Can girls and boys be friends?

Amanda_2599

Hello,

Hoping that some of you can help. Bit of a background. With my BF for 2 years, live together, everything going well, or so I thought. He's a good guy only bad thing I can say would be I get a LOT of constructive comments. Any imperfection gets pointed out, you would swear he is perfect (he does think highly of himself). Not a huge deal. He goes out most weekends with his friends, has a good social life etc. Last few months, things have been a little distant, something changed, but don't you go through ups and downs in relationships?

So to the problem....

A few times a year, he visits his brother in the Manchester for a weekend. This is no problem. Monday he tells me in 4 weeks he is going to Manchester to his brother for the weekend, but he will be going on a Thursday, because he wants to meet a friend in London. He will be in London until Saturday morning and will get the train up to Manchester to his brother.

I said cool, which friend is he. He then tells me its a girl that he used to work with 4 years ago and was very friendly with. He told me she recently connected with him on Facebook and they have been catching up. I said oh ok, is she single (laughing) and he said no she has a boyfriend. I had to go to work so left it at that. While in work, I went through his friend list (something I never did before) and there she was, Her status is "Single" which of course may be wrong maybe she didn't update it etc.
I went back to work, but there is something niggling at me since then. I asked him when I went home, nicely, who was this girl as I couldn't remember. He told me about her and it clicked, I remembered. They had worked together for 2 years before we met and when I first got with him he told me about her and how he used to fancy her. I said to him, oh, you used to fancy her - is that the girl? and he said calmly yes, but I don't anymore so its ok and then started to laugh strangely, like he thought it was hilarious. I said to him oh ok, that is a bit out of nowhere, and got a huge lecture on how I should be more trusting and without trust we have nothing. I didn't say anything back, just said ok no problem as you cannot argue with him. He either plays the victim or twists the row around on me so I don't bother.
So, I left it at that for now.

But since then I am starting to question things and I don't like doing that.  Why fly over to meet her? Why she not come over here? Do I have MUG across my forehead? Why even bother with someone that hasn't been in your life in years, if they didn't make a big impact on your life (so maybe she did)? Is things a little different now because my gut is telling me something is going on? See, I never get thoughts like this in my head, until now, for the first time, which scares me.

Advice please.

Thanks

work

Amanda_2599 wrote: »

Hello,

Hoping that some of you can help. Bit of a background. With my BF for 2 years, live together, everything going well, or so I thought. He's a good guy only bad thing I can say would be I get a LOT of constructive comments. Any imperfection gets pointed out, you would swear he is perfect (he does think highly of himself). Not a huge deal. He goes out most weekends with his friends, has a good social life etc. Last few months, things have been a little distant, something changed, but don't you go through ups and downs in relationships?

So to the problem....

A few times a year, he visits his brother in the Manchester for a weekend. This is no problem. Monday he tells me in 4 weeks he is going to Manchester to his brother for the weekend, but he will be going on a Thursday, because he wants to meet a friend in London. He will be in London until Saturday morning and will get the train up to Manchester to his brother.

I said cool, which friend is he. He then tells me its a girl that he used to work with 4 years ago and was very friendly with. He told me she recently connected with him on Facebook and they have been catching up. I said oh ok, is she single (laughing) and he said no she has a boyfriend. I had to go to work so left it at that. While in work, I went through his friend list (something I never did before) and there she was, Her status is "Single" which of course may be wrong maybe she didn't update it etc.
I went back to work, but there is something niggling at me since then. I asked him when I went home, nicely, who was this girl as I couldn't remember. He told me about her and it clicked, I remembered. They had worked together for 2 years before we met and when I first got with him he told me about her and how he used to fancy her. I said to him, oh, you used to fancy her - is that the girl? and he said calmly yes, but I don't anymore so its ok and then started to laugh strangely, like he thought it was hilarious. I said to him oh ok, that is a bit out of nowhere, and got a huge lecture on how I should be more trusting and without trust we have nothing. I didn't say anything back, just said ok no problem as you cannot argue with him. He either plays the victim or twists the row around on me so I don't bother.
So, I left it at that for now.

