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M50 ITS Upgrade - Variable Speed Limits [tender; implementation due by 2019]

  • 28-06-2018 12:16am
    #1
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,291 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    This has been discussed previously in a number of threads but now that the ball is rolling I'll start a thread on it.

    TII have issued a tender for the ITS upgrade of the M50 primarily focused on the implementation of variable speed limits and lane control indicators.

    https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders/ViewNotice/204708

    This will require legislation to be passed to make this system legally compliant


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 574 ✭✭✭Aontachtoir


    marno21 wrote: »
    This has been discussed previously in a number of threads but now that the ball is rolling I'll start a thread on it.

    TII have issued a tender for the ITS upgrade of the M50 primarily focused on the implementation of variable speed limits and lane control indicators.

    https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders/ViewNotice/204708

    This will require legislation to be passed to make this system legally compliant
    30 million euro - they're not messing around with the variable speed limits. Glad to see it. Don't see anything here about multipoint tolling though. That will surely require further significant infrastructural upgrades in future (although possibly these upgrades could be limited to the entrances and exits only).


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,351 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    30 million euro - they're not messing around with the variable speed limits. Glad to see it. Don't see anything here about multipoint tolling though. That will surely require further significant infrastructural upgrades in future (although possibly these upgrades could be limited to the entrances and exits only).

    Politically unpalatable (at the moment, and with an election potentially within the next 6-9 months) what with the M50 at breaking point due to piss-poor public transport alternatives for the most part, high fuel costs, and more people being priced out of Dublin due to rents and housing shortages and forced to commute.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,783 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    Without reading it all, how are they going to enforce these variable speed limits? If they don't litter it with cameras, the entire thing will be utterly ignored.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 66,442 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Without reading it all, how are they going to enforce these variable speed limits? If they don't litter it with cameras, the entire thing will be utterly ignored.

    The gantries will presumably have average speed cameras on them.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,093 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    APNR cameras have to be part of the system or there will be no enforcement.

    Experience from the UK shows that when these brightly yellow painted cameras are pointed at oncoming vehicles every few Kms, drivers find it uncomfortable to be going over the posted speed limit by even the slightest amount, and all three lanes plod along at precisely the speed limit. [The cameras could be dummies for all anyone knows - no-one wants to find out].

    Once they have your reg number and where and when it was seen, tolls are just an exercise of sending out bills for those that do not pay. The hard infrastructure will already be there.

    It is inevitable that toll will follow variable speed limits as night follows day. How else will they pay for the cost and maintenance?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 574 ✭✭✭Aontachtoir


    Once they have your reg number and where and when it was seen, tolls are just an exercise of sending out bills for those that do not pay.  The hard infrastructure will already be there.
    That's true, but they will also need to include sensors for eFlow tags and the like.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,291 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Michael Nolan of TII has constantly reiterated these two points:

    1. Traffic growth on the M50 is ahead of planned growth, and the level of traffic seen now wasn't expected to be seen until the 2020s. If proper demand management measures aren't placed on the M50 it will grind to a halt
    2. There are no road based solutions to the M50. TII will implement a number of measures to "sweat the asset" but this will not increase capacity more improve flow and reliability. The solution is not additional lanes/widening the M50/double decking the M50/building an 80km alternative through rural Kildare and Meath. The solution is reducing traffic via public transport improvements

    Of course, politicians will not listen to these and constantly talk down multipoint tolling and suggest the above widening/double decking etc which will benefit no one. There is no silver bullet here and the people who need to hear this are the ones who will not listen.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 66,442 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    I'd be willing to guess that the W8 route in BusConnects will pull an appreciable number of single occupant cars off the M50 - linking high population areas of North Kildare to Greenogue and Citywest. The bus route is actually much shorter than via the M50 but its not one you'd necessarily want to drive tired in the evenings plus there are delays that any bus priority measures will skip past (Newcastle Village particularly)


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,783 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    Anyone else notice the VMS signs on the M50 have changed in the last two days?

    They used to say

    Travel Time Mins
    J14 Dundrum 7
    M11 J5 Bray 12


    Now they have added a third destination

    J14 Dundrum 7 mins
    J15 C'Mines 9 mins
    M11 J5 Bray 12 mins


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,104 ✭✭✭nordydan


    Anyone else notice the VMS signs on the M50 have changed in the last two days?

    They used to say

    Travel Time Mins
    J14 Dundrum 7
    M11 J5 Bray 12


    Now they have added a third destination

    J14 Dundrum 7 mins
    J15 C'Mines 9 mins
    M11 J5 Bray 12 mins
    Great idea. If it says J15 5 mins and M11 J5 20 mins you know to take an alternative route


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,199 ✭✭✭markpb


    nordydan wrote: »
    Great idea. If it says J15 5 mins and M11 J5 20 mins you know to take an alternative route

    Unlike their insistence on telling you northbound that N4 is 6 minutes and N3 is 7 minutes. The most useless sign on the motorway.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,291 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21




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