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Rent increase and renewal

  • 21-06-2018 7:37pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    I have a few questions regarding me and my girlfriends rent situation.

    Our second year is coming to an end in just over a month but we would like to renew for a third year.

    We are a little worried that the rent may be increased or at worse we would be asked to leave.

    Over the past 2 years we have had no trouble with noise complaints or any warnings whatsoever. Maintenance has been requested a couple of times and early on the lack of urgency was unseen before compared to previous property's I have rented.

    What is the best way to continue for another year at least and not incur an increase in rent?

    Should we call the estate agent now which is just over a month from our second year ending?
    Would it be better for it to roll over into the start of year 3 or would this give us a disadvantage. As in could they just then give us one months notice to leave because we have not signed a lease agreement?


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 7,396 ✭✭✭ theteal


    You have part 4 rights so you don't have to do anything. They can't ask you to leave unless under certain strict conditions e.g. selling, needed for family etc. They may indeed review the rent but I'm fairly sure they have to give more than a months notice.

    Just sit tight.


  • Administrators Posts: 33,521 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭ dudara


    Don’t do anything. You have Part IV rights so no need to request a renewal of your lease.

    If they want a rent increase, let them come to you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    Thanks for the advice guys.

    Ok but if we enter the third year without signing a lease agreement can they not just give us one months notice at any point in time?

    We were thinking of requesting to sign the third year maybe 20 days before year two runs out. It is important for is to sign a 12 months lease to guarantee another year where we are.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,396 ✭✭✭ theteal


    No, you have part 4 rights which gives you basically 4 years (i'm rusty, it may be 6 these days) to stay in the property unless they have a valid reason to need it back.

    Seriously, you don't need to do anything.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,459 ✭✭✭ Bubbaclaus


    DarraghR wrote: »
    Thanks for the advice guys.

    Ok but if we enter the third year without signing a lease agreement can they not just give us one months notice at any point in time?

    We were thinking of requesting to sign the third year maybe 20 days before year two runs out. It is important for is to sign a 12 months lease to guarantee another year where we are.

    You have Part IV, why are you so preoccupied about signing a lease? I wouldnt be looking to sign anything.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,399 ✭✭✭ wirelessdude01


    In a scenario like this do you have to sign a new tenancy agreement if one is produced by the LL?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,186 ✭✭✭ fash


    In a scenario like this do you have to sign a new tenancy agreement if one is produced by the LL?
    If you want to reduce your rights, sign it. If you like keeping your rights, don't sign it - part 4 already gives you everything you need.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,372 ✭✭✭ FishOnABike


    The residential tenancy board one stop shop site https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/ has lots of useful information on tenancy, part 4 rights, rent pressure zones and rent reviews etc.

    It is worth a read. You (or your landlord) cannot contract out of provisions of the residential tenancies act.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,186 ✭✭✭ fash


    The residential tenancy board one stop shop site https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/ has lots of useful information on tenancy, part 4 rights, rent pressure zones and rent reviews etc.

    It is worth a read. You (or your landlord) cannot contract out of provisions of the residential tenancies act.
    The tenant can tie themselves into a fixed term tenancy from what would otherwise be effectively a unilaterally at-will tenancy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,372 ✭✭✭ FishOnABike


    fash wrote: »
    The tenant can tie themselves into a fixed term tenancy from what would otherwise be effectively a unilaterally at-will tenancy.

    That would be adding to the existing rights under a part four tenancy as it would prevent the tenancy being terminated (even for the limited conditions it could be under part four) up to the end of the fixed term tenancy.

    A part four tenancy couldn't be regarded as being unilaterally at will as it can only be terminated by the landlord for a very limited number of specific reasons. e.g. sale, for an immediate family member, substantial renovations (ie structural building work), ...


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  • Administrators Posts: 33,521 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭ dudara


    DarraghR wrote: »
    Thanks for the advice guys.

    Ok but if we enter the third year without signing a lease agreement can they not just give us one months notice at any point in time?

    Once you are over 2 years, you are entitled to 56 days notice, and it can only be for a specific set of reasons (consult the RTB website).
    We were thinking of requesting to sign the third year maybe 20 days before year two runs out. It is important for is to sign a 12 months lease to guarantee another year where we are.

    You can sign a lease if you want, but check the break/termination clauses carefully. Some clauses will allow a landlord to terminate for given reasons, other leases will provide you full assurance for the 12 months. However, no lease can supercede your Part IV rights.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,244 Mod ✭✭✭✭ The_Conductor


    The landlord is entitled to review the rent- and a rent review does not have to coincide with the lease dates. For any tenancy that commenced prior to 24th December 2016 (such as yours)- a landlord can only review the rent after you have been a tenant for 2 years- i.e. you are now due a rent review- and your initial rent review is for a max of 4%. Thereafter- the landlord can review your rent every 12 months- at 4% per annum (the initial review is 4% for the first two years)- subject to prevailing market rents. The landlord is not obliged to conduct a rent review however.