But since then I am starting to question things and I don't like doing that.  Why fly over to meet her? Why she not come over here? Do I have MUG across my forehead? Why even bother with someone that hasn't been in your life in years, if they didn't make a big impact on your life (so maybe she did)? Is things a little different now because my gut is telling me something is going on? See, I never get thoughts like this in my head, until now, for the first time, which scares me.

Advice please.

Thanks

Difficult but simple one. As a guy I can honestly tell you there is no way to know. He may have no intention of anything happening....but it might anyway or he might have every intention.
If you cannot trust this tell him you are not comfortable him staying with someone he fancied that he has had little contact with. Give an ultimatum but be prepared to pay with your relationship. Risky either way!!
Sorry you probably wanted a simple answer but this is not simple.

GingerLily

I wouldn't be trustful in this situation, he doesn't want to just visit her, he's staying the night, two nights actually.

Even if you want to trust your boyfriend, you can't trust her, and there is history there.

Meeting old friends in a pub is one thing, but flying to a different country for a sleepover is a totally different thing altogether.

Also London and Manchester aren't particularly close, it's not a convenient detour at all.

frankythefish

He was honest, and said it was a girl

Mongfinder General

Are you going to be with this man for the rest of your life? If not, get rid because he sounds like a pr1ck.

professore

He's a narcissist and playing you like a fiddle. The whole criticising you all the time is a huge red flag.

He's setting you up so he can cheat with other women and you will just put up with it.

Get out. This is a toxic guy.

iamwhoiam

Listen to your gut instinct . He is guilt tripping you for even questioning his behaviour and not trying to reassure you . Tell him straight out you do not like the idea at all and he can deal with it . See how he reacts to that and if you come first

Sephiroth_dude

frankythefish wrote: »

He was honest, and said it was a girl

He also said she had a b/f.

mapaca

I don't like the sound of this guy at all. He's constantly critical of you, twists arguments around, and is now trying to make out that YOU'RE the unreasonable one for not wanting him to go and spend two nights with a girl who he "used to" have feelings for, but "doesn't any more". Please. The long lecture on trust is a classic deflection technique from someone who knows they're the one in the wrong.

I think your gut feeling is spot on here. He is trying to make a mug out of you.

CPTM

I have many girls-who-are-friends. We go hiking, to the movies, sometimes amongst other mates, sometimes just us. I've known them longer than my girlfriend. I still need to be a responsible boyfriend though, so I make sure she's met all of them, can join us whenever she wants (unless they're having a personal issue and they need a chat), and I certainly have boundaries where I wouldn't sleep over. Basically I turn the tables and imagine what I would appreciate if the shoe was on the other foot. But that's a basic requirement for any dilemma in a relationship.

woodchuck

Can girls and boys be friends? Yes, of course.

However, the situation you've described sounds dodgy to me. It doesn't sound like they were close friends before, but he had feelings for her in past, has been chatting to her on facebook recently, has also recently been distant with you and now he's going over to London to visit her? Your gut is giving you a bad feeling for a reason and I think it's justified.

As for his "constructive comments", that would be a huge red flag in any relationship. I suspect there is more going on here than you're willing to admit.

Amanda_2599

Thank you all for the comments. It really helps to know that I am not overreacting. I went to bed last night, one half of me thinking - whats the problem, other thinking no, this is a bit something. I couldn't put my finger on it, but I think its a bit disrespectful? Maybe that is not the right word.
I am confident in myself, so his comments are water off a ducks back. Although I do not like them, I just ignore them and laugh them off. Also, his circle of friends do include 3 girls who he would go out drinking with. This is totally cool with me and I never once would even question him about it. I am not a jealous person, although this situation has me questioning things and I do not like that. I never question anything, about myself or him.

So this morning, I woke up to spend the day with my friend. At breakfast I was chatting to my BF about stuff and one of the topics was, what do you want to do on the weekend. Jokingly I said to him "Fly to London to visit an old guy I used to work with and fancy" and I started to laugh. He turned around to me and said "Look, if you have a problem with this, then its your problem and not mine - come back to me when you have got over it". Very smug and very cocky.

