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Cathal Brugha Barracks in Dublin considered for social housing

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  • 29-07-2018 7:59pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭


    https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/army-owned-land-in-dublin-considered-for-social-housing-858531.html

    As per the story above if the barracks above was taken off the army where would they go. Would it be better to build a new barracks within in the curragh. By doing this it might me easier for the soldiers to get housing closer to there work and not as expensive. Mullingar is still owned by the defence forces just sitting there with not much happening in it. It wouldnt take a lot to get it operational again and again plenty of housing in the midland region. Dublin would still have a city barracks in Mckee


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 22,243 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    roadmaster wrote: »
    Mullingar is still owned by the defence forces just sitting there with not much happening in it.
    All of it?!?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    endacl wrote: »
    All of it?!?

    Yip local groups using it only i believe. Can a mod edit thread title please as i cant change the wrong spelling


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    roadmaster wrote: »
    Yip local groups using it only i believe. Can a mod edit thread title please as i cant change the wrong spelling

    Done - made title more meaningful too


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    roadmaster wrote: »
    Mullingar is still owned by the defence forces just sitting there with not much happening in it. It wouldnt take a lot to get it operational again and again plenty of housing in the midland region.

    What benefit is having a barracks in mullingar , to the security of our capital city?
    Currently responding to a major incident of any sort in the city is the remit of (i suppose a QRF) in 2 army barracks under ATCP/ATCA

    Transit times from the Curragh are at least 50 minutes at avg speed of 50kph - you wont get a mowag or truck or LTAV moving much quicker - and by time the AC spin up rotary assets and land and pick up rangers / rangers drive to BAL and board - and then fly - it works out roughly the same.

    The decision about whether or not to remove half (CB and McKee) of the military forces available to the gardai in Dublin city as a backup option, out of the city, in a state that doesnt arm its police - is a no brainer. This is media hype and nothing more. Only way this might work is either co-locating troops and helis (ha ha - imagine the gentry in casement spitting their coffee out reading this) or moving all dublin assets into one location - cant imagine the defence forces want to lose either barracks.

    The other side of this is that its the death of a thousand cuts in practice. either build up (go high rise) or put those needing social housing into other cities / towns away from the capital. Its ludicrous that people refuse housing based on location. if i commute 1 hr each way to work in the city and pay my taxes, why should someone in need of social housing and a beneficiary OF my taxes get accommodation in the city over me and to the detriment of the states military?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    we already have McKee surely it can cover Dublin.Even you could put a detachment in Casement for the south side if needs be .Anything that is going to need APCS to support the guards is not going to happen in a few minutes, Again armored vehicles could be based in McKee for rapid response The reason i said maybe Mullingar is its still owned by the state and no one from public or private seams to want it, Its an asset so use it. flog Cathal Brugha to a developer and pump the money back in to the defence forces


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,466 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    Where is this notion coming from that we don't have enough land for housing? The Government own huge swathes of unused land across Dublin.

    Government controls vast swathe of vacant sites as housing crisis intensifies

    It makes no sense to focus attention on Cathal Brugha Barracks, which is a working asset, instead of focusing on trying to bring other unused sites into use. It's just a cheap publicity stunt exercise as Cathal Brugha Barracks is a recognisable site for the public.

    The housing crisis is being caused by a failure to fund social and affordable housing development, not as a result of a lack of available land.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Where is this notion coming from that we don't have enough land for housing? The Government own huge swathes of unused land across Dublin.

    Government controls vast swathe of vacant sites as housing crisis intensifies

    It makes no sense to focus attention on Cathal Brugha Barracks, which is a working asset, instead of focusing on trying to bring other unused sites into use. It's just a cheap publicity stunt exercise as Cathal Brugha Barracks is a recognisable site for the public.

    The housing crisis is being caused by a failure to fund social and affordable housing development, not as a result of a lack of available land.

    There is an awful lot of BS being wrote in the papers about what land is available especially about brownfield sites. I have seen one or two of these sites and by the time you get rid of the dangerous items such as asbestos the price of building on these sites go through the roof. but you are correct Cathal Brugha is a easy high profile target . If you need to keep what ever the number of troops is in both dublin barracks in the city would we not be better of anyway with a new purpose built barracks just inside the M50 maybe around parkwest, After all we keep getting told these barracks are kips for the soldiers to work in


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    Many of the buildings in the barracks are protected structures, this limits what you can do as a developer, therefore i see no point in selling up. Once you lose something its much harder to get it back. reinvesting once off money from a sale, back into defence creates a blip in funding that will be sanded smooth by reallocation of other parts of the next years budget to create a flat line in year on year defence spending instead of an up and to the right kind of expenditure graph, which is what Ireland needs. This is a joke, once it's gone it's gone. Its wrong, defence needs a credible budget that reflects our aspirations to show the rest of the EU that we take national security seriously and to provide the capability that an integrated EU defence system needs from us. We have to start taking policing and defence of our resources and territory seriously, both at home and internationally. The only way is increasing the defence budget, paying our soldiers and investing in better equipment and infrastructure. lowest defence spend in the EU, enough said.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 24,878 ✭✭✭✭arybvtcw0eolkf


    Governments closed DFHQ East (opposite side of the road to the now DPP's office) for social housing and its still lying empty, I believe the problem is asbestos.

