Can I get penalty points/speeding fines in the UK?

questionstoask

Hi,
When you take your bike to the UK, is it possible to get speeding tickets and more importantly points on your Irish licence as a result?...Im no speedy gonzales but its worth knowing all the same!
I read an article from May last year that said its now possible to get the fines, but what about points when your driving in the uk on your bike and with an irish licence?
Anyone had any experience of this?
Many thanks

zubair

questionstoask wrote: »

Hi,
When you take your bike to the UK, is it possible to get speeding tickets and more importantly points on your Irish licence as a result?...Im no speedy gonzales but its worth knowing all the same!
I read an article from May last year that said its now possible to get the fines, but what about points when your driving in the uk on your bike and with an irish licence?
Anyone had any experience of this?
Many thanks

In Scotland last year we passed tons of average speed cameras and a few vans. Most of us had our tax discs in the right place ;-) and one of us was riding an import still on UK plates. No points.

questionstoask

Thanks for the reply. Just wondering what month that was last year as the rules might have changed in May 2017...Im guessin noone got any fines? Ive heard you can get fined, and you'll get the fine in the post, they track the plates, even Irish reg. and send it on to you here. Dont know the full story with penalty points though....heard a few years ago they would stay on the system in the UK and then if you ever wanted a UK licence, they'd be on them, but can they put the points onto an irish licence now?? Cant find anything online about it. I'm not mad for speed at all, I'm too old..haha! but I know the roads here well, never driven in the UK before and would be a sickner to get caught out on holidays. Im told its very different to here, cameras everywhere and you can easily get caught out twice in the one day!

cadete

If they stop you you could face a fine, I know a bloke who was fined 500 sterling on the spot and received a summons, court ordered another 425 to be paid. He works on boats off great yarmouth so hadnt much choice but to pay. doing 80 i think and it was welsh police that got him.

sham58107

Depends on speed. I drive a lot in NI /UK and now they can give you points. Will not effect you in Ireland but if you collect 12 in NI/UK you can be banned there.

questionstoask

sham58107 wrote: »

Depends on speed. I drive a lot in NI /UK and now they can give you points. Will not effect you in Ireland but if you collect 12 in NI/UK you can be banned there.

Thats sounds reasonable. What was worrying me is if the points would go on your Irish licence and could put you off the road here. I'm retired and planning my first trip to the UK. While I'm a pretty reasonable driver....theres no way I could keep track of every 30 mile zone on the bike, and trying to follow directions, and manage traffic!! Are they much stricter over about speed then here?
I'm driving 40 years and I've never gotten a speeding ticket here. So does everyone in the UK drive within the limit, with all those cameras?? Just want to get an overview of the speed of traffic, that kind of thing.
I wonder how the police over look on tourist drivers a few miles over the limit?
I want to have as little hassle as possible but also dont want to be religiously watching ever speed limit!

questionstoask

cadete wrote: »

If they stop you you could face a fine, I know a bloke who was fined 500 sterling on the spot and received a summons, court ordered another 425 to be paid. He works on boats off great yarmouth so hadnt much choice but to pay. doing 80 i think and it was welsh police that got him.

That sounds way stricter then here....overkill!

sham58107

I do a lot of driving and never got points, police may stop you if you are over, but they are easy to talk to, so as long as you are okay with them usually no problem.

Not sure if cameras really bother with foreign plates, any time I was stopped was by police. They can now take your licence to put points on and then send it back to you, they give you official receipt so it does not affect your driving. maybe an idea for here considering the amount of banned drivers that never surrendered licence in courts.

But usually if stopped it is just a warning, unless your are either driving like a lunatic or a complete dick head to them.

Enjoy your trip and stay safe.

questionstoask

sham58107 wrote: »

I do a lot of driving and never got points, police may stop you if you are over, but they are easy to talk to, so as long as you are okay with them usually no problem.

