No permitted vehicular access

Bcamp73

Advice need please.

I’ve just viewed a beautiful property, with stunning stone gateway with gates that access the drive, the front garden has been landscaped to a very high standard.

The owners applied for retention for the house and Gatrage last year, which was granted with 5 conditions.

The estate agent was not aware of the below conditions, we wanted to put in a offer but surely the planning issue will affect the property value. See below conditions
SCHEDULE

1.​(a)​Development shall be carried out strictly in accordance with lodged plans and details, submitted to and received by the Planning Authority on the 11th July 2016, save as hereinunder otherwise required.
​(b)​Existing vehicular entrance shall be permanently put beyond use, in accordance with lodged plans and details, submitted to and received by the Planning Authority on the on 11th July 2016, within a period of 1 month of the completion of the new vehicular entrance herein permitted.

Reason:​In order to define the permission and to cater for orderly development.

2.​Prior to commencement of development, permanent visibility splays of 70m. shall be provided in each direction at a point 2.4 metres back from road edge at location of vehicular entrance onto the public road. Visibility in the vertical plane shall be measured from a driver’s eye- height of 1.05 metres and 2 metres positioned at the setback distance in the direct access to an object height of between 0.26 metres and 1.05 metres. Vision Splays to be calculated and provided as per Figure 7 of Section 10.2.10 of Chapter 10 (Development and Technical Standards), County Donegal Development Plan 2012 – 2018 (as varied).

Reason:​In the interests of traffic safety.

3.​(a)​The existing roadside boundary shall be removed and shall incorporate an entrance with a minimum width at road fence to line of gates of 9.15m minimum depth from road fence to line of gates of 2.45m and a minimum, width on line of gates of 4.9m as set out in Figure 6 of Section 10.2.4 of Chapter 10 (Development and Technical Standards) of the County Development Plan, 2012-2018 (as varied) and based on new fenceline.

Reason:​To preserve the amenities of the area and in the interests of traffic safety.

(b)​Area between old and new entrance shall be finished with a wet mix macadam, in accordance with details to be agreed with the Executive Engineer (Roads) for the area (Telephone 074 9153900). Gully (1 no.) shall be provided at lowest point of frontage. Area thereafter shall be maintained by applicant.

Reason:​In the interests of traffic safety.

(c)​All overhead and underground poles and lines shall be set back to line of new fenceline at developers expense and no obstructing pole(s) shall be left on layby.

Reason: To cater for orderly development and in the interests of traffic safety.

Thank you

testicles

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davo10

It says you need to put in a new entrance in the interest of safety, and close up the old one. Pretty straightforward I would have thought.

Lumen

A great example of why it's better to ask permission than forgiveness in planning matters.

But it seems like you want to use this to lowball them, which rarely goes down well.

listermint

Lumen wrote: »

A great example of why it's better to ask permission than forgiveness in planning matters.

But it seems like you want to use this to lowball them, which rarely goes down well.

No access to the house would be a substantial reason for a lower offer , all things considered

Lumen

listermint wrote: »

No access to the house would be a substantial reason for a lower offer , all things considered

Sure, but my experience of properties with planning issues is that the vendor holds out for someone who doesn't care, or eventually drops the price and sells to someone else.

But you're right, this seems like a massive issue that can't be kicked down the road. Would a bank even give a mortgage without this being resolved before sale?

listermint

Lumen wrote: »

Sure, but my experience of properties with planning issues is that the vendor holds out for someone who doesn't care, or eventually drops the price and sells to someone else.

But you're right, this seems like a massive issue that can't be kicked down the road. Would a bank even give a mortgage without this being resolved before sale?

Definitely not .

Pkiernan

It's disgraceful that a property is being sold with those conditions on it, and the EA doesn't know about them.

That work will not be cheap, and relocation of under and over dround lines will be very time consuming.

Glass fused light

Lumen wrote: »

But you're right, this seems like a massive issue that can't be kicked down the road. Would a bank even give a mortgage without this being resolved before sale?

The buyer is effectively buying a house they can't legally access and can't legally occupy. The road safery issue would be seen as being fundamental to planning, so for the buyer the breach of planning would start the day occupancy. Its a retention and apparently already in use with the current owners, so the council enforcement team would be watching and in communication but slow to bring a court action. This may not be the case with a new owner and the council would expect the buyer to comply before taking residence.

Banks have gotten burned in the past with planning issues and won't want to lend, and a right to access is just a big legal headache eg if repossessed will the grounds of the house contain the new access etc.
The other issue is even if the bank would lend, the value of the house has to be reduced down by the cost of the groundworks and other retension requirements so the buyer has to be able to finance this plus the deposit.

Glass fused light

Pkiernan wrote: »

It's disgraceful that a property is being sold with those conditions on it, and the EA doesn't know about them.

That work will not be cheap, and relocation of under and over dround lines will be very time consuming.

Its a bit of a jump for the OP to assume that the EA is not aware of the planning isues. Their job is to sell the property for the best price. Do they have any obligation to inform or advertise the legal issues on the property.
They may have discussed this with the seller and priced the house down to take account of the compliance cost. Or the seller is determined to ignore the EA's advice and had set a price

BryanF

Bcamp73 wrote: »

Advice need please.

I’ve just viewed a beautiful property, with stunning stone gateway with gates that access the drive, the front garden has been landscaped to a very high standard.

The owners applied for retention for the house and Gatrage last year, which was granted with 5 conditions.

The estate agent was not aware of the below conditions, we wanted to put in a offer but surely the planning issue will affect the property value. ).

Confirm if the planning is still active and seek extension of duration as a condition of any offer.

Get your eng to confirm approx cost (& feasibility) of compliance

As regards affecting cost of property - the market decides, and it’s a sellers market currently.

Lantus

Sounds like you are required to lay a new road section plus drainage which is yours to maintain and relocate a fence and possible power or telecoms line overhead?

Sounds expensive and will require engineers and a builder plus council fees no doubt!

Graces7

Thought public roads which at least some of this is, was the responsibility of the council? Though they may take some persuading.

I once lived a mile and more up a mountain lane that was all but impassable. The councill had always refused to fix it claiming it was a private road.

We challenged them on that ; suggested they might ask their advisors what would happen if eg an ambulance or fire engine were needed at my house.

The road got fixed and fast.

OP you need some specialist legal advice on this. I had backup/

Glass fused light

Graces7 wrote: »

Thought public roads which at least some of this is, was the responsibility of the council? Though they may take some persuading.

I once lived a mile and more up a mountain lane that was all but impassable. The councill had always refused to fix it claiming it was a private road.

We challenged them on that ; suggested they might ask their advisors what would happen if eg an ambulance or fire engine were needed at my house.

The road got fixed and fast.

OP you need some specialist legal advice on this. I had backup/

The OP is looking to buy a house which has to make changing the road frontage in order to comply with planning conditions.
The council have made grant of planning subject to all the conditions being complied with. If the home owner is not willing to make the change the council could take them to court and have the court enforce the changes.

If the OP buys the house the cost of the changes need to be factored into the purchase price.