Cafe racer battery dead after only for weeks of ownership

So I bought a yamaha café racer a month ago. I only took it out for a short test ride for a few kilometres after I got it and it was running fine. That was less than three weeks ago. Went on holidays and stored bike in new dry shed. Took it out last night and started it up only to notice the battery seemed to be just about able to start the engine but it got it going anyway. Went up the road a few hundred metres and stopped to push in the choke. It killed the engine and when I went to restart it there wasn't anything. Lights on the dash don't even seem to be turning on. I'm new to motorbike ownership and I'm not really setup yet with things like my own jump start kit. Just looking for some advice on what you think I should do next. Obviously I can get the home start on the insurance to come out but I'd like to start figuring this stuff out on my own steam. So what would you do? It's one of those lithium ion batteries stored under the seat of the bike so it isn't the easiest to get to.

Also just wondering if it seems a bit strange that the battery is dying after just two weeks of not riding it and i only have it a month from a dealer. Doesn't seem right to me.

Sonics2k

If you bought it from a dealer, it's worth going back to them and telling them about it.

Might be a faulty battery or regulator, either one can be pretty awkward to determine if there' a problem until it actually happens.

sleepysniper

Best bet is to get yourself a trickle charger and leave the bike hooked up to that when not in use. A few a kilometres wouldn't be enough for the stator to put any decent amount of juice back into the battery.

sleepysniper

sleepysniper wrote: »

Best bet is to get yourself a trickle charger and leave the bike hooked up to that when not in use. A few a kilometres wouldn't be enough for the stator to put any decent amount of juice back into the battery.

So basically I kind of killed the battery by taking the bike out for such a short ride (probably two kilometres) and not allowing it to recharge? I probably started it twice before that without even riding it as well. Didn't know the batteries are that delicate. Hmmm. Nuts! I may see what they have in Argos so.

lalababa

1. If you're up for it: Jump start it - ie roll down an incline or get a push in 2nd with ignition on clutch in. Around fast walking pace to slow jogging. Let clutch out with a bit of throttle.

2. A bike in a shop may be standing quite a while, degrading the battery performance, a battery needs to be used- don't leave it standing at home. Go for a good ride or Buy a battery charger - 15 euros around. Charge at home.

3.If battery does not start bike and especially if dash lights don't come on the battery is very discharged.

4. If battery is v. discharged but charges to full within 1 hour battery is goosed.it will let you down eventually.

5. If battery takes awhile to fully charge but does not hold the charge on the bike.Buy a voltometer. Test battery while bike is on. Is it getting more than 13 v on small rev and does this fluctuate when revved more. If it isn't and it doesn't then your charging system may be suspect.

Alkers

Is it a new bike or secondhand?

Sonics2k

Sonics2k wrote: »

If you bought it from a dealer, it's worth going back to them and telling them about it.

Might be a faulty battery or regulator, either one can be pretty awkward to determine if there' a problem until it actually happens.

Its a fully restored bike with the clock reset to zero. They did four hundred kilometres on it after reset and said it was running fine and it seemed to be running grand when I test rode it. Fairly sure it had a new battery after restoration. I'll give them a ring tomorrow to let them know about the problem but it seems plausible that I've started the bike a few times for just a few mins and haven't given the bike a chance to recharge battery.

lalababa

lalababa wrote: »

1. If you're up for it: Jump start it - ie roll down an incline or get a push in 2nd with ignition on clutch in. Around fast walking pace to slow jogging. Let clutch out with a bit of throttle.

2. A bike in a shop may be standing quite a while, degrading the battery performance, a battery needs to be used- don't leave it standing at home. Go for a good ride or Buy a battery charger - 15 euros around. Charge at home.

3.If battery does not start bike and especially if dash lights don't come on the battery is very discharged.

4. If battery is v. discharged but charges to full within 1 hour battery is goosed.it will let you down eventually.

5. If battery takes awhile to fully charge but does not hold the charge on the bike.Buy a voltometer. Test battery while bike is on. Is it getting more than 13 v on small rev and does this fluctuate when revved more. If it isn't and it doesn't then your charging system may be suspect.

Yup thanks. I'll consider all that. I knew to ride it but I was moving house when bike was delivered and was just too busy to ride it and then went on vacation. It was in the back of my mind that I was letting the bike sit too long without riding it. I might try the push start. I've done it with cars a few times but wasn't sure if I could do it with motorbike. It's a pain in the left test**le being a newbie and motorbike ignorant ha ha. I'm on a steep learning curve at the moment ;-)

sleepysniper

Deleted User wrote:

So basically I kind of killed the battery by taking the bike out for such a short ride (probably two kilometres) and not allowing it to recharge? I probably started it twice before that without even riding it as well. Didn't know the batteries are that delicate. Hmmm. Nuts! I may see what they have in Argos so.

