Planning permission in Meath - already own property

Kilough

Hi,
I'm wondering what is the best approach to take when filling out a house planning app in the rural north Co. Meath area when already a house owner in the area? 
I would be looking for planning on a site on the family farm. I'm an active member of the area, have several family ties in the area, play GAA in the area, do some part time work on family farm etc. 

My problem is though that I'm already a house owner in a town nearby - 10 mins, 8km drive. Is there any way that I'd get permission anyway? If not, would I have to sell my house? Meaning that I'd have to rent for a year or two during the house selling, planning and building processes. Seems a bit harsh if that is the case. 

Anybody got any tips/tricks to get around this? 
Thanks :)

shivermetimber

I'm pretty sure I have seen that the local ties thing has been done away with or at least in the process of being removed.

the_syco

shivermetimber wrote: »

I'm pretty sure I have seen that the local ties thing has been done away with or at least in the process of being removed.

See it quite often around Kildare, but it's slowly going away.

Look at the land you're thinking of, and it'll usually says if it has the local needs rule, or not.

arctictree

Kilough wrote: »

Hi,
I'm wondering what is the best approach to take when filling out a house planning app in the rural north Co. Meath area when already a house owner in the area? 
I would be looking for planning on a site on the family farm. I'm an active member of the area, have several family ties in the area, play GAA in the area, do some part time work on family farm etc. 

My problem is though that I'm already a house owner in a town nearby - 10 mins, 8km drive. Is there any way that I'd get permission anyway? If not, would I have to sell my house? Meaning that I'd have to rent for a year or two during the house selling, planning and building processes. Seems a bit harsh if that is the case. 

Anybody got any tips/tricks to get around this? 
Thanks :)

Not sure about Meath but in Wicklow you must not own or never have owned a house (so selling and renting for a while will not work). One thing they request is a letter from Revenue saying that you have never claimed TRS on a mortgage.

Homer

Your situation is slightly different from the local needs rule as you are from the local area.. BUT you don't have a need as you already have a home and thats where your problem is! Not sure of a way around that but maybe somebody else here can advise.

arctictree

the_syco wrote: »

See it quite often around Kildare, but it's slowly going away.

Look at the land you're thinking of, and it'll usually says if it has the local needs rule, or not.

Old news. It was proposed to remove the locals only clause in the NPF but Pat Casey TD in Wickow got this overturned and looks like the clause is here to stay:

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wicklowpeople/news/casey-government-to-lift-rural-housing-restriction-36382027.html

Deputy Casey said: 'I have discussed the matter with senior department officials and I am pleased to confirm that they have taken on board my concerns and will leave the social clause in place for the new NPF. This is a major U-turn from the Government, which I welcome. It means that community life can be sustained in rural areas in the years ahead.

BryanF

OP in the eye of the local authority- You have house, and don’t have a housing need. Selling your house will not solve this.

Kilough

Thanks for the replies so far 
Doesn't look too positive. Might be worth speaking to a local solicitor on this. I'm sure there is some precedent
It's a shame as I think I'd easily meet local needs requirements apart from owning this property. I nearly should have held off buying in the first place. 
If anybody has any first hand experience or knows of any way around this, I'm all ears!

Graham

I'd be talking to a planning consultant/advisor before a solicitor but to be honest the only thing I expect them to tell you is you cannot demonstrate a local need as you already have a property.

the_syco

arctictree wrote: »

Old news. It was proposed to remove the locals only clause in the NPF but Pat Casey TD in Wickow got this overturned and looks like the clause is here to stay:

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wicklowpeople/news/casey-government-to-lift-rural-housing-restriction-36382027.html

I'm not so sure.

'Currently, a person from a rural community can apply for planning to build a home under a social clause which includes them wanting to live close to their own family members. The government wanted to bring an end to this by insisting that applicants had specific economic needs to live in a rural area in order for permission to be granted.

'This would have been a disaster for rural Ireland. I was the first TD to highlight this in the Dail and called on the Government to back down on its plan.

It seems that he has ensured those with social ties to the area can still get PP, rather than only economic reasons.

Deputy Casey said: 'I have discussed the matter with senior department officials and I am pleased to confirm that they have taken on board my concerns and will leave the social clause in place for the new NPF.

So from this, I see that having social ties to the area will allow them to build.

To the OP; if/when this goes through, as you have social ties to the area, this may allow you to get PP, but IANAL, so perhaps speak to a solicitor about you applying for PP under the social clause?

Kilough wrote: »

I would be looking for planning on a site on the family farm.

I actually missed this bit in the OP. Is there any house on the farm at the moment? I doubt you'd get hassle, as I'm sure a solicitor could argue that this won't be a "one off house", but rather a house on a farm.

db

Kilough wrote: »

Thanks for the replies so far 
Doesn't look too positive. Might be worth speaking to a local solicitor on this. I'm sure there is some precedent
It's a shame as I think I'd easily meet local needs requirements apart from owning this property. I nearly should have held off buying in the first place. 
If anybody has any first hand experience or knows of any way around this, I'm all ears!

There are basically two parts to the local needs requirement. The first is that you are local and you should be able to show that. The other is that you have a need to build where you hope to.

There are various ways to demonstrate this and just because you already have a house not too far away does not mean that you don't need to move. If your parents are isolated and will need someone nearby in the future to help out you would have a need for a house there. You may have outgrown your existing house and need more space, eg if you currently only have two bedrooms and have 3 children.