Jeep fire/total loss/advice

amacca

Just looking for some general advice.

A jeep of mine (popular well known german make) went on fire while driving it.

Its a total loss.....was doe'd etc, was thinking of and am in the process of claiming off insurance but its pissing me off my no claims bonus will be affected and I'll be paying higher premiums next year for something that is not my fault. Theres stepback on the policy but its still going to cost me...I had 10 and well over ten years no claims on all my motor policies.

Do I have any recourse to the manufacturer and if I did how would I go about dealing with them? its not been part of a recall but a friend mentioned he knew of someone compensated for an electrical fire in a newer model by the manufacturer + there there seem to be a surprising number of instances of something similar happening with models from the same manufacturer my year and older when I researched it.

IMO I have a right to expect that vehicles etc shouldn't just burst into flames under normal use, do I have any comeback or is it a case of suck it up?

Spook_ie

amacca wrote: »

Just looking for some general advice.

A jeep of mine (popular well known german make) went on fire while driving it.

Its a total loss.....was doe'd etc, was thinking of and am in the process of claiming off insurance but its pissing me off my no claims bonus will be affected and I'll be paying higher premiums next year for something that is not my fault. Theres stepback on the policy but its still going to cost me...I had 10 and well over ten years no claims on all my motor policies.

Do I have any recourse to the manufacturer and if I did how would I go about dealing with them? its not been part of a recall but a friend mentioned he knew of someone compensated for an electrical fire in a newer model by the manufacturer + there there seem to be a surprising number of instances of something similar happening with models from the same manufacturer my year and older when I researched it.

IMO I have a right to expect that vehicles etc shouldn't just burst into flames under normal use, do I have any comeback or is it a case of suck it up?

Depends on your policy, some policies don't affect NCB for vehicle fires.
https://www.axa.ie/help/question/what-claims-do-not-affect-no-dlaims-discount/

amacca

Spook_ie wrote: »

Depends on your policy, some policies don't affect NCB for vehicle fires.
https://www.axa.ie/help/question/what-claims-do-not-affect-no-dlaims-discount/

Thanks for that...I think policy states any claim....I'm finding it hard to figure out exactly what outcome will be from wording of policy tbh....I've defaulted to I probably get screwed. But I will put aside the pessimism and try and figure out exactly what the outcome should be.

My question though was really more about the possibility of avoiding the insurance claim at all and claiming off the manufacturer for faulty vehicle or claiming compensation for the increased premiums due to loss of no claims bonus.

Just wondering if anyone has gone that route in my situation.

Atlantic Dawn

I'd say if you had a full service history with the manufacturer or have proof that only genuine parts were going in to it at recommended service intervals it would help your case if it was a defect from when it was manufactured.

Have you looked online to see if there are similar cases of them going on fire? You should try to get an engineer/investigator to determine the cause of the fire in your vehicle.

Jimmy Dags

Hide the matches and petrol well anyway.

amacca

Jimmy Dags wrote: »

Hide the matches and petrol well anyway.

It was a diesel.

Thanks for the input though, sound.

amacca

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

I'd say if you had a full service history with the manufacturer or have proof that only genuine parts were going in to it at recommended service intervals it would help your case if it was a defect from when it was manufactured.

Have you looked online to see if there are similar cases of them going on fire? You should try to get an engineer/investigator to determine the cause of the fire in your vehicle.

It got a yearly service with mechanic and was put through a DOE yearly. I have no idea what parts the mechanic put into it (don't know if they were official parts etc) but it wasn't serviced at an official dealership. Anything that needed doing was done. The usual oil and filter etc, got an exhaust manifold one year, new brake discs another etc. Ironically it was running fine right up until it went on fire. I'd had it for years and was quite happy with it. The same mechanic serviced another jeep of mine for years with zero issues.