I said to him, would you mind if tables were turned and it was me planning on meeting an old friend? - he said "No, not at all I do not see a big deal". Then he started about trust. I told him to stop talking I have to get ready. (These trust arguments always are the same, him saying I do not trust him and then saying how I am just perfect, he is such a bad guy, he is the worst person in the world) - This annoys me because I never said these things to him in his life. This is how he twists things and this is why we don't argue much because I cannot listen to it. Also, he cannot say I do not trust him. He can spend hours texting his friend who is a girl and I have never once minded or even asked what they talk about. None of my business. He goes out drinking with his girl friends and I never once questioned him or even ask what they do.

So, that smugness this morning irritated me. Not because of what he said, but the way he said it. Also, I don't like that he thinks something is annoying me and just doesn't seem to care. Granted, maybe he doesn't know how much as I haven't said much to him about it. So I went to my friends house. She thinks I should tell him not to go or Ill walk. I couldn't do this. Because that's not me. I cannot tell someone else what to do and also, imagine if he had feelings for this girl, and didn't go. I would be living a lie, something obviously is not right if he had had feelings in the first place.
While there talking to her, a notification came up on my phone. My boyfriend "liked" and photo this girl put up this morning. Then, he wrote a comment underneath. "Ill have to come over and visit soon " -

Now for some reason, that winky face has just made me both angry, and also has just made me think, you sad sad man - living in the past as usual. I did also laugh as I couldn't believe it. So an hour after I leave, he is thinking of her with his stupid comment.
Knowing who I am, I need to walk. Once I make up my mind, I cannot change it and for some reason that winky face has just woken me up. Infact, I don't even want to talk with him. And funnily enough, it doesn't even bother me, I am not upset. I am a bit angry, because this situation made me question things (I am not an overthinker and I never question things - yet this situation made me do these things - this situation he caused).


The smugness of this morning and the winky face has just made me see a side to him I do not like and unfortunately there is no going back from that for me. I have made up my mind and once I do that I cannot go back. Reason being, not the trip itself. But the smugness and the fact he is telling me its my problem and making out this is me overreacting. I saw something today, I may have seen from him before but for whatever reason today just finished it. (I haven't even gone mad at him over it, simply mentioned it nicely to him twice! both replies from him were smug and cold) Why even bother flying to UK to meet someone from your past? They are in your past for a reason - leave them there.

Thank you all for the replies and for reassuring me that at least some people see this is a bit strange.

Also, yes - he was honest and told me it was a girl - with a nice smugness and then a sly little laugh after.

Funny someone mentioned narcissistic, he friend told me over a year ago he was this.

GingerLily

What an a$$!!

Dump him, don't bother with a long excuse, he knows, don't let him talk you around

facehugger99

It's pretty much guaranteed he's going to try and bang this girl over in London.

TBH he sounds like an obnoxious, self-centered, manipulative prick.

You would be better of without someone like this trying to mind-fcuk you.

LegacyUser

Amanda_2599 wrote: »

Why fly over to meet her?.

He's not, hes going over to visit his brother and is making a stop on the way to see a friend. I do this all the time as i've friends all over,

Amanda_2599 wrote: »

Why she not come over here?

Because he's going over to see his brother anyway and said he'd stop off and meet up? Maybe she'll come over here in the future, you never know.

Amanda_2599 wrote: »

Why even bother with someone that hasn't been in your life in years, if they didn't make a big impact on your life (so maybe she did)?

You said he's going to London Thursday and not going to Manchester till Saturday so is the only reason for going to London to see her or is he meeting other people/doing other stuff in London? Is he staying with her? Going out of his way to spend several days with her and only her might make me ask questions.


to answer the thread title yes OP girls and boys can be friends. i've plenty of male, female, gay, straight, non-binary and transgender friends - big old melting pot of friends but i only see them as friends of course. One of my best friends is a male friend from college. We go to see iron maiden together any chance we get and have followed them round the world. We've shared beds together in ****ty hostels on some occasions while broke and travelling and his wife has no issue. I was best 'man' at his wedding and consider his wife as good a friend as him now (but she doesn't like Iron maiden so refuses to come with us)

Every relationship is different OP because all people are different, no one can tell you what your OH's relationship is with this person as we don't know him or her. If you are uncomfortable then you need to talk to him otherwise your relationship will just suffer regardless of wither there is or isn't anything going on

Katgurl

OP I am so happy to read your last post. I was halfway through and thinking you should dump this loser and not bother with an ultimatum or argument and then I see that's exactly what you intend to do.

