Physics prof. states fact at CERN - gets fired

Pero_Bueno

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45709205

So CERN caved and suspended him over an angry bunch of dour feminists.
He stated facts.
But the new Orwellian ministry of truth doesn't like facts if they go against the agenda.

Sad times, all the misinformation being spread about it

Look at this idiot
https://twitter.com/jesswade/status/1046334690268008448

So wrong on James Damore and wrong on this guy - "against women in STEM"
These people just want to be victims and wallow in there false sense of inequality.

Pero_Bueno

Just saw this thread over on TGC

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=108231887&postcount=3698

spot on ..

JJayoo

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to say this to a room full of women in 2018 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

Donald Trump

Well it has been predominantly men, but there might be other reasons for that.

Two influential physicists that spring to mind would be Emmy Noether and Marie Curie

Pero_Bueno

JJayoo wrote: »

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to say this to a room full of women in 2018 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

So where does it end ?
CERN is supposed to be a scientific institution - for truth whatever the cost!
This DENIAL of reality and facts!! we see it in Biology, there is a spectrum of chromosomes between XX and XY so we have a gender spectrum ???? WHAT???

Is that coming to physics next ? or at least stats within the STEM subjects.

I think 1984 should be mandatory reading for kids in school, this is where this is heading .

Grayson

His conclusions on the slide is that there is cultural marxsim.

The goal of this is: more women in STEM. Indoctrinating to the ideology.

Their “gender equality” works because it’s the usual sexism: women and men
in their traditional gender roles of victims and protectors/providers. It’s blind
human biology practiced as in the plains of Africa thousands of years ago.

I said Thoughtcrime according to Minister of Truth and PC Thought Police.

The guys nuts. Only those redpill idiots would agree with him.

He picks studies and figures, presents conclusions for them without considering any other ideas. And then and the end chucks in a bit about african plains that he pulled out of his arse.

pleas advice

Intersectionalism, innit?

check your privilege

riffmongous

I saw one of his graphs on the bbc, and it seemed like it was a bit misleading, at least I had quite a few questions about it and the data. It was on citations versus career age

pleas advice

[citations needed]

Victor

Pero_Bueno wrote: »

gets fired

He didn't work for CERN, so they didn't fire him. He was a guest speaker. CERN has just cut ties with him.

Deusexmachina

JJayoo wrote: »

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to say this to a room full of women in 2018 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

sounds Orwellian.

Hector Savage

Grayson wrote: »

His conclusions on the slide is that there is cultural marxsim.



The guys nuts. Only those redpill idiots would agree with him.

He picks studies and figures, presents conclusions for them without considering any other ideas. And then and the end chucks in a bit about african plains that he pulled out of his arse.

So do you think there is any differences in women and men ?
and their choices of study ?

What about nordic countries where they have the best equality yet less women still choose to go into engineering ?
What about areas where men are under represented ? like Psychology ?

Not trying to rile you here, just genuinely curious - I know your field is stats and logic so I would like to see your input on this.

Southwest Alaska

There are some serious nutcase gender difference deniers out there.

Men are more likely to be elite in their field because the potential reward has made it worth the risk to build the male brain in such a way where they are more likely to excel. The same reward hasn't been there for women so the safety of mediocrity is the optimum strategy.

Hector Savage

Southwest Alaska wrote: »

There are some serious nutcase gender difference deniers out there.

Some of the women on Twitter - and scientists as well ! jesus wept , from the OP

https://twitter.com/jesswade/status/1028645073448316928

Who the hell wears a T shirt saying "Inferior" ?
wtf ?

"Because I don’t want to just tell girls they can do anything. I want them to read it, be empowered, and join our fight for equality."

Holy f*ck, so she wants to lie to young girls, tell them they are victims and they need to fight for something they already have ?

Does this idiot not see she is making it worse ?
This is pure brainwashing.

sbsquarepants

What I don't understand is why exactly he felt the need to point this out to a room full of women?

You wouldn't sit there and point out that it was built by white men - even if it's true. You just can't get away with this shít these days.

Southwest Alaska

sbsquarepants wrote: »

What I don't understand is why exactly he felt the need to point this out to a room full of women?

You wouldn't sit there and point out that it was built by white men - even if it's true. You just can't get away with this shít these days.

Perhaps it's a sense of personal integrity, he doesn't want to lie for approval.

amcalester

Southwest Alaska wrote: »

Perhaps it's a sense of personal integrity, he doesn't want to lie for approval.

Did he ask to present a paper, and then talk about a different one? Article is confusing.

Either way it seems he went out of his way to give this talk, which was probably foolish.

Professor Alessandro Strumia, a senior researcher at the National Institute of Chemical Physics and Biophysics, had allegedly asked Cern if he could deliver a talk on his most recent bibliometrics paper.

He then proceeded to present a talk about “fundamental theory and gender”, where he spoke about how female physicists such as Marie Curie were welcomed into the physics world only once they had established themselves.