Its only now that I've looked online I'm seeing similar cases of that manufacturers vehicles going on fire.........much newer, older and same year, some same models, some cars, some jeeps. Some of the causes don't seem to be the same....i.e some of them went due to electrical wiring from the battery and seemed to burn from the back, mine started burning up front and thankfully it was put out before it reached the tank at the back.....engine was running fine though when the smoke appeared which suggests to me it was something electrical or at least the engine block did not seem to catch fire. There was a loss of power to wheels as I was driving along even though it was in gear but engine continued to rev normally. I though maybe the gear box but fire definitely started up front.......

Some of the descriptions online are worrying, cars left parked for ages going up some in apartment building underground car parks etc....I suppose I'm wondering if anyone else was in the same boat here and what did they do?

Toyotafanboi

There are a few things you need to consider if you are going to go up against the manufacturer on this. I'd also consider that if you Google pretty much any make and model of car you can think of going on fire, you will get results so I wouldn't use that as any kind of benchmark, although admittedly some makes/ models are more prone than others.

Is the car still under manufacturers warranty? If not, how far is it out? How much is the car worth and is it worth the cost to pursue?

It'll be up to you to prove it is a manufacturing defect not for them to prove that it isn't to get the wheels in motion if the car is not under manufacturers warranty. A full service history from a main dealer would help as their level of inspection upon servicing wouldn't be called into question and the provenance of the car is clear.

At present you don't know (I take it) that it was an electrical fire as opposed to a fluid/ fuel leak, or unknown external influence like a bird's nest in the engine bay, mice chewing your wiring, a paper bag getting caught in the engine bay etc but at the very minimum I'd be getting an opinion on this from a motor assessor. If he finds a bbq'd mouse then at least you know and if he doesn't then you know you have at least a leg to stand on.

If unknown external influence has been ruled out, has the car had any changes electrically away from standard? Towing socket? Replacement head unit? Even a phone charger in the 12v socket? Has it had any work on the fuel or exhaust system that may not comply with the manufacturers standard? What way was your exhaust manifold repaired?

There are all things you'd need to look at to have your ducks in a row before you approach the manufacturer because they won't be long about shooting you down if they can spot any loopholes if they do go so far as to inspect the car.

redcup342

amacca wrote: »

It got a yearly service with mechanic and was put through a DOE yearly. I have no idea what parts the mechanic put into it (don't know if they were official parts etc) but it wasn't serviced at an official dealership. Anything that needed doing was done. The usual oil and filter etc, got an exhaust manifold one year, new brake discs another etc. Ironically it was running fine right up until it went on fire. I'd had it for years and was quite happy with it. The same mechanic serviced another jeep of mine for years with zero issues.

Its only now that I've looked online I'm seeing similar cases of that manufacturers vehicles going on fire.........much newer, older and same year, some same models, some cars, some jeeps. Some of the causes don't seem to be the same....i.e some of them went due to electrical wiring from the battery and seemed to burn from the back, mine started burning up front and thankfully it was put out before it reached the tank at the back.....engine was running fine though when the smoke appeared which suggests to me it was something electrical or at least the engine block did not seem to catch fire. There was a loss of power to wheels as I was driving along even though it was in gear but engine continued to rev normally. I though maybe the gear box but fire definitely started up front.......

Some of the descriptions online are worrying, cars left parked for ages going up some in apartment building underground car parks etc....I suppose I'm wondering if anyone else was in the same boat here and what did they do?

Think your first port of call would be to get an engineers report on the cause of the fire.

Could be anything, e.g. battery short due to missing cover that ignited oil/fuel on the engine block.

VeVeX

redcup342 wrote: »

Could be anything, e.g. battery short due to missing cover that ignited oil/fuel on the engine block.

The fire being caused by a dragon is more likely than that leap of imagination.

amacca

Never did anything like this before....are there many reputable assessors or firms etc that carry out this sort of work, what kind of cost would be associated with this?


Its not main dealer serviced, well out of warranty, I have no idea how the manifold was replaced, I went with my mechanic (so indy service).......the following would not be unusual for any 4x4 Ive had and they never burst into flames without warning............hes been servicing jeeps etc for me well over 10 years without issue, id be more inclined to blame the vehicle tbh........

