Derogatory Term??

Pcunningham

Hi everyone,

I'm writing a book at the minute and I'm trying to figure out if a certain word is offensive to the Gay community. My book focuses on a blackmailer, who con's people out of money.

The sentence I have written is "A Queers money is as good as anyone else's". Is the word 'Queer' a derogatory term to describe a gay person?

My character doesn't care who a person is, as long as they have money to pay him off.

I'm not sure if this term would cause offence. I don't mean to insult anyone, just trying to gauge a reaction. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Annasopra

It depends on the context.

If the book is written in the past - say the 70s or 80s then yes it is more likely a slur.

If the book is written in comtemporarily then it might or might not be considered a slur. It kind of depends of who is saying and how they mean it.

wheelirish

And that exactly is the problem. Terminology changes like the weather and whats totally offensive one minute can be "cool" the next.
If you called me "Queer" I would be highly offended. But in the context of what you wrote I wouldn't be.
I think this political correctness is totally over the top and it will revert back to normality in times to come.

For me language is important and if someone wants to be called anything - let them off but do not expect me to play by their rules.

I will call people Sir or Ms as they present to me but I will not pander to calling them anything else.

pl4ichjgy17zwd

I'm gay and I wouldn't even use the word queer about someone unless they'd said it was okay.

As much as the word has become more mainstream within the community, it's still hurtful to a lot of people and if I read a book with that line from a straight character I would think the character is ignorant at best, offensive at worst.

Annasopra

wheelirish wrote: »

And that exactly is the problem. Terminology changes like the weather and whats totally offensive one minute can be "cool" the next.
If you called me "Queer" I would be highly offended. But in the context of what you wrote I wouldn't be.
I think this political correctness is totally over the top and it will revert back to normality in times to come.

For me language is important and if someone wants to be called anything - let them off but do not expect me to play by their rules.

I will call people Sir or Ms as they present to me but I will not pander to calling them anything else.

Mod

Maybe try this forum instead

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1193

You seem to want troll here. Dont post in this thread again

hasdanta

Depends on the person. I'm personally not a fan of people in the LGBT+ community referring to themselves as queers, but each to their own.

Ten of Swords

How is the reader expected to perceive this character? (I'm aware you have said he uses blackmail!) If there is an intent that they won't like him or won't align with/understand his motivations then the word may assist creating a negative perception. If it's someone you want the reader to warm to or empathize then that would probably not help.

As mentioned the word is used mostly as a slur and be aware that many people do find it offensive.

Might be worth remembering that slurs and offensive terms in books/movies/plays etc do not generally age very well. How do you feel reading a book from the 50s (for example) that contains a lot of racially charged language?

You might get some insights from the Creative writing forum.

tedpan

Pcunningham wrote:

The sentence I have written is "A Queers money is as good as anyone else's". Is the word 'Queer' a derogatory term to describe a gay person?

Missing an apostrophe..

Pcunningham

Hey,

Many Thanks for all the replies. It's very helpful!

I used the term and the sentence "A Queer's money is as good as anyone else's" as more of a reflection of my main character. He's a borderline alcoholic, recently separated and jobless. He turns to blackmail and targets a gay man. So the sentence was more 'I don't care who they are as long as they can pay'.

Ten of Swords you make a great point about how I want the character to be received. Yes, I want the reader to grow to like him as the story unfolds, so perhaps the word 'queer' is a stumbling block.

And booters, my straight character is ignorant at the time he uses the word. He's angry and kicking out at the world. I hope the reader understands him more as the story continues.

All in all, I think it's best to omit the word 'queer' from the text. It seems to do more harm than good. Maybe "A Gay's money is as good as anyone else's". Or simply don't mention the fact that the man is gay?

Thanks again for your input. It's much appreciated.

All the best.

Annasopra

To be honest I think there is no harm in using it. Yes it might be seen as derogatory but you know its part of the story.

Pcunningham

That's exactly what I wanted it to be when I wrote it, but maybe it could turn some publishers/agents off too?

o1s1n

Pcunningham wrote: »

That's exactly what I wanted it to be when I wrote it, but maybe it could turn some publishers/agents off too?

You're completely overthinking this.

baby and crumble

For what it’s worth, I don’t have the problem with the word queer. I identify as queer probably more than anything else because for me it encompasses a lot of my sexual and gender identity. I’m currently studying for a PHD and my topic is LGBT related- I’ll likely use the word queer quite a bit in talking and writing about it. The difference is, I’m a queer person, and for people under about 40 (I’d say) it’s been ‘reclaimed’ somewhat within the community.