Sounds like it to me. Starting it will also drain the battery to a certain degree and if it was a weak battery to begin with it certainly wouldn't help. Riding the bike will recharge the battery and if the battery is in good condition that should generally be enough to keep enough juice in the battery assuming you are riding it relatively regularly (and more than 1 or 2 KM) If not, get yourself a trickle charger.

Alkers

Deleted User wrote:

Its a fully restored bike with the clock reset to zero. They did four hundred kilometres on it after reset and said it was running fine and it seemed to be running grand when I test rode it. Fairly sure it had a new battery after restoration. I'll give them a ring tomorrow to let them know about the problem but it seems plausible that I've started the bike a few times for just a few mins and haven't given the bike a chance to recharge battery.

In that case it doesn't sound to me like you did enough to completely drain the battery, I'd follow up with the dealer and ask them to check that the battery is charging. One thing to be careful of is once the ignition is on, if that turns on the headlights, that will drain the battery quickly.

If you're going to be using the bike infrequently in general it is worth keeping it hooked up to a trickle charger permanently, you can get connector cables so you don't have to access the battery each time.

Max Headroom

Sounds to me like the battery isnt charging..could just be a loose /off connection from the alternator or reg/rec...also check theres nothing drawing current when its turned off....did the builders rewire it completely do you know..??

Max Headroom

Max Headroom wrote: »

Sounds to me like the battery isnt charging..could just be a loose /off connection from the alternator or reg/rec...also check theres nothing drawing current when its turned off....did the builders rewire it completely do you know..??

It is a little suspicious alright given the dealer stated bike for a minute when he delivered it and I only started it twice and let it run for a few minutes but when it was at the dealership they could have started it a few times without riding it as well. I know they had to fix a broken indicator between when I bought it and when they delivered it a few weeks later. So if they were working on bike they could have been turning on ignition or briefly running it to check electrics. That would have all wore down the battery prior to it being delivered.

But I'll ring the dealer tomorrow anyway just to cover my ass in case I can't resolve it myself. I was too busy working all today so I didn't get to check wires or battery for any loose connections.

Cafe racer was a bad choice for a starter bike ha ha but sher I'd learn nothing of it was too easy :-)

Thanks for the help everyone. I'll let you know if I've any other questions.

Max Headroom

Curious..where did you buy it....

zubair

By any chance were you just starting it stationary and running it a few times for the novelty of it?

Del2005

Max Headroom wrote: »

Sounds to me like the battery isnt charging..could just be a loose /off connection from the alternator or reg/rec...also check theres nothing drawing current when its turned off....did the builders rewire it completely do you know..??

Sounds like the OP started the bike several times for only a minute or two each time. We don't know how often the bike shop did short starts either.

If you start a vehicle you need to leave it running for at least 10 to 15 minutes before the battery will recover. Buy a trickle charger and it'll be fine.

CJhaughey

Li-ion batteries need more careful handling than standard lead acid batteries, the first thing you need to do is get a charger that will charge Li-ion batteries and connect that to the battery to charge it.
I don't know the capacity of the battery but most chargers designed for Li-ion motorcycle batteries should charge them OK.

Lorddrakul

@unedumacated: where are you?

If you are in our around Dublin, give me a shout.

There are a few fairly simple tests to go through the gene output, reg/rec, battery etc to see where the fault lies.

A €20 multi meter and a few videos on YouTube will sort you out otherwise.

As such, it is highly unlikely you've killed a battery through the usage you've described, but it does sound like the battery is either not charging or not holding a charge.
Not charging is usually the system, and most likely the reg/rec, not holding a charge is the battery.

Add regards lithium batteries, I'm using one daily in a 30 year old Honda, works just fine. That said, I did invest in the specific charger for it. Not needed it yet.

Apart from the weight saving, a modern AGM battery is just add good in terms of life and discharge characteristics.

galwaytt

Was that on the Burren Run last week ? A black monoshock Yamaha 4 IL ?

Max Headroom

Cafe racer night tomorrow night (friday) from 6...Blue Light pub.....probably the last one this year...unless this weather keeps up....:)

Update. I really shouldn't admit this but (alas I have no shame) it wasn't the battery. Bike just wasn't in neutral or at least it wasn't detecting neutral on the dash (no green light). Someone mentioned it to me when I was starting out about how green didn't always guarantee neutral and vice versa. So it seems to have that tendency to not always pick up neutral. I've had it a few times out on the road. Down into first, go to take off and nothing, check the light, no green, kick it into gear and then off it goes. So when I stalled the bike two weeks ago, I went back to neutral, seemed to roll free and then I just tried to restart it but it wouldn't do I had to walk it back to the house. Bought a battery charger (apparently a smart battery charger will actually do the trick even on lithium battery). I went out to fit it for charge. Before that I just kicked the gear up and then back down to first and then put it into neutral again and the green light came on. Tried to start it and off it went no bother. Balls! But also relief that it was just my ignorance.