Not sure if cameras really bother with foreign plates, any time I was stopped was by police. They can now take your licence to put points on and then send it back to you, they give you official receipt so it does not affect your driving. maybe an idea for here considering the amount of banned drivers that never surrendered licence in courts.

But usually if stopped it is just a warning, unless your are either driving like a lunatic or a complete dick head to them.

Enjoy your trip and stay safe.

Many thanks for your advice, sounds much more reasonable....i was beginning to wonder if it was crazy strict over there! Looking forward to going

zubair

questionstoask wrote: »

Many thanks for your advice, sounds much more reasonable....i was beginning to wonder if it was crazy strict over there! Looking forward to going

There are way more traps than over here. You'll see more in a few days in the UK than you will in a year in Ireland. Just use your head and your eyes and you'll be fine.

spray____

Was over in Scotland a few weeks back and there are average speed cameras everywhere on the way up to Glasgow. Didn't notice them at first, but a friend pointed them out to me when we stopped. We took it handy the rest of the way hoping we hadn't put our feet in it.

Did some reading online and seems like the majority of them are only forward facing, so can't do anything with a bike.

On the way back we were carefully observing the signs when a couple of bikes on UK plates flew past us. Must have been doing at least 30km/h over. They didn't seem to concerned about the average speed zones.

macplaxton

You can pick up UK points on a UK record, then if you get a ban, there is a mutual recognition of the ban. So whilst you don't get UK points on an Irish licence, there is the possibility of a ban. That mutual recognition of bans between UK, NI, GBM, GBG, GBJ and IRL was to try and stamp out "driving licence tourism".

As a foreign licence holder, you could be ask for an on-the-spot "deposit". This is so if you don't turn up to court/pay they still have some money to show to for it. I think deposits start at £100/200.

I was stopped late last May (after the information sharing kicked in) by an unmarked car on a IRL registered bike/UK licence for supposedly doing 85mph in 60mph zone. As if just delaying me and making me spend 4 hours in Stranraer wasn't enough, he took my details, told the summons would be in the post and sent me on my way. As still had an intention to go back to the UK, I thought I best turn up and cough up rather than trying to dodge detection for any outstanding warrants and the port/airports. Anyway, that cost £300/4pts (discounted from £450/5pts for early plea/clean record)

If any area of the mainland has a reputation for rimming speeders, it's Dumfries & Galloway in Scotland. Take it slow until you're out of there because they've got nothing else better to do and WILL be hiding somewhere.

XsApollo

Just been through this myself.
If you have No uk address and if they can’t deal with you at the side of the road , ( ie if what your stopped for requires a summons) they will take a deposit off you.
500 sterling was mine off the credit card.
Court imposed 415 sterling fine and 6 points.
They can take payment of fines that don’t require a summons at the side of the road as well.
Not all vehicles are equipped with being able to do that yet, so might depends who stops you.

If I didn’t pay the deposit I was spending my time in cell until the judge could see me.

So yea.
Not as handy as it once was.

frozenfrozen

hearing this **** would put you off going on holidays to scotland on the bike. doesn't matter how great the roads are if you have to budget 500 euro fine and points into your trip

macplaxton

sham58107 wrote: »

I do a lot of driving and never got points

Famous last words.

I do a lot of driving/riding and never got points...






...during the first 26 years.

XsApollo wrote: »

If you have No uk address and if they can’t deal with you at the side of the road , ( ie if what your stopped for requires a summons) they will take a deposit off you.

More likely than not "will" but even though I supplied an Irish address and said I was resident there, they didn't take a deposit from me (see above). I should have just lived the life of a fugitive!

XsApollo wrote: »

Court imposed 415 sterling fine and 6 points.

Ouch! :eek: Dumfries was it? What were you doing, over a ton?

XsApollo

I wasn’t riding,
I was in a car about 5 mins outside holy head.
99mph was the official figure.