By the way you sound amazingly cool & level headed and he is an absolute fool for messing this up.

Arrival

Amanda_2599 wrote: »

Thank you all for the comments. It really helps to know that I am not overreacting. I went to bed last night, one half of me thinking - whats the problem, other thinking no, this is a bit something. I couldn't put my finger on it, but I think its a bit disrespectful? Maybe that is not the right word.
I am confident in myself, so his comments are water off a ducks back. Although I do not like them, I just ignore them and laugh them off. Also, his circle of friends do include 3 girls who he would go out drinking with. This is totally cool with me and I never once would even question him about it. I am not a jealous person, although this situation has me questioning things and I do not like that. I never question anything, about myself or him.

So this morning, I woke up to spend the day with my friend. At breakfast I was chatting to my BF about stuff and one of the topics was, what do you want to do on the weekend. Jokingly I said to him "Fly to London to visit an old guy I used to work with and fancy" and I started to laugh. He turned around to me and said "Look, if you have a problem with this, then its your problem and not mine - come back to me when you have got over it". Very smug and very cocky.

I said to him, would you mind if tables were turned and it was me planning on meeting an old friend? - he said "No, not at all I do not see a big deal". Then he started about trust. I told him to stop talking I have to get ready. (These trust arguments always are the same, him saying I do not trust him and then saying how I am just perfect, he is such a bad guy, he is the worst person in the world) - This annoys me because I never said these things to him in his life. This is how he twists things and this is why we don't argue much because I cannot listen to it. Also, he cannot say I do not trust him. He can spend hours texting his friend who is a girl and I have never once minded or even asked what they talk about. None of my business. He goes out drinking with his girl friends and I never once questioned him or even ask what they do.

So, that smugness this morning irritated me. Not because of what he said, but the way he said it. Also, I don't like that he thinks something is annoying me and just doesn't seem to care. Granted, maybe he doesn't know how much as I haven't said much to him about it. So I went to my friends house. She thinks I should tell him not to go or Ill walk. I couldn't do this. Because that's not me. I cannot tell someone else what to do and also, imagine if he had feelings for this girl, and didn't go. I would be living a lie, something obviously is not right if he had had feelings in the first place.
While there talking to her, a notification came up on my phone. My boyfriend "liked" and photo this girl put up this morning. Then, he wrote a comment underneath. "Ill have to come over and visit soon " -

Now for some reason, that winky face has just made me both angry, and also has just made me think, you sad sad man - living in the past as usual. I did also laugh as I couldn't believe it. So an hour after I leave, he is thinking of her with his stupid comment.
Knowing who I am, I need to walk. Once I make up my mind, I cannot change it and for some reason that winky face has just woken me up. Infact, I don't even want to talk with him. And funnily enough, it doesn't even bother me, I am not upset. I am a bit angry, because this situation made me question things (I am not an overthinker and I never question things - yet this situation made me do these things - this situation he caused).


The smugness of this morning and the winky face has just made me see a side to him I do not like and unfortunately there is no going back from that for me. I have made up my mind and once I do that I cannot go back. Reason being, not the trip itself. But the smugness and the fact he is telling me its my problem and making out this is me overreacting. I saw something today, I may have seen from him before but for whatever reason today just finished it. (I haven't even gone mad at him over it, simply mentioned it nicely to him twice! both replies from him were smug and cold) Why even bother flying to UK to meet someone from your past? They are in your past for a reason - leave them there.

Thank you all for the replies and for reassuring me that at least some people see this is a bit strange.

Also, yes - he was honest and told me it was a girl - with a nice smugness and then a sly little laugh after.

Funny someone mentioned narcissistic, he friend told me over a year ago he was this.

