Master Score Board - Access Removed

Golf 247

Hello, we had an issue recently whereby the results of our weekly competition were published on the clubs weekly newsletter via e mail as would be standard. Two players tied and the result was determined on count back but the newsletter stated the incorrect winner i.e. the person with 16 points for his back 9. Master Score Board listed the correct winner as the guy with 18 points BB9.

When the club was contacted to rectify a simple mistake, the very next day the club contacted Master Score Board requesting they delete the entire database of clubs results and withdraw from using the site.

In the weeks that have passed our only access to the competition result is the weekly newsletter we get by e mail which only states those who came 1st, 2nd and 3rd.

Having requested the club restore the Masterscoreboard website, they have refused point blank to do so stating the majority of players dont want their poor scores published (no vote was taken). Now members have no access to the full competition result and no certainty that more manual mistakes will be avoided.

This is a small club with a small pool of senior members who seem to care little with how our results system is managed. Is there any governance issues here or concerns that makes this a serious issue? Or does one simply just walk away from the club and let them be?

slingerz

That sounds absolutely baffling. I cannot see how any competitions secretary would not want such a platform available to them

GreeBo

slingerz wrote: »

That sounds absolutely baffling. I cannot see how any competitions secretary would not want such a platform available to them

I'm sure they are still using handicap master and just pushing to Masters Scoreboard...otherwise Masters site would also have been wrong.

Hate to say it but it sounds dodgy to me.

Golf 247

GreeBo wrote: »

I'm sure they are still using handicap master and just pushing to Masters Scoreboard...otherwise Masters site would also have been wrong.

Hate to say it but it sounds dodgy to me.

He manually reviews the cards. Masters site was 100% correct. I dont think he realised the scores were published online.

GreeBo

Golf 247 wrote: »

He manually reviews the cards. Masters site was 100% correct. I dont think he realised the scores were published online.

He might manually review the cards for errors (as they are supposed to)
But someone is entering the scores into a computer otherwise they cannot get to master scoreboard.

Golf 247

GreeBo wrote: »

He might manually review the cards for errors (as they are supposed to)
But someone is entering the scores into a computer otherwise they cannot get to master scoreboard.

Correct, yes I am with you, understand how it works but now the link to Master has been withdrawn. Prior to its deletion, there was a mistake made either purposefully (possibly not been fully aware Master was publicly available) or it was a simple mistake. The reaction makes me think it wasnt the latter.

The cynic in me needs to stop thinking he called a new member as the winner over a consistent player who consistently plays to his handicap.

Seve OB

doesn't make sense really.
was the result changed and the correct winner announced?

Golf 247

Seve OB wrote: »

doesn't make sense really.
was the result changed and the correct winner announced?

Yes, the following week he rectified the decision and announced the correct winner on his newsletter. But the day after the competition he contacted Master Score Board and deleted the profile so we can no longer check on the full competition result.

Seve OB

Golf 247 wrote: »

Yes, the following week he rectified the decision and announced the correct winner on his newsletter. But the day after the competition he contacted Master Score Board and deleted the profile so we can no longer check on the full competition result.

well once they corrected the error, that is most important.

as regards an obligation of having to publish full results.... I dont think there is one.

I know in our club, we dont even use the computer for non qualifying rounds, so there is nearly half the year without full results. then there are times when they dont actually click the button to publish the results (though that used to be a lot, its rare now)

im sure the clubs probably have to pay master scoreboard or howdidido or whoever is the relevant publisher for their services, so it might just be a cost cutting measure

i wouldn't worry to much about it tbh

Kingswood Rover

All gui club comps should be published by the clubs and everyone should be able to see them. I reckon the cost per annum might be the real issue. Its about 1000 euro a year for Masterscoreboard not inconsequential for a small club.

Golfgraffix

Kingswood Rover wrote: »

All gui club comps should be published by the clubs and everyone should be able to see them. I reckon the cost per annum might be the real issue. Its about 1000 euro a year for Masterscoreboard not inconsequential for a small club.

As a handicap sec i think it’s the best software out there for competition and handicapping, I’m pretty sure it’s no more than €400 per year for their top end network product.

