What type of replacement bottom bracket is needed ?

harringtonp

I have a Rose Xeon CW 300 frame and the original spec said

"BB386 Press-fit BB"

I have attached photos of what is currently in it. It was replaced once since getting the bike in 2013 but I am not sure if the replacement BB was the same as the original (though if worked fine)

The crankset spindle with is 24mm.

Could somebody who knows about these things put up a link to what they think would be a suitable replacement BB ?

Thanks Paul.

Plastik

That looks like an FSA PF30 bottom bracket with some sort of FSA reducer cup that sits into the BB30 bearing so that you can accomodate the 24mm axle. You can clean that up and reuse it with the new PF30 BB.

clog

The Rose frames I have seen all accept a standard shimano press fit bb such as this


http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/shimano-bb92-road-press-fit-bottom-bracket/rp-prod44226?gs=1&sku=sku154965IE&pgrid=52809683896&ptaid=pla-426435598285&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campaign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=mkwid|scsPeDr56_dc|pcrid|253475950071|pkw||pmt||prd|154965IE

(the older version of this had the model number BB86)

I wonder that when the bb was replaced a BB30 diameter suitable press fit was installed with adapters to bring diameter back down. Work that wouldn't have been needed if Shimano press fit 24mm was fitted.

harringtonp

Plastik wrote: »

That looks like an FSA PF30 bottom bracket with some sort of FSA reducer cup that sits into the BB30 bearing so that you can accomodate the 24mm axle. You can clean that up and reuse it with the new PF30 BB.

Thanks for this. I presume so that

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/fsa-pf30-road-bottom-bracket/rp-prod117849

should work. And if I want to buy new BB reducers then

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/fsa-bb392evo-24-reducer-ee084-/rp-prod129799

would be the ones ???

As I don't see my myself running anything other than a 24mm spindles, do you know if it is likely that I could also fit something like

https://www.rosebikes.com/shimano-ultegra-sm-bb72-pressfit-86-bottom-bracket-cups-675755 ?

harringtonp

clog wrote: »

The Rose frames I have seen all accept a standard shimano press fit bb such as this


http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/shimano-bb92-road-press-fit-bottom-bracket/rp-prod44226?gs=1&sku=sku154965IE&pgrid=52809683896&ptaid=pla-426435598285&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campaign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=mkwid|scsPeDr56_dc|pcrid|253475950071|pkw||pmt||prd|154965IE

(the older version of this had the model number BB86)

I wonder that when the bb was replaced a BB30 diameter suitable press fit was installed with adapters to bring diameter back down. Work that wouldn't have been needed if Shimano press fit 24mm was fitted.

Only seeing this now. The bike came with a Ultegra 6700 crankset with a 24mm spindle diameter so a BB like you linked to could well have been originally in it. I do vaguely remember the wrong BB being ordered initially in the LBS. Then again Rose may have shipped it with the reducer in place, I cannot remember.

Anyway if you are reasonably confident that the Shimano BB92 would work that would be my preferred option as the reducers have fallen out before (and could be lost) when I change cranksets. And I change them quite a bit as I swap a Power2Max powermeter between 2 bikes

I gather the BB72 that I linked to above and which is cheaper would not work so ? I cannot figure the difference between BB72 and BB92

CrowdedHouse

harringtonp wrote: »

I gather the BB72 that I linked to above and which is cheaper would not work so ? I cannot figure the difference between BB72 and BB92

As I understand it the BB72 is the Ultegra level and the 92 is Dura Ace, dimensions the same.

clog

CrowdedHouse wrote: »

As I understand it the BB72 is the Ultegra level and the 92 is Dura Ace, dimensions the same.

Yes this is right, BB72 should work as well. Just after looking at an old Rose catalogue (they used to send out a massive catalogue every year). The specs given for the xeon range were shimano press fit. They didn't seem to go for the more exotic standard.

You could email Rose or knock the FSA cups out and measure diameter to be sure of fit.

harringtonp

clog wrote: »

Yes this is right, BB72 should work as well. Just after looking at an old Rose catalogue (they used to send out a massive catalogue every year). The specs given for the xeon range were shimano press fit. They didn't seem to go for the more exotic standard.

You could email Rose or knock the FSA cups out and measure diameter to be sure of fit.

I emailed Rose as I don't have the tools to knock the cups out (and would prefer not do it anyway until I have the replacement as the bike is still rideable) and they came back with an offer of engagement for:

"Qty. Item no. Product description Unit price Total price
1 1879984 FSA - Innenlager ROAD Press Fit 30 Alloy BB-PF6000/CZ/Di2
Product is sold out
43,60 EUR 43,60 EUR
1 Shipping costs
8,95 EUR 8,95 EUR
Total amount 52,55 EUR"

They cannot send a link to the BB for viewing as it is not up on their web shop and tbh this description does not mean a lot to me.

So the question now is, is there anything in the above offer description to suggest that my LBS would not be able to fit

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/shimano-bb92-road-press-fit-bottom-bracket/rp-prod44226

If it turns out not to be right I can still use CRC returns so it wouldn't be the worst case in the world. And if it is right, I can hopefully arrange with my mechanic to fit it there and then.

clog

The bottom bracket quoted by Rose for this bike suggests that the shell diameter is 46mm. In that case a bottom bracket such as this would be needed.


http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/rotor-pf46-steel-road-bottom-bracket/rp-prod130572

Other bb's and adapters could also be used.