Anyway, I've mastered the choke and no more stalling it and it's been going fine. I've put up about two hundred kilometres on it since. Getting out on the road a couple of times a week for an hour after work around the various country roads outside Drogheda. Bikes going grand and its staying dry thankfully. It can't be ridden in wet weather as it has the wire mesh air filter is the only problem I hope to encounter over the next few months but I'll be taking it out any chance I get with dry roads to get the practice in.

Max Headroom

Great news, although the neutral switch is usually a quick fix...I'm a bit confused tho..the bike will start in gear but you need the clutch in..the neutral light/switch doesnt prevent the bike form starting....whats the bike..??

Max Headroom

Max Headroom wrote: »

Great news, although the neutral switch is usually a quick fix...I'm a bit confused tho..the bike will start in gear but you need the clutch in..the neutral light/switch doesnt prevent the bike form starting....whats the bike..??

No it has to be in neutral with the green light showing before it will start. Its a yamaha sr 250 from 1984 I think.

Hotblack Desiato

CJhaughey wrote: »

Li-ion batteries need more careful handling than standard lead acid batteries, the first thing you need to do is get a charger that will charge Li-ion batteries and connect that to the battery to charge it.
I don't know the capacity of the battery but most chargers designed for Li-ion motorcycle batteries should charge them OK.

Usually lithium batteries in vehicles aren't lithium ion, they're lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) which is much safer than lithium ion - doesn't go on fire if it overheats.

There shouldn't be any need for a special charger, after all if the normal bike alternator can charge it safely then a normal battery charger will too.

There is a drawback with LiFePO4 batteries that they have poor cranking current in cold weather, the trick with them in very cold weather is to leave the ignition and headlights on for half a minute to warm up the battery and then start it.

Get rid of the mesh air filter, not worth a f**k and will cause rapid wear to your engine and power loss. Get a K&N or similar high performance air filter, even F1 cars stopped using wire mesh in the 70s, nobody in their right mind runs a tuned engine on unfiltered air.

CJhaughey

Deleted User wrote: »

It's one of those lithium ion batteries stored under the seat of the bike so it isn't the easiest to get to.

I can only go by what the OP said.
Agreed on Wire mesh filters that is one thing that absolutely has no place on any motorcycle apart from non ridden show bikes, if its not wet dirt its dry dust and both will quickly make any engine wear itself out.

zubair

Lol, I'll save you future trouble and remind you to check the kill switch next time too.

Hotblack Desiato

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Usually lithium batteries in vehicles aren't lithium ion, they're lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) which is much safer than lithium ion - doesn't go on fire if it overheats.

There shouldn't be any need for a special charger, after all if the normal bike alternator can charge it safely then a normal battery charger will too.

There is a drawback with LiFePO4 batteries that they have poor cranking current in cold weather, the trick with them in very cold weather is to leave the ignition and headlights on for half a minute to warm up the battery and then start it.

Get rid of the mesh air filter, not worth a f**k and will cause rapid wear to your engine and power loss. Get a K&N or similar high performance air filter, even F1 cars stopped using wire mesh in the 70s, nobody in their right mind runs a tuned engine on unfiltered air.

Do Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries hold their charge as well as lithium iron batteries do and is their energy density as good or better? Agreed that the battery on my bike can be charged with a smart battery charger. I'll take your advice on the air filter. I think the wire mesh air filter is just for show really on the cafe racers. If I ride the bike on dry, clean, non dusty roads then I shouldn't do too much damage to my engine though? The main problem is that the wire mesh filter is right in front of the back wheel so it gets sprayed if I ride it in wet conditions. If I replace it with the K&N filter you mentioned then will it full be a problem if it gets sprayed in wet weather? I'm thinking about a rear mudguard over back wheel. What you reckon?

zubair

zubair wrote: »

Lol, I'll save you future trouble and remind you to check the kill switch next time too.

Ha I've gone through all the switches after my initial screw up. I'm all good. No more newbie mishaps ;-) Touch wood

Hotblack Desiato

Dunno why you're worried about energy density, it either starts the bike or it doesn't.

Mudguard is essential and there is no type of road you can ride on without an air filter without causing damage

Max Headroom

Cafe racers are about looks..not practicality...I won't ride mine in the wet..why would I...no mudguards,cone filters, head and tail light only...a park bench is more comfortable....but it looks the b0llox.....:)....