Point taken regarding finding back up for anything you might type into google but I also know of a couple of people who have had experiences with this make involving fire...although due to what I suspect is a different cause.......with one fire started in boot due to faulty electrical connections- so I think thats different from my experience - interestingly that exact cause is backed up online also

It had a towing socket that worked fine since Ive had it - As it was bought second hand I don't know how or when it was installed.

testicles

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amacca

Fair enough so. I'll swallow another cost.

It wasn't part of a recall but given the number of them it seems to have happened to I think it should've been. I doubt I'll ever buy that brand again.

Toyotafanboi

There's really nothing at this point to suggest that it's a manufacturing defect other the fact that you want it to be.

If you aren't pursuing it, at least give us some details, make and model etc, stop us all wondering.

_Brian

Sorry I can’t see anywhere the year of the jeep.
How far exactly is it out of warranty??

redcup342

VeVeX wrote: »

The fire being caused by a dragon is more likely than that leap of imagination.

You'd be surprised, lazy servicing, e.g. they break the battery cover or forget to put it back on.

Combine that with taking short cuts when changing oil filters or moving fuel lines and it can happen

richardsheil

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

There's really nothing at this point to suggest that it's a manufacturing defect other the fact that you want it to be.

If you aren't pursuing it, at least give us some details, make and model etc, stop us all wondering.

It's a Jeep he said. Oh wait. Not actually a Jeep- some other form of 4x4,

Eric Cartman

power steering hoses are a service interval item in many vehicles but nobody pays attention till they're leaking, a few times manufacturers have skirted this one when one leaks PS fluid onto the hot side of a turbo and the car goes up.

shamrock55

What make of car is it

zapata

My 1st guess is a Renault Scenic jeep :rolleyes: They burn quite often.
http://www.jeremybarnett.co.uk/renault-scenics-burst-into-flames

2nd guess would be a Zafira jeep :rolleyes::rolleyes:
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/vauxhall/zafira/93176/vauxhall-zafira-fires-manufacturer-facing-a-criminal-investigation

and so on.....

amacca

_Brian wrote: »

Sorry I can’t see anywhere the year of the jeep.
How far exactly is it out of warranty??

2006 I assume it was a long way out of warranty.

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

There's really nothing at this point to suggest that it's a manufacturing defect other the fact that you want it to be.

Bit harsh.....I think it could easily be a manufacturing defect......no other vehicle I've ever had almost spontaneously combusted, no other vehicle anybody else in my family has had had burst into flames with or without prior warning...my brother has a farm only pajero that hasn't seen an oil change/service or an ounce of mechanical sympathy since it was taken off the road and it has so far avoided anything other than looking a bomb hit it and every bird in the place shat on it....I see similar beaters like hiluxes, land cruisers etc around the locality and they also have managed not to catch fire.

Mine did about 20k a year (a lot less some years), got its service and was treated well imo, was DOE'd and was asked to tow a relatively modest trailer/load (below its rated capacity) approx ten times a year and managed to burn to a crisp without any obvious prior warning signs....although in fairness it performed pretty much flawlessly for years before that.

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

If you aren't pursuing it, at least give us some details, make and model etc, stop us all wondering.

I would pursue it if I thought it wouldn't cost me a lot of time and money with very little chance of success...I'd think there might be a benefit for more than just me if I did in that whatever defect/s cause this to happen may be eliminated in future models although I'm prepared to admit it wouldn't be for altruistic reasons I'd be doing it.......more that I don't like having to pay for something that I'm not at all sure is my fault.

So I suppose thats all irrelevant now...didnt mean to keep anyone in suspense really, just didn't want to come in attacking a brand when it was just general advice on the situation I was looking for, in any event it was a BMW X5.

wonski

testicles wrote: »

Way out of warranty, no service history to speak of. You're on your own...

So products out of warranty without full service history can burn now? I would be pretty worried if this has happened to me.

I think the op deserves for the car to be checked.

There is a recent BMW recall going back to 2008, somehow those drivers are not on their own now.

You never know. This must be reported anyway.
Could be a once off, could be another recall.