Zascar

Very long story but basically I was caught speeding many years ago in the car on the road out of Belfast - I was thinking I'm going to get away with this as there is no way they can do points across the border. However to my surprise they read me my rights and arrested me! Not kidding. Was brought down to the station, giving a full profile and I had to bail myself out. I then had to come back up to court several weeks later to get an £80 fine.

Absolutely ridiculous waste of time.

Lumen

Zascar wrote: »

Very long story but basically I was caught speeding many years ago in the car on the road out of Belfast - I was thinking I'm going to get away with this as there is no way they can do points across the border. However to my surprise they read me my rights and arrested me! Not kidding. Was brought down to the station, giving a full profile and I had to bail myself out. I then had to come back up to court several weeks later to get an £80 fine.

Absolutely ridiculous waste of time.

The points thing is about license administration. Historically there's been no recognition of points across borders, because you can't have one jurisdiction trusting the policing/justice outcomes in another.

But that doesn't stop them from prosecuting/penalising you within their own borders.

I got hairdryered in Ireland on a UK license and ended up in court (where it was struck off, as it happens). Now have an Irish license so have to be super careful.

There are legendary stories of British drivers getting caught coming and going from Le Mans and being escorted to a cash point to pay enormous fines on threat of imprisonment.

Green_Martian

XsApollo wrote: »

Just been through this myself.
If you have No uk address and if they can’t deal with you at the side of the road , ( ie if what your stopped for requires a summons) they will take a deposit off you.
500 sterling was mine off the credit card.
Court imposed 415 sterling fine and 6 points.
They can take payment of fines that don’t require a summons at the side of the road as well.
Not all vehicles are equipped with being able to do that yet, so might depends who stops you.

If I didn’t pay the deposit I was spending my time in cell until the judge could see me.

So yea.
Not as handy as it once was.

Were the 6 points applied to your Irish licence, or just on record in the UK?

bob mcbob

XsApollo wrote: »

I wasn’t riding,
I was in a car about 5 mins outside holy head.
99mph was the official figure.

I think the police did you a big favour here.

The (unwritten) rules are (on a 70mph) road
- between 70 & 90 - speeding - 3 points on licence (but police unlikely to stop you up to mid 80's) - When driving there I used to set cruise control at 83 and was never stopped
- 90 to 99 - dangerous driving - 6 points on licence
- 100+ - automatic court appearance & automatic ban.

Hotblack Desiato

XsApollo wrote: »

I wasn’t riding,
I was in a car about 5 mins outside holy head.
99mph was the official figure.

Speeding on the A5/A55 is just asking for trouble. Shooting fish in a barrel. And yeah if the official figure had been 100 or more it would have been much worse.

questionstoask wrote: »

While I'm a pretty reasonable driver....theres no way I could keep track of every 30 mile zone on the bike, and trying to follow directions, and manage traffic!!

That's a bit worrying. What if you missed a no right turn or no entry sign, you'd get creamed which is worse than getting a ticket... and we have traffic here too!

Direction signage in the UK is generally a lot better than here and clearer, the signs are usually larger and only in one language.

XsApollo

bob mcbob wrote: »

I think the police did you a big favour here.

The (unwritten) rules are (on a 70mph) road
- between 70 & 90 - speeding - 3 points on licence (but police unlikely to stop you up to mid 80's) - When driving there I used to set cruise control at 83 and was never stopped
- 90 to 99 - dangerous driving - 6 points on licence
- 100+ - automatic court appearance & automatic ban.

Yea, was an automatic summons I got.
I think rules are written now with graduated speeding fines over there.
He said nothing he could do, with regards to the summons as he had to, I was over the limit with dealing with it at the side of the road.

Anyway never heard of the changes last year to the speeding laws over there.
Won’t make the same mistake again.
Sickened I was.

XsApollo

Green_Martian wrote: »

Were the 6 points applied to your Irish licence, or just on record in the UK?