And all because he was passed over for a job in favour of a woman.

He also explained how he believed that he should have been hired by the National Institute of Nuclear Physics over Anna Ceresole, the professor who was eventually chosen for the position that he’d applied for, as he had more citations than her.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Meanwhile China is hiring whomever it needs to do whatever science it wants. If they were smart they’d appeal to any disaffected male western scientist or engineer.

Assetbacked

A news story consisting of opinions garnished from Tweets, as a general point, is not worth taking at face value.

Your Face

They all have lovely bottoms.

super_furry

Sounds like a bitter man who couldn't get over the fact that he didn't get the promotion he wanted, so he went on a rant.

But you know, this is After Hours so we can't pass up the chance to whinge about feminism and paint this guy as a martyr.

nthclare

I'm staying out of this one, I'll only get banned again for having a larf......

JJayoo

Something something DONALD TRUMP something =all men are bad

Southwest Alaska

super_furry wrote: »

Sounds like a bitter man who couldn't get over the fact that he didn't get the promotion he wanted, so he went on a rant.

But you know, this is After Hours so we can't pass up the chance to whinge about feminism and paint this guy as a martyr.

On what basis do you think he is bitter?

Donald Trump

JJayoo wrote: »

Something something DONALD TRUMP something =all men are bad

Feck off


Yer ma doesn't complain about me when I call over

Hector Savage

Assetbacked wrote: »

A news story consisting of opinions garnished from Tweets, as a general point, is not worth taking at face value.

Very good advice actually, I must start taking it.

Also I need a break from twitter, I just get angry when I check it.

:mad:

Wanderer78

he was just on bbc news there, whats the crack with this chap, havent read into it?

Cienciano

sbsquarepants wrote: »

What I don't understand is why exactly he felt the need to point this out to a room full of women?

You wouldn't sit there and point out that it was built by white men - even if it's true. You just can't get away with this shít these days.

He should have went by the boards rule: Don't be a dick.

Of course, people are delighted he's suspended because they can pretend they're outraged and it's "PC gone mad".
Unfortunately, that's the world we live in now.

wexie

Cienciano wrote: »

He should have went by the boards rule: Don't be a dick.

You'd think that once you get close enough near the top of your field to be lecturing at CERN you might have enough social and political acumen than to present your findings in such a blunt way.

....maybe he's just one of these people that are really really good at what they do and just don't see the world in shades of political correctness and levels of victim-hood.

If that's the case I think we could do with more of him to be honest.

goose2005

JJayoo wrote: »

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to say this to a room full of women in 2018 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to advocate heliocentrism a room full of priests in 1633 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

Franz Von Peppercorn

goose2005 wrote: »

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to advocate heliocentrism a room full of priests in 1633 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

Copernicus did exactly that. It was a more tolerant age though.

markodaly

JJayoo wrote: »

Think it but don't say it

Welcome to the modern day equivalent of heresy.

Arghus

goose2005 wrote: »

In fairness if the guy is dumb enough to advocate heliocentrism a room full of priests in 1633 then he probably shouldn't be working on any big projects.

Think it but don't say it

Yes, but that was a fact.

This is a bit more open to interpretation. As a result, maybe don't present your interpretation of the data as fact to an audience who will, rightly, feel patronised by it.

LLMMLL

Well if anyone can make sense of those slides they deserve a novel prize themselves.

I did have to laugh when part of his evidence was himself losing out on a promotion. No axe to grind there.

Dohnjoe

Pero_Bueno wrote: »

So where does it end ?
CERN is supposed to be a scientific institution - for truth whatever the cost!
This DENIAL of reality and facts!! we see it in Biology, there is a spectrum of chromosomes between XX and XY so we have a gender spectrum ???? WHAT???

Is that coming to physics next ? or at least stats within the STEM subjects.

I think 1984 should be mandatory reading for kids in school, this is where this is heading .

Oh quit the hysteria and amateur dramatics

He was sat in a room in a conf about women in physics basically telling them how male dominated it was and trying to validate that

Considering the social and academic barriers women have had to face, it was more than a little stupid, especially considering the tone of the presentation

Go to a similar event on racism and start discussing the "facts" of the genetic intelligence between races and see how long you keep your job for

ohnonotgmail

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Oh quit the hysteria and amateur dramatics

He was sat in a room in a conf about women in physics basically telling them how male dominated it was and trying to validate that

Considering the social and academic barriers women have had to face, it was more than a little stupid, especially considering the tone of the presentation

Go to a similar event on racism and start discussing the "facts" of the genetic intelligence between races and see how long you keep your job for

Even more stupid when that is not the talk you were invited to give and it is not your area of study.

amcalester

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Even more stupid when that is not the talk you were invited to give and it is not your area of study.

He wasn’t invited, he asked if he could deliver a talk and then changed the topic of the talk he asked to give.

For a smart man, it was kind of stupid.