They have a number of ways of keeping the results only available to club members. You can have a site wide password or individual paswords.

Poker Face

Kingswood Rover wrote: »

All gui club comps should be published by the clubs and everyone should be able to see them. I reckon the cost per annum might be the real issue. Its about 1000 euro a year for Masterscoreboard not inconsequential for a small club.

We use HandicapMaster in our club. It cost us €295 last month to renew the licence for 12 months. This also includes masterscoreboard. Our is password protected as we also use it for members to book into competitions. Its an excellent product for less than 25 Euro a month

Golf 247

Seve OB wrote: »

well once they corrected the error, that is most important.

as regards an obligation of having to publish full results.... I dont think there is one.

I know in our club, we dont even use the computer for non qualifying rounds, so there is nearly half the year without full results. then there are times when they dont actually click the button to publish the results (though that used to be a lot, its rare now)

im sure the clubs probably have to pay master scoreboard or howdidido or whoever is the relevant publisher for their services, so it might just be a cost cutting measure

i wouldn't worry to much about it tbh

What if the error occurs again? It won’t be corrected. Where is the transparency?

It’s definitly not a cost cutting measure. The decision to take down access came within 12 hours of the mistake been highlighted. Hardly coincidental not to raise eyebrows. Does it not smack of red mist at been caught out fudging a competition result?

GreeBo

Golf 247 wrote: »

What if the error occurs again? It won’t be corrected. Where is the transparency?

It’s definitly not a cost cutting measure. The decision to take down access came within 12 hours of the mistake been highlighted. Hardly coincidental not to raise eyebrows. Does it not smack of red mist at been caught out fudging a competition result?

Are your competition results posted "by hand" somewhere or is it a cut and paste from the Competitions software?

I'd ask that the results are taken "as-is" and available somewhere.
If using HandicapMaster for example you just print off as many pages as you want from first to last.

kopkidda

Golf 247 wrote: »

What if the error occurs again? It won’t be corrected. Where is the transparency?

It’s definitly not a cost cutting measure. The decision to take down access came within 12 hours of the mistake been highlighted. Hardly coincidental not to raise eyebrows. Does it not smack of red mist at been caught out fudging a competition result?

Not transparent at all, that is the worrying thing.

Seve OB

Golf 247 wrote: »

What if the error occurs again? It won’t be corrected. Where is the transparency?

It’s definitly not a cost cutting measure. The decision to take down access came within 12 hours of the mistake been highlighted. Hardly coincidental not to raise eyebrows. Does it not smack of red mist at been caught out fudging a competition result?

not so long ago, all clubs ever did was post prize winners.
if you feel a score needs to be questioned, you can ask.

i don't understand why they wont post the results, but they really don't have to if they dont want to. but i wouldnt take that as a chance for them to cover up mistakes

prawnsambo

Seve OB wrote: »

not so long ago, all clubs ever did was post prize winners.
if you feel a score needs to be questioned, you can ask.

i don't understand why they wont post the results, but they really don't have to if they dont want to. but i wouldnt take that as a chance for them to cover up mistakes

It's not just the scores though. Master Scoreboard is a very useful piece of software that allows you look at your handicap progression and a lot of extra info on competitions and even your hole by hole analysis. I'd be very annoyed if I lost access to all that.

Edit: you may already know all this, just felt it needed to be said.

Seve OB

prawnsambo wrote: »

It's not just the scores though. Master Scoreboard is a very useful piece of software that allows you look at your handicap progression and a lot of extra info on competitions and even your hole by hole analysis. I'd be very annoyed if I lost access to all that.

Edit: you may already know all this, just felt it needed to be said.

yea i know all that and agree is is a nice thing to have.
but its a bonus and you don't pay for it, so really up to the club.

incidentally and i only really discovered lately that soooo many golfers dont ever look at golfnet. but golfnet is THE BEST place to review your handicap progression. that will still be there.

prawnsambo

Seve OB wrote: »

yea i know all that and agree is is a nice thing to have.
but its a bonus and you don't pay for it, so really up to the club.

incidentally and i only really discovered lately that soooo many golfers dont ever look at golfnet. but golfnet is THE BEST place to review your handicap progression. that will still be there.

