zero sense, even if you actually take them at their own word.

Women aren't another species, we're just people like you - some are nice, others are nasty; that's pretty much it. If this girl was trying to stare you down, she sounds a bit weird, but she probably wasn't actually testing you like you think. I know it's much easier to say than to do, but try not to overthink interactions like this and just enjoy the flow of conversation.

kylith

chancesruined2018 wrote: »

She basically eyeballed the **** out of me

This is a sign of a weirdo, or at least of a very rude person. Unless you had just said something that would have someone looking askance at you.

chancesruined2018 wrote: »

and I just couldn't hold my nerve

You and everyone else who's ever been at a table wondering 'why is this weirdo staring at me?'

chancesruined2018 wrote: »

and not look away submissively.

This is a sign of someone who has been spending too much time on the wrong sort of message board. Along with others, OP, I find myself wondering if you have been reading some PUA bullcrap, because this is the only way I can comprehend you having come up with this 'test/submission' nonsense. You looked away from someone who was staring rudely at you. This is a totally normal reaction to a totally abnormal level of eye contact.

Dial Hard

kylith wrote:

You looked away from someone who was staring rudely at you. This is a totally normal reaction to a totally abnormal level of eye contact.

I would very much question whether the eye contact actually happened as described. As you said, I think the OP has been spending too much time on the wrong kinds of message board and completely misread completely normal social cues.