Start researching about narcissists and abuse before breaking up with him to get an idea of how he may behave after you do. The absolute best way to break-up with such a **** person is with as little contact as possible, ghost him if at all possible, but just stay no contact. No matter what. Don't even give him the justification of a reason, just tell him it's over and block him everywhere. The next time someone close to someone mentions that they're something so seriously, do not take it lightly and disregard it!

messy tessy

Mongfinder General wrote: »

Are you going to be with this man for the rest of your life? If not, get rid because he sounds like a pr1ck.

The whole 'constructive criticism' thing would bother me more than the visiting an old friend thing. Even if you are super confident this could chip away at you over time.

I think you need to ask yourself - is this honestly the person you want to be with? Someone who clearly doesn't have your back?

WIZWEB

professore wrote: »

He's a narcissist and playing you like a fiddle. The whole criticising you all the time is a huge red flag.

He's setting you up so he can cheat with other women and you will just put up with it.

Get out. This is a toxic guy.

After reading through your various posts OP I have to agree with this poster and others. There's a tactic narcissists high on the spectrum use called 'Triangulation'. It basically involves Narcissists bringing other people into your relationship for various toxic reasons. This can include to make you/the other/both jealous while feeding their own precious egos, to play you off each other, to have a bit on the side, to groom your replacement or various combinations of these and other reasons. None of this is good for your mental health.

They also like to visit former 'sources of narcissistic supply'. Exes or former flings are seen by them as possessions to be taken off the shelf and discarded at will. The only escape from their mindgames is to walk away, block and never engage in contact again. Believe me I've had my experiences with them and read enough literature and stupidly went back several times after leaving for rinse and repeat and it almost killed me in the end. They have a personality disorder and cannot be fixed. You can be though when you ask yourself why you are enabling and in a relationship with someone who treats you with such contempt and disrespect.

retro:electro

Not a fcuking chance would I allow that. Let him off to see Miss Manchester and let him see how far it gets him. He certainly would not be sleeping in my bed after it.
The neck!

Purple Mountain

He's very short sighted.
She lives in Manchester. What?, it's 2 days of fun or fantasy or whatever..then he's home to a lifetime of loneliness because he's longterm girlfriend is now gone.

pc7

Op fantastic to realise you see the wood from the trees. Amazing how the smiley wink sealed it! Sometimes it’s the little things. He’s a douche, well rid!!!

GingerLily

pc7 wrote: »

Op fantastic to realise you see the wood from the trees. Amazing how the smiley wink sealed it! Sometimes it’s the little things. He’s a douche, well rid!!!

If I were her I'd be tempted to comment under saying 'Enjoy ' and then ghost him.

Mongfinder General

retro:electro wrote: »

Not a fcuking chance would I allow that. Let him off to see Miss Manchester and let him see how far it gets him. He certainly would not be sleeping in my bed after it.
The neck!

In the space of 4 days I’d have moved out, changed telephone numbers and blocked social media. The only connection left would be the op’s place of work which I suppose rat boy could visit. However that could soon be remedied.

mapaca

Good for you OP. Well done for recognising ****ty treatment and not putting up with it. You are well rid.

Anon10000

Mongfinder General wrote: »

In the space of 4 days I’d have moved out, changed telephone numbers and blocked social media. The only connection left would be the op’s place of work which I suppose rat boy could visit. However that could soon be remedied.

Well done you certainly move quick when you make up your mind. Take care of your self you deserve better

tara73

OP, I'm so happy for you you will dump him and made this decision that quick without hesitation. you deserve so, so much better than this narcissistic, manipulative prick.

Alibaba

Amanda_2599 wrote: »

Thank you all for the comments. It really helps to know that I am not overreacting. I went to bed last night, one half of me thinking - whats the problem, other thinking no, this is a bit something. I couldn't put my finger on it, but I think its a bit disrespectful? Maybe that is not the right word.

You're absolutely right , it is the right word . It is disrespectful to say the least. It shows a complete lack of consideration for you.

You sound far too good for him.

You're better off rid , and find somebody who shows you a bit more respect

professore

Fair play OP.