    So- all told- if the landlord does now decide to conduct a rent review- the rent increase is a maximum of 4% for a 2 year old tenancy- and then 4% per annum- thereafter.

    Note- a rent increase can only occur 90 days after the notice of rent review- and a rent review can only occur initially after 24 months- and if in an RPZ- every 12 months thereafter (with the increase, if there is one, kicking in 90 days after the notice of rent review).

    Hope this helps.


  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    We have just received a call from the estate agent handling the property. We can stay on but rent will be increased by 4%. This notice of increase is give less than 2 weeks before our current lease expires.

    It would be €22 a week each which is not bad considering our location and current rental situation in Dublin.

    I would be asking for a couple of things before signing. Maintenance like boiler, toilet etc.

    Our fridge is tiny and we only have a freezer box so was thinking of asking for a small box freezer. Should I even bother. Is this a big ask?

    Going back to the short notice of rent increase is there any point challenging this? We are quite happy here and do not want to compromise our situation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,974 ✭✭✭ TheChizler


    DarraghR wrote: »
    We have just received a call from the estate agent handling the property. We can stay on but rent will be increased by 4%. This notice of increase is give less than 2 weeks before our current lease expires.
    I can't remember the exact rule right now and someone will be here to correct/confirm, but in an RPZ doesn't notice of rent increase have to happen after the two year anniversary of the last rent increase (or start of tenancy), not before? I'm definitely remembering something wrong there but it's worth clarifying.

    Edit: That may only apply to tenancies created after before December 23rd 2016.

    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/during-a-tenancy/rent-reviews-in-a-rent-pressure-zone-rpz/

    So the notice is invalid if served before the two year anniversary of the start of your tenancy.

    You need to be given 90 days notice as well.


  • Administrators Posts: 33,521 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭ dudara


    Also, IIRC, you need 90 days notification in writing before a rent increase can take effect. The rent increase does not have to happen at the same time as the lease expiring


  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    Emailed the estate agent 2 days ago to confirm everything discussed over the phone. Just highlighted the rent increase and asked would that begin 90 days after signing the new lease. Also added a maintenance list of things to be fixed and asked about a counter top freezer.

    No reply so emailed today asking was our previous email received. Hopefully he wont try something on like issue our notice ...


  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    Still no response from the estate agent.

    We just paid the first month of our 3rd year anyway. My girlfriend read somewhere that we automatically can stay in the property for 4 years at a certain stage.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭ Baby01032012


    What your girlfriend is referring to is your Part IV rights. Once you’re there more than 6 months these kick in. As your tenancy started before December 2016 you have right to stay for 4 years unless specific conditions met such as sale, relative moving in or substantial refurb. For any tenancies starting after December 2016 the part Iv term is 6 years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    Got a 15 month lease and we can leave in the first 3 months and retain our deposit. 4% rent increase starts on the 4th month.

    Just waiting on maintenance issues to be addressed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,459 ✭✭✭ Bubbaclaus


    I wouldn't have tied myself into a 15 month lease when you have Part IV there. Presumably if you must leave after, say 6 months, you are potentially on the hook for 9 months rent?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭ DarraghR


    We prefer to know that we are guaranteed at least 1 year based on location and prices


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭ Baby01032012


    DarraghR wrote: »
    We prefer to know that we are guaranteed at least 1 year based on location and prices

    You don’t need a fixed term lease to guarantee that really. Once there 6 months you have Part IV rights which means you can now stay up to 6 years unless limited circumstances.

    Either way you can be in situ not pay rent and landlord and Rtb will take on average a year to get to you out.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭ davo10


    You don’t need a fixed term lease to guarantee that really. Once there 6 months you have Part IV rights which means you can now stay up to 6 years unless limited circumstances.

    Either way you can be in situ not pay rent and landlord and Rtb will take on average a year to get to you out.

    Two of the most common reasons landlords use to evict tenant during part4 is sale of property and relative moving in. If the tenant has a fixed term lease, eviction for those reasons is not permissible during the term of the lease.

    Your name will be on the RTB site, a mass murderer would have a better chance of getting a place to rent in the future.


  • Registered Users Posts: 58 ✭✭✭ Bainneban


    DarraghR wrote: »
    Still no response from the estate agent.

    We just paid the first month of our 3rd year anyway. My girlfriend read somewhere that we automatically can stay in the property for 4 years at a certain stage.

    Darragh, possibly your girlfriend read it on this thread! Several posters have told you about part 4 tenancy rights and you don't seem to have taken it in at all? Google what it is and your mind will be at rest....it will also stop people having to keep repeating the information to you. There are benefits to a lease as mentioned above but you won't be kicked out without reason.


  • Registered Users Posts: 58 ✭✭✭ Bainneban


    Either way you can be in situ not pay rent and landlord and Rtb will take on average a year to get to you out.

    Horrible advice. Pay your rent.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 789 Turnipman


    Bainneban wrote: »
    Horrible advice. Pay your rent.

    It's factual information, unfortunately. But I agree that it's a horrible situation for any decent landlord to have been put in by a government of cowards.


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