But, a lot of older gay folks would not feel like I do.

I think in this instance you’re massively overthinking it. It’s a fictional piece of work, you’re not writing an essay for a newspapers saying “queers are weird” or something.

EdgeCase

The context is definitely important, a bit like how me describing myself as a paddy is one thing, but that being hurled at me by someone in a xenophobic way is a different issue entirely.

I think you've a lot of examples of organisations and individuals trying to reclaim the word 'queer' to make it into a positive statement rather than a term of abuse. To me, that has both good and bad points. In some ways it's a very loaded word that has largely been used as a term of abuse and I think in that sense it's very hard to turn that into something pleasant.

The phrase that really annoyed me, and was probably traceable back to ironic usage on South Park, was "that is so gay". There was a period of time where it was just becoming ridiculous. I remember a colleague shout "that printer is so gay!" because it wouldn't print.

It was almost like the use of the term "oh that's a bit Irish!" when someone did something you found a bit obtuse etc..

Language definitely changes, but I think people do need to be aware that the term 'queer', perhaps a little bit like certain words that can be used in a racist way or by the community that they targeted, are a bit controversial.

In my use of language, I'd rather just not use the term at all. I think it's way too loaded and perhaps is a little beyond being recoverable as a positive thing, but some people have different opinions. It's all about context!

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

You’re writing a fictional book and wondering if a word will offend someone?

Context.

That’s a word you should look up in the dictionary.

EdgeCase

If you're writing a fictional book you also may want to have a homophobic character as part of the plot. It doesn't mean that they're endorsed by the storyline or the author.

It very much depends on what you are up to!

J_E

It would be worse to falsify an authentic character in a fictional story. I see no issue here.

An_Toirpin

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

It depends on the context.

If the book is written in the past - say the 70s or 80s then yes it is more likely a slur.

If the book is written in comtemporarily then it might or might not be considered a slur. It kind of depends of who is saying and how they mean it.

Queer isnt a slur. It wasn't a slur in the 1980s and certainly isnt now. In universities there is such thing as queer officers in the student unions.

lottpaul

An_Toirpin wrote: »

Queer isnt a slur. It wasn't a slur in the 1980s.

I can assure you that it most certainly was.

In fact it was one of the "lesser" insults shouted, screamed, scrawled etc at anyone who seemed in any way "suspect" at all.
It may have changed in recent times but to me and many of my generation it was and always will be a term of abuse.

An_Toirpin

lottpaul wrote: »

An_Toirpin wrote: »

Queer isnt a slur. It wasn't a slur in the 1980s.

I can assure you that it most certainly was.

In fact it was one of the "lesser" insults shouted, screamed, scrawled etc at anyone who seemed in any way "suspect" at all.
It may have changed in recent times but to me and many of my generation it was and always will be a term of abuse.

I don't know maybe in the 1970s but I doubt it. I heard gay shouted around schools to insult people. So is that a slur? It was that act of being a queer that was considered bad not the word.  A few years ago there was a fuss when some football man said the word. During that incident I think most younger people were confused. They knew ****** was supposed to be offensive but not queer.

Goodshape

It's one of those words which depends on how it is said, and by whom.

I've always thought of 'queer' as more of a descriptor than an insult. Like the word 'gay' itself, it could be spat at you as in insult – or simply used as a way to describe the wonderfully queer person you are.

Although when straight people ask me should they use it, I usually say "probably not".

J_E

An_Toirpin wrote: »

I don't know maybe in the 1970s but I doubt it. I heard gay shouted around schools to insult people. So is that a slur? It was that act of being a queer that was considered bad not the word.  A few years ago there was a fuss when some football man said the word. During that incident I think most younger people were confused. They knew ****** was supposed to be offensive but not queer.

I have been yelled at as a 'queer' and it was very clear what the intent was. I'm sure others here will concur. I wish you wouldn't be so adamant so deny that it has been used as a derogatory term towards homosexuals. Thankfully the context has been reclaimed over time and used as an empowering term as you pointed out with a queer officer in college. Queer in modern culture has an entirely different meaning. Words often carry dualities. Context is the key word here, I think. You can play semantics, but I think you know what posters here mean.