    Kildare barracks was closed for social housing, nothing's been built.

    Clonmel was also closed to build social housing, not a sod of earth was turn for a single house.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Morpheus wrote: »
    Many of the buildings in the barracks are protected structures, this limits what you can do as a developer, therefore i see no point in selling up. Once you lose something its much harder to get it back. reinvesting once off money from a sale, back into defence creates a blip in funding that will be sanded smooth by reallocation of other parts of the next years budget to create a flat line in year on year defence spending instead of an up and to the right kind of expenditure graph, which is what Ireland needs. This is a joke, once it's gone it's gone. Its wrong, defence needs a credible budget that reflects our aspirations to show the rest of the EU that we take national security seriously and to provide the capability that an integrated EU defence system needs from us. We have to start taking policing and defence of our resources and territory seriously, both at home and internationally. The only way is increasing the defence budget, paying our soldiers and investing in better equipment and infrastructure. lowest defence spend in the EU, enough said.


    I agree with nearly everything you say, you are preaching to the converted about spending. But do we need two barracks in Dublin. These barracks where designed for an occupational force not a defense force. Would it not be better to build a barracks that is modern and good working conditions for the soldiers to cover Dublin or just upgrade McKee to a good standard . On the protected structures you would be very surprised at the amount of building that are not protected . Just because something is old does not imply that it is of heritage value


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Negative_G


    The reality is, any profit made from selling any sites will absolutely not be reinvested into any aspect of the DF.

    Anyone who believes otherwise is only fooling themselves.

    Unfortunately, with the current attitude towards the defence forces its a case of hold everything that you have for as long as possible.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Negative_G wrote: »
    The reality is, any profit made from selling any sites will absolutely not be reinvested into any aspect of the DF.

    Anyone who believes otherwise is only fooling themselves.

    Unfortunately, with the current attitude towards the defence forces its a case of hold everything that you have for as long as possible.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/smith-guarantees-to-reinvest-yield-from-sale-of-six-barracks-into-defence-forces-1.173687?mode=amp

    Would it be possible through a FOI to see if they did reinvest as per the above? Or would they deny it under national security


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Negative_G


    roadmaster wrote: »
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/smith-guarantees-to-reinvest-yield-from-sale-of-six-barracks-into-defence-forces-1.173687?mode=amp

    Would it be possible through a FOI to see if they did reinvest as per the above? Or would they deny it under national security

    Zero chance of being able to prove or disprove whether it was invested back into the DF.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,869 ✭✭✭trellheim


    All monies received by the state must by law flow into a common pool . This topic is only developers looking at clancy barracks and beggars bush and salivating at the same for CBB

    One could better say "why not take the museum in Collins Bks and move it to a purpose built site in Tallaght - bingo a huge barracks site has just opened up"

    but I'll remind people - Irish Glass and Bottle site is still empty as well the most expensive land in Dublin


  • Registered Users Posts: 684 ✭✭✭Benedict


    There will be opposition from posh people who have paid a fortune for nearby houses and think that this plan will lower the value. You also have Mary's posh private school there so they would not be pleased.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Benedict wrote: »
    There will be opposition from posh people who have paid a fortune for nearby houses and think that this plan will lower the value. You also have Mary's posh private school there so they would not be pleased.

    Ridiculous comment. You think hard working and successful enough to afford an expensive house = posh = objectors to good community building? Marys is a private school yes, but it exists in an already busy Rathmines community and I don't see it being disturbed by that in any way.

    In any case, I don't hold out much hope for this new agency, Govt has named Bolands Mills as a potential location for housing development, but it must have escaped their attention that the entire site is already half rebuilt as a high-end office and apartment development.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,164 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    The biggest argument in favour of keeping Cathal Brugha is its proximity to Leinster House. Leinster House could be reached on foot, if necessary, from the barracks. The politicians are fond of their own asses. McKee barracks is beside Aras an Uachtarain. The main broadcasting transmitters are also within handy reach of Rathmines. There was a proposal years ago to move from Rathmines to Baldonnel but it never happened for those reasons.


  • Registered Users Posts: 684 ✭✭✭Benedict


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Ridiculous comment. You think hard working and successful enough to afford an expensive house = posh = objectors to good community building? Marys is a private school yes, but it exists in an already busy Rathmines community and I don't see it being disturbed by that in any way.

    In any case, I don't hold out much hope for this new agency, Govt has named Bolands Mills as a potential location for housing development, but it must have escaped their attention that the entire site is already half rebuilt as a high-end office and apartment development.


    Perhaps this is true about Mary's. Belvedere School is even posher and is surrounded by an economically challenged area and it doesn't bother them.


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