Yeah. I've used Golfnet and it is very good. But within the club, Master Scoreboard gives you a lot of info in one place.

Funny enough, it was through Master Scoreboard that I researched my club before joining it. I know some clubs don't open up their results, but mine does.

kopkidda

A club that doesn't publish its results for public consumption in this day and age, surely is trying to hide something.

elbagarihno

kopkidda wrote: »

A club that doesn't publish its results for public consumption in this day and age, surely is trying to hide something.

Totally agree, there is absolutely no reason not to publish results, whether is on HowDidiDo, Master Scoreboard or wherever.

prawnsambo

elbagarihno wrote: »

Totally agree, there is absolutely no reason not to publish results, whether is on HowDidiDo, Master Scoreboard or wherever.

Not sure about that. We're in the days of GDPR now, so personal information is not something you'd publish without having a long think about it. Granted, somebody's name, handicap and scores in competitions would not on the face of it look like terribly personal information, but at the same time, it gives information on the movements of that person and could help build up an information bank to target them. At the very least, whether that infromation can be published or not should be at the discretion of the member, not the club.

elbagarihno

prawnsambo wrote: »

Not sure about that. We're in the days of GDPR now, so personal information is not something you'd publish without having a long think about it. Granted, somebody's name, handicap and scores in competitions would not on the face of it look like terribly personal information, but at the same time, it gives information on the movements of that person and could help build up an information bank to target them. At the very least, whether that infromation can be published or not should be at the discretion of the member, not the club.

Fair point, but GDPR is slightly off-topic in this scenario as the club has unilaterally removed all results and handicap information.

I do agree with your point however and systems must, if they don't already, allow an individual block their information from being published and if requested, remove or redact previously published records.

EDIT: In an effort to clarify my earlier point and bring us back on-topic, a club that chooses not to publish it's full results, even privately within it's own membership, clearly has something to hide.

prawnsambo

elbagarihno wrote: »

Fair point, but GDPR is slightly off-topic in this scenario as the club has unilaterally removed all results and handicap information.

I do agree with your point however and systems must, if they don't already, allow an individual block their information from being published and if requested, remove or redact previously published records.

EDIT: In an effort to clarify my earlier point and bring us back on-topic, a club that chooses not to publish it's full results, even privately within it's own membership, clearly has something to hide.

Well yes, I agree it's a bit off-topic, but it's interesting to note that the OP was posted a few days before the GDPR deadline.

elbagarihno

prawnsambo wrote: »

Well yes, I agree it's a bit off-topic, but it's interesting to note that the OP was posted a few days before the GDPR deadline.

Yeah, only just realised how old the OP was, really should have taken note.

morrga

prawnsambo wrote: »

Not sure about that. We're in the days of GDPR now, so personal information is not something you'd publish without having a long think about it. Granted, somebody's name, handicap and scores in competitions would not on the face of it look like terribly personal information, but at the same time, it gives information on the movements of that person and could help build up an information bank to target them. At the very least, whether that infromation can be published or not should be at the discretion of the member, not the club.

GDPR is specifically about publishing details that can identify you or where you live etc. Your golf score doesn't breach either concept.

slave1

Is it?
Would have thought it was about a more comprehensive explanatio nof how your data is being stored and used coupled with significantly easier and timed personal data request i.e. it’s free now and co. has 28 days to provide requested data.

slave1

So given that the golf club would need your expressed permission to publish your data, in this instance your score.
Mad as it seems.....someone says no to publishing their name and score details then what to do....

GreeBo

morrga wrote: »

GDPR is specifically about publishing details that can identify you or where you live etc. Your golf score doesn't breach either concept.

I don't think its in any way specifically tied to where you live.

elbagarihno

slave1 wrote: »

So given that the golf club would need your expressed permission to publish your data, in this instance your score.
Mad as it seems.....someone says no to publishing their name and score details then what to do....

I don't know, there are options in our system to withhold members from HowDidiDo etc, but I have no idea how that would work in practice.