I don’t have a clue, I presume not?
I think they are just for the UK?

zubair

XsApollo wrote: »

I was in a car

Serves you right!

frozenfrozen wrote: »

hearing this **** would put you off going on holidays to scotland on the bike. doesn't matter how great the roads are if you have to budget 500 euro fine and points into your trip

Don't be put off Scotland by it, once you clear Inverness you wont see many traps and that's when the twisties start and you're in proper motorbike territory. We were making good progress all of the time and were still being overtaken by UK bikes doing some serious speeds and we never got a fine or stopped. Scotland is a great trip once you have time to make it up north. Common sense, or at least an awareness of the possibility of an accident or being caught speeding, is the best approach.

I also hear that they are very strict in Wales.

macplaxton

XsApollo wrote: »

I wasn’t riding,
I was in a car about 5 mins outside holy head.
99mph was the official figure.

That bit harsh.

bob mcbob wrote: »

I think the police did you a big favour here.

The (unwritten) rules are (on a 70mph) road
- between 70 & 90 - speeding - 3 points on licence (but police unlikely to stop you up to mid 80's) - When driving there I used to set cruise control at 83 and was never stopped
- 90 to 99 - dangerous driving - 6 points on licence
- 100+ - automatic court appearance & automatic ban.

Dangerous Driving is a separate offence. The plod may add the to the charge sheet if doing over 100 (esp. Scotland)

During my day in court a solicitor represented business bloke got away with 500GBP/5pt for 105mph.

Beware different areas. D&G have scameravans over the A74(M) motorway and dish out tickets for a low amount threshold over. Also, it doesn't jump magically from 3 to 6 pts going above/below 90. The offence can attract 3 to 6 pts. 3 for a ticket and deffo more at court, even if it's only 4.

Goose81

Was over at the formula 1 with my dad the other week.

We rented a car and the 2 observations I made were one that their roads are utter crap. This stuff people spout on about the roads being better is stories passed down from people's dad's, the roads were designed in the 1960s or whatever and you can tell, ridiculously dangerous layouts, overly complex and in bits mostly.Irish motorways are light years ahead , obviously because they are more modern

The other one which is more related to this thread, there are literally 0 signs anywhere telling you the speed limit of the road you were on. The only signs you will see are when you have to slow down to a certain number and an end sign that tells you can speed up again hit to what speed? They don't tell you

We just drove around at 60mph the whole time

macplaxton

Goose81 wrote: »

The other one which is more related to this thread, there are literally 0 signs anywhere telling you the speed limit of the road you were on. The only signs you will see are when you have to slow down to a certain number and an end sign that tells you can speed up again hit to what speed? They don't tell you

Well they do have smaller diameter repeater signs if there is a lower limit in force, however they can and do rely on just the type of road/vehicle for the rest and that's Highway Code stuff the driver learns.

e.g. "built-up areas" aka "restricted roads" = 30mph

a)in England and Wales, there is provided on it a system of street lighting furnished by means of lamps placed not more than 200 yards apart;

b)in Scotland, there is provided on it a system of carriageway lighting furnished by means of lamps placed not more than 185 metres apart and the road is of a classification or type specified for the purposes of this subsection in regulations made by the Scottish Ministers.

The de-restricted roads



means...National Speed Limit applies. WTF is the NSL?

Well the Highway Code generalises as this:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/general-rules-techniques-and-advice-for-all-drivers-and-riders-103-to-158#speedlimits

(which is the abridged version of this: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1984/27/schedule/6)

Which is straight forward for cars and motorcycles. Where even locals come a cropper is the 2 tonne limit for vans. So Mr Rental Transit can easily be doing 10mph more than he is supposed to be doing on a single/dual carriageway. Also the speed limits are now a devolved matter to Scottish Government, so the HGV speed limit increase from 40/50 mph (single carriageway) to 50/60mph (dual carriageway) isn't mirrored in Scotland (or for that matter in NI), but there is a 50mph limit for HGVs on specified single carriageway parts of the A9 in Scotland, but only because they went mad with putting average speed cameras on it...


...the direction signage is very good in GB though.