Spook_ie

amacca wrote: »

2006 I assume it was a long way out of warranty.



Bit harsh.....I think it could easily be a manufacturing defect......no other vehicle I've ever had almost spontaneously combusted, no other vehicle anybody else in my family has had had burst into flames with or without prior warning...my brother has a farm only pajero that hasn't seen an oil change/service or an ounce of mechanical sympathy since it was taken off the road and it has so far avoided anything other than looking a bomb hit it and every bird in the place shat on it....I see similar beaters like hiluxes, land cruisers etc around the locality and they also have managed not to catch fire.

Mine did about 20k a year (a lot less some years), got its service and was treated well imo, was DOE'd and was asked to tow a relatively modest trailer/load (below its rated capacity) approx ten times a year and managed to burn to a crisp without any obvious prior warning signs....although in fairness it performed pretty much flawlessly for years before that.



I would pursue it if I thought it wouldn't cost me a lot of time and money with very little chance of success...I'd think there might be a benefit for more than just me if I did in that whatever defect/s cause this to happen may be eliminated in future models although I'm prepared to admit it wouldn't be for altruistic reasons I'd be doing it.......more that I don't like having to pay for something that I'm not at all sure is my fault.

So I suppose thats all irrelevant now...didnt mean to keep anyone in suspense really, just didn't want to come in attacking a brand when it was just general advice on the situation I was looking for, in any event it was a BMW X5.

There's your problem, BMW Burns Mighty Well

As to recalls the USA's X5 was subject to a recall for wiring problems
http://autoweek.com/article/recalls/bmw-recalls-1-million-vehicles

jeepcj

If its a 2006 jeep its probably not worth claiming. I had a 1994 pajero go up in flames, I claimed off insurance, by the time I paid the excess, the storage fees (yes the towing company charged me 75 euro a day storage fees which insurance does not cover) I didn't end up with much. You will probably lose 3 years of your no claims bonus as well as they will put a loading on your renewal premium. Its all a big scam

shamrock55

I've seen a 2018 Irish car of the year go up in flames so it does happen

testicles

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mickdw

You are looking at spending easily more than the value of the jeep chasing this through courts so not worth the hassle under any circumstances. Given that its quite old and of unknown history (as far as manufacturer is concerned), they wont entertain any liability.

I read of a case where someone spent 30k taking audi to court over a TT that didn't drive as expected. This was a car that was nearly new. Audi won

You are insured, that is what its for. Get your payout and move on.

wonski

testicles wrote: »

They can, funnily enough products in warranty and with full service history can also burn. :Rolleyes:

Of course they can, but this type of incident must be reported to the manufacturer regardless of age or service history.

_Brian

With a 2006 jeep its hard to see where to go...


You could go back to the maker but honestly i dont expect they will give much hearing at all... full service history is fine if it has it but that doesnt mean some bodge wasnt done somewhere inbetween but owner or someone else..


You could get an independant engineer to look at it but what do you expect will the outcome be ?? They won't give you a 100% answer on the exact specific cause of the fire, even if they do ?? Say its an electrical fire starting in a fusebox under the bonnet - this could have been left unclipped by accident sometime over the last few years and damp eventually caused a fire, or any other number of potential causes in the same area..


Draw a line under the problem and move on.. You could let yourself be consumed by this and get nowhere... No one was hurt and a car is a car, easily replaced..

Trasna1

Lads, it's not a Jeep. It's a mid size BMW SUV.

I don't know why this bothers me.

amacca

Trasna1 wrote: »

Lads, it's not a Jeep. It's a mid size BMW SUV.

I don't know why this bothers me.

Round our way anything that's 4x4 has a tow bar, isn't either a tractor, station wagon or car is by default known as a jeep

If it's an actual jeep (and not a willys one) then it's a jeep Cherokee or a jeep grand Cherokee....and you are deemed to be mad in the head if you have a jeep wrangler...and anyone that uses the term suv may not even know what it stands for... ..just one the many things that adds to the rustic charm of the place.

Point taken re chasing manufacturer, i thought as much tbh ....it wasn't part of a recall so that's pretty much it. Insurance co now want assessor to find cause so at least I'll know what started it.