The Shimano bb is for a 41mm shell diameter.

Paul_Mc1988

Posted in the maintenance thread but got no reply and it seems like people in here are good with BBs. I have a 2017 giant propel with shimano 105. On the giant website it says shimano BB-RS500 PRESS FIT. Wouldnt mind upgrading to something better if im replacing and its creaking is getting annoying.

clog

Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »

Posted in the maintenance thread but got no reply and it seems like people in here are good with BBs. I have a 2017 giant propel with shimano 105. On the giant website it says shimano BB-RS500 PRESS FIT. Wouldnt mind upgrading to something better if im replacing and its creaking is getting annoying.

The shimano press fit is definitely the right one for this bike. The code on the old one was for a non-series (105/Ultegra level) BB.


http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/shimano-bb92-road-press-fit-bottom-bracket/rp-prod44226?gs=1&sku=sku154965IE&pgrid=52809683896&ptaid=pla-426435598285&utm_source=google&utm_term=&utm_campaign=PLA+All+Products&utm_medium=base&utm_content=mkwid|scsPeDr56_dc|pcrid|253475950071|pkw||pmt||prd|154965IE

Paul_Mc1988

clog wrote:

The shimano press fit is definitely the right one for this bike. The code on the old one was for a non-series (105/Ultegra level) BB.

Thanks for the help. Now to start watching a few videos on how to put it in.

harringtonp

clog wrote: »

The bottom bracket quoted by Rose for this bike suggests that the shell diameter is 46mm. In that case a bottom bracket such as this would be needed.


http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/rotor-pf46-steel-road-bottom-bracket/rp-prod130572

Other bb's and adapters could also be used.

The Shimano bb is for a 41mm shell diameter.

Apologies for bothering you again, Rose got back saying

"sorry, but the Shimano bottom brackets are not compatible to the Xeon CW."

which as you say suggest the 46mm diameter. I'm not sure how exactly shell diameters should be measured but from the attached images where I removed the reducer for the 24mm crankset (see bb2.jpg) it looks as if the width may be 42mm.... Which makes me wonder am I getting correct information from Rose.

Does it look like a 41/42 or 46 diameter to you ? The width of the frame is 86mm by the way.

clog

From the photos I would say that the shell is indeed 46mm (42mm on 2nd pic +2x2mm cup).

2 options then , You can either get an complete bottom bracket that spaces down to the 24 mm shimano crank size. Such as the rotor one here

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/rotor-pf46-steel-road-bottom-bracket/rp-prod130572

Or you could just replace with the same FSA bottom bracket and then use reducer cups to bring the diameter down.


I find that the Rotor solution is the most trouble free and less prone to wear and creaking. It is also possible to replace the bearings alone in this bottom bracket if needed in the future.

harringtonp

clog wrote: »

From the photos I would say that the shell is indeed 46mm (42mm on 2nd pic +2x2mm cup).

2 options then , You can either get an complete bottom bracket that spaces down to the 24 mm shimano crank size. Such as the rotor one here

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/rotor-pf46-steel-road-bottom-bracket/rp-prod130572

Or you could just replace with the same FSA bottom bracket and then use reducer cups to bring the diameter down.


I find that the Rotor solution is the most trouble free and less prone to wear and creaking. It is also possible to replace the bearings alone in this bottom bracket if needed in the future.

OK thanks, the 42+2+2 makes some sense in showing I have a 46mm shell diameter. However looking at the

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/rotor-pf46-steel-road-bottom-bracket/rp-prod130572

you linked to, the widest point is not at the edges and it looks as if it is intended for narrower BB's with the bearings outside the frame. With the Rose Xeon CW the BB is contained completely within the frame and the crankset flush against it so would

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/rotor-pf46-evo386-steel-bottom-bracket/rp-prod130579

not be the rotor option to go for as it is intended for 86mm frames ?

clog

Sorry missed the part when you said frame width was 86mm earlier. You are completely correct it would be the 386 evo version needed.

harringtonp

clog wrote: »

Sorry missed the part when you said frame width was 86mm earlier. You are completely correct it would be the 386 evo version needed.

Thanks. Ordered the Rotor BB.

harringtonp

clog wrote: »

Sorry missed the part when you said frame width was 86mm earlier. You are completely correct it would be the 386 evo version needed.

This arrived in work this morning and taking a good look at it. I have identified the bearings and as soon as it is fitted and seen to be running fine I plan on buying a replacement set at

https://www.bearing-king.co.uk/bearing/mr2437-llb-enduro-bearing-abec-3/17126

I pushed gently on the bearings and they are not budging. I don't want to mess around with the unit but I presume that with a good firm tap they should pop out ?

Also in addition to the rubber O rings for the axle, there are 2 other larger stiff plastic rings included and there is no mention of these in the instructions that came with it (see photo). Any idea what these might be for ?

And one last question, the instructions mention applying a thin coating of a retaining compound such as loctite 641 to the outside of the cup, is this usually something that is necessary and what